Booster vaccines, eligibility and travel bookings

Pushka

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DIL, myself and husband received AZ as first two rounds and now Pfizer as booster. Son received Pfizer as (third) booster a little early (ahem) as he is off to UK next week. Other son will be the same in UK, three Pfizer. Does this mean will comprise our own little research group? 😂
 
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DIL, myself and husband received AZ as first two rounds and now Pfizer as booster. Son received Pfizer as (third) booster a little early (ahem) as he is off to UK next week. Other son will be the same in UK, three Pfizer. Does this mean will comprise our own little research group? 😂

You need to add a control group, then expose everyone to the same infection vector, and see what happens!

Seriously though, this is a pretty good illustration of why it is inapt to talk about "proof" in this context. It's very tough to design experiments to test hypotheses in this area - you have to deliberately expose subjects to infection, and while human challenge studies do happen from time to time, getting ethical approval and maintaining the integrity of experiment conditions is tricky.

Observational (as opposed to controlled experimental) evidence is what informs statements such as "reasonable hypotheses", "reasonable conclusions" and "evidence-based approach" that you hear in this space sometimes. It's not often the conditions exist to say "it is has been proved that...".
 

Pushka

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You need to add a control group, then expose everyone to the same infection vector, and see what happens!

Seriously though, this is a pretty good illustration of why it is inapt to talk about "proof" in this context. It's very tough to design experiments to test hypotheses in this area - you have to deliberately expose subjects to infection, and while human challenge studies do happen from time to time, getting ethical approval and maintaining the integrity of experiment conditions is tricky.

Observational (as opposed to controlled experimental) evidence is what informs statements such as "reasonable hypotheses", "reasonable conclusions" and "evidence-based approach" that you hear in this space sometimes. It's not often the conditions exist to say "it is has been proved that...".
Once it gets to real world it’s impossible.
 

Lynda2475

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A hypothesis by definition does not assume truth or outcome. By asserting the outcome based on limited evidence you have indeed made an unproven asummption instead of waiting for an actual outcome.

My statement that az + moderna is not universally accepted as best option as some here are asserting is true. I never claimed that 3 doses of Pfizer is best, but mrna boosters are what is being recommended everywhere boosters are in play.

Ive safely had 2 mrna doses and will have a 3rd mrna because its proven safe for me and effective. No one is recommending switching to AZ booster after 2 mrna doses.
 
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jakeseven7

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DIL, myself and husband received AZ as first two rounds and now Pfizer as booster. Son received Pfizer as (third) booster a little early (ahem) as he is off to UK next week. Other son will be the same in UK, three Pfizer. Does this mean will comprise our own little research group? 😂

Sure you can! Congrats as the latest studies do point towards that being the best vax combination :) ;)
 
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A hypothesis by definition does not assume truth or outcome. By asserting the outcome based on limited evidence you have indeed made an unproven asummption instead of waiting for an actual outcome.

Here is a hypothesis couched in and to test on your terms: if a heterologous vaccination regimen is deployed, then a better outcome in terms of safety, efficacy and effectiveness compared to homologous vaccination may follow. Because this is prefaced with "if" and the conclusory phrase includes "may", the truth or outcome of the hypothesis is not assumed. It is posited as a hypothetical. This hypothesis is capable of being supported (or falsified) through observation. Here are the observations which support that hypothesis, and do not falsify it:

12 May 2021 - UK Com Cov Study Preliminary Report

18 May 2021 - first Spanish study

9 June 2021 - first German study

16 June 2021 - second German study

25 June 2021 - UK Com Cov Study Report

26 July 2021 - South Korea Study

15 October 2021 - US Study

26 October 2021 - Quebec and British Columbia Studies

5 December 2021 - second US study

6 December 2021 - The Lancet Paper on Com Cov

7 December 2021 - Report on UK Com Cov Study

How do the studies above constitute "limited evidence"? The answer is they are not limited evidence. They vary in terms of locations and sizes of populations studied, and the timing of the studies. They are far from "limited".

How do these studies falsify the hypothesis? They don't. If the hypothesis was false, the studies would contradict it. None of them do so.

My statement that az + moderna is not universally accepted as best option as some here are asserting is true. I never claimed that 3 doses of Pfizer is best, but mrna boosters are what is being recommended everywhere boosters are in play.

Which of the studies above support the proposition that "az + moderna is not universally accepted as the best option"? What studies do you have access to that the rest of us don't which contradict the findings in the studies listed above? The studies to which the rest of us have access suggest that overall (safety, infections and hospitalisations), AZ + Moderna delivered the best outcome. It is true that there's not much in it, and different locations delivered slightly different outcomes on infections and hospitalisations between each of the various combinations, but that combination edged out the others overall.

