EK A380 Massive Sideways Landing

[Flying Fox]

Im not a nervous flyer but if I was in the last row of Y, I would need new underpants!

Airbus A30lands in high winds at Dusseldorf airport | Daily Mail Online

Interested to hear comments from our pilots on board.

Enjoy the video!

 

[eric2011]

Just sitting in LAX and watched the video. Thanks for helping me with my nerves

 

[jb747]

Im not a nervous flyer but if I was in the last row of Y, I would need new underpants!

Airbus A30lands in high winds at Dusseldorf airport | Daily Mail Online

Interested to hear comments from our pilots on board.

Dusseldorf has been the source of quite a few of the more interesting landing videos.

It is a truly cough landing!

You're supposed to get the drift below 5º before touchdown. And a flare is also a good idea.

It's obviously a very gusty wind, as you can tell from the rudder inputs during the approach. These are automatic, as the aircraft would be detecting these changes in the crosswind as sideslip, and using the rudder to remove the slip. Looks horrible, but it actually makes crosswind approaches easier.

At the bottom he basically hasn't managed any flare, so probably a heavy landing. The combination of that with the drift would place enormous loads on the undercarriage.

I wonder when it happened? A couple of months ago, I had to wait for about 30 minutes before I could get onto my allocated bay in Dubai. The reason was that they were having trouble moving an EK380 out of the bay. Our engineer told us that they had been unable to get the get pins installed...the aircraft had been so heavily landed that they had to hammer them in! Didn't say/know where it had happened.

 

[TomVexille]

Can we compare it with this one?

 

[jb747]

Tokyo is a sod of a place to land. We used to be able to sit in a beer garden and watch the arrivals, generally feeling smug because we'd already managed our landing...and glad 'cos we weren't doing it.

This landing seems to have a little more flare, and the drift looks to be much less at touchdown. The right wing drop looks like an own goal, as the aircraft looks more or less wings level before a right wing down input is applied (you can see the ailerons move up on the right wing).

Of course, in my dreams, all of my landings are wonderful too.

 

[Flying Fox]

I wonder when it happened?

According to the article -

An Emirates spokesman said: 'Emirates flight EK 55 on 5 October 2017 landed safely in Dusseldorf under strong crosswind conditions. At no point was the safety of the passengers and crew on board compromised.'

 

[andyhui01]

Dusseldorf has been the source of quite a few of the more interesting landing videos.

It is a truly cough landing!

You're supposed to get the drift below 5º before touchdown. And a flare is also a good idea.

It's obviously a very gusty wind, as you can tell from the rudder inputs during the approach. These are automatic, as the aircraft would be detecting these changes in the crosswind as sideslip, and using the rudder to remove the slip. Looks horrible, but it actually makes crosswind approaches easier.

Thanks for explaining JB. I saw the rudder input and was thought maybe it was a less experienced FO who panicked and starting doing massive abrupt rudder inputs to correct.

 

[mrs.dr.ron]

Tokyo is a sod of a place to land. We used to be able to sit in a beer garden and watch the arrivals, generally feeling smug because we'd already managed our landing....

I remember a very hairy landing at NRT, we were flying JAL and sitting in 1A and C looking at the seated FAs, but also had front facing landing camera on TV screen. It was a typhoon, pouring with rain and extremely windy, we had 2 'go- arounds' - the plane being tossed around on approach - by the 3rd time the runway was in sight I think I nearly squeezed Rons hands off. I don't want to experience that again !

 

[Saab34]

Dusseldorf has been the source of quite a few of the more interesting landing videos.

It is a truly cough landing!

You're supposed to get the drift below 5º before touchdown. And a flare is also a good idea.

It's obviously a very gusty wind, as you can tell from the rudder inputs during the approach. These are automatic, as the aircraft would be detecting these changes in the crosswind as sideslip, and using the rudder to remove the slip. Looks horrible, but it actually makes crosswind approaches easier.

At the bottom he basically hasn't managed any flare, so probably a heavy landing. The combination of that with the drift would place enormous loads on the undercarriage.