Again, I invite you to produce material which contradicts this. If you cannot produce it, it is open to draw the inference that you do not have such material.

In the US, mRNA vaccines AND the adenovirus vector vaccine (which AZ is also) there available (J&J) are being recommended by the US CDC: US CDC Booster Recommendations. The US CDC recommendation is very clear: "Which booster should you get? Any of the Covid-19 vaccines authorized in the United States" (emphasis added).

Ive safely had 2 mrna doses and will have a 3rd mrna because its proven safe for me and effective. No one is recommending switching to AZ booster after 2 mrna doses.

As far I can ascertain, the reason that "no one" is recommending AZ third doses after two mRNA is because AstraZeneca has not been given marketing approval for that purpose. However, the US CDC is recommending that any US-authorised vaccine (which includes J&J, an adenovirus viral vector vaccine, which AZ is also) be used as a third dose:

US CDC Recommendation.jpg
 

OZDUCK

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Booster shots will now be available after 5 months as ATAGI has changed its opinion on whether to change the waiting period. So mid-January for us.


 

relaxonbarton

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Great news its now 5 months. We were in the cohort forced to only have AZ shots, which are now virtually useless <10% effective according to UK, so now booked for Moderna booster on Wednesday.
 

MelMel

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692F3090-CC06-49AD-BC8A-7453ACAB5700.jpeg
Booked Moderna for my booster at Chemist Warehouse following second Pfizer in June. The website prompted me to book my second Moderna. I’m assuming everything will be fine getting it as my booster? I don’t really want to be turned away over a technicality.
 

relaxonbarton

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View attachment 266903
Booked Moderna for my booster at Chemist Warehouse following second Pfizer in June. The website prompted me to book my second Moderna. I’m assuming everything will be fine getting it as my booster? I don’t really want to be turned away over a technicality.
Yes, likewise, there was no way to indicate its for a Booster shot.
 

jase05

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View attachment 266903
Booked Moderna for my booster at Chemist Warehouse following second Pfizer in June. The website prompted me to book my second Moderna. I’m assuming everything will be fine getting it as my booster? I don’t really want to be turned away over a technicality.
Moderna only being a half dose for the booster could cause some concerns?
I’d definitely want confirmation before rocking up
With the announcement only recent it might just take a day or so for the bookings system to update (they are still saying 6mths on all sites)
 

MEL_Traveller

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So I went and got boosted this morning!

As of 10am this morning the Cth govt vaccine centre In Melbourne said there is a difference between boosters and third doses.

Moderna is only for *third doses*... for example for the immunocompromised.

Pfizer is the only one available (as of today) as a *booster*. This may change going forward or through non-cth outlets.

The pfizer booster is a full dose/shot.

at 8am I had to ring up to get on the list for today as all the automatic booking engines hadn't been programmed for the 5 month period yet.
 

Lynda2475

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Prof Kelly emphasized in presser with Greg Hunt this morning that Moderna booster will be a half dose, so Pharmacies (the only places you can get Moderna in most states) will need to sort out a booster vs primary course booking system.

Im going to try and get my booster on 23rd Dec now that there is no 6 month wait, Olympic Park is taking walk ins so will be the easiest way to get jabbed.
 

drron

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There still seems to be a lot of misinformation out there.
Moderna is approved as a booster,
"Either Comirnaty (Pfizer) or Spikevax (Moderna) are recommended for use as a booster vaccine, and are considered equally acceptable."

The Moderna vaccine contains 3 times the mRNA of Pfizer though it is not the same mRNA. Presumably this is why it is a half dose as a booster.

Several studies suggest the the best combinations are AZ or J&J followed by Moderna or Novavax. As Novavax is going to be some time in arriving here I will be having my Moderna booster before Christmas. Which is exactly 5 months since my second jab.
 

MelMel

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Moderna only being a half dose for the booster could cause some concerns?
I’d definitely want confirmation before rocking up
With the announcement only recent it might just take a day or so for the bookings system to update (they are still saying 6mths on all sites)
I dropped into the Chemist Warehouse where I have my booking and the Pharmacist confirmed that it was ok for a Moderna booster on Friday and that they were giving half doses. I’ll report further on Friday.
 

DC3

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Yes. Get whatever booster that you can. Any of them is better than nothing.

Edit: A bit of over-thinking in some posts. ❤️
 
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moa999

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so Pharmacies (the only places you can get Moderna in most states) will need to sort out a booster vs primary course booking system.

My local (an Amcal) had already looked up vaccine status before I arrived, and determined it was a booster so had the relevant half (25cc) dose of Moderna prepared.

About 5 2/3mo after my 2nd Pfizer.
 
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