I wonder when it happened? A couple of months ago, I had to wait for about 30 minutes before I could get onto my allocated bay in Dubai. The reason was that they were having trouble moving an EK380 out of the bay. Our engineer told us that they had been unable to get the get pins installed...the aircraft had been so heavily landed that they had to hammer them in! Didn't say/know where it had happened.

Are the rudder inputs on the ground also automatic?

At what point do you normally flare?. Airbus pilots I’ve spoken to (on smaller stuff) seem to have different techniques. Some say 20ft, some do just after the 30ft call...some right on the 30ft call.

 

[tgh]

The rudder inputs appeared to be over reactive and late : I thought that the pilot needed a basic refresher in er basics.
Seems to show that auto is auto and is apparently incapable of predictive application.
Perhaps an example of the challenges facing fully auto systems

 

[codash1099]

Don't think I've experienced it quite this bad.

As scary - and skilled - a landing as you could see

 

[cove]

I saw that and was glad I wasn’t a passenger.

 

[mannej]

Being discussed here - EK A380 Massive Sideways Landing

 

[jb747]

The rudder inputs appeared to be over reactive and late : I thought that the pilot needed a basic refresher in er basics.
Seems to show that auto is auto and is apparently incapable of predictive application.
Perhaps an example of the challenges facing fully auto systems

Qué?

This is a manual landing. The automatic rudder inputs happen airborne, and are the FBW system's response to the varying crosswind, which it detects as sideslip. It doesn't care about runway alignment, or anything else....it just wants to get rid of sideslip. As a side effect, these constant corrections tend to remove about half of the effect of the crosswind changes.

There are very few lateral corrections during the video, so the aircraft has maintained the centreline reasonably well, without having to chase it.

The landing itself is hard. There is no flare that I can discern. It is also early (at about the '500 foot marker), which also fits in with 'no flare'.

The rudder inputs on the ground are manual. Recall too, that once on the ground the rudder pedal inputs are also translated to nose gear steering. Basically what you are seeing is over controlling. Landing with the drift intact is not an Airbus procedure. The 5º drift limit corresponds to about 12 knots of crosswind. Boeings are allowed to be landed with drift intact right up to their crosswind limits (which will give about 15º of drift). The initial aircraft energy vector is down the runway, and as long as you don't let the nose gear come down, the aircraft will skid in that direction, giving time to smoothly use the rudder to push the aircraft into alignment.

The aircraft is huge, and does not respond quickly to anything. It has a lot of inertia if you let it go astray, and it can be very hard to catch.

Your comments re automation have no relevance to this video.

 

[jb747]

Are the rudder inputs on the ground also automatic?

Manual. On the ground rudder pedal movement also moves the nose gear steering (though only through a small subset of its range). At low speeds especially, that means you can see rudder inputs out of all proportion to the desired movement. At about 60 knots, the rudder overpowers the nose gear steering.

At what point do you normally flare?. Airbus pilots I’ve spoken to (on smaller stuff) seem to have different techniques. Some say 20ft, some do just after the 30ft call...some right on the 30ft call.

There is no one point. The flare height will differ on every approach, and with every configuration. If you flare at 30' that's normally too high, and at 20 getting to be too low. But that will be affected by the sink rate (slower sink rate with increasing headwind). But if you flare late but fast that can work, as can high and slow.

 

[Saab34]

Is the Automatic sideslip corrections from the rudder only specific to the A380? Is this function on the 320/330 etc? Have not seen such aggressive movements from a rudder on its own automatic accord. Quite impressive technology!

 

[Skyring]

It looks dramatic, but the extreme telephoto magnifies the appearance of lateral movement while minimising any appearance of movement towards the camera. In reality, the aircraft is moving at well over 200 km/h, and its path on the runway is pretty much a straight line.

Having said that, the main gear is making some quick sideways movements of a couple of metres either side of the centreline within a short space of time. That has got to be felt inside the cabin, and I'd be expecting stuff to be flying around.