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Australian Reports of the Virus Spread

Lynda2475

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I have the greatest empathy for the people isolating in the tower blocks. Those people will be going it tough.
With greater Melbourne going back into lockdown now, i suspect they may ease up on the hard lockdown of the tower blocks . What they really need to do is remove anyone from those blocks who is positive and put them into hotel isolation, as it would be hard to keep distance from other family members in a small apartment with a shared bathroom.
 

lovetravellingoz

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Way back at the beginning - February - every positive person was isolated in hospital.
Maybe I am misinterpreting what you mean, but the following SA instruction has people who test positive just going into self-isolation and not
being isolated in hospitals.

1594108571983.png



Also if you want to quarantine people, then if they are not very unwell it would be prudent to not have them in hospitals where there is risk of other ill people catching covid 19 from them.
 

RooFlyer

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Ive defnitely flownfrom SYD - HBA direct, so i dont think it is true that all Tas flights go via MEL.
Not since COVID reductions.

It would make sense if they simply re-arranged it to be LST-SYD but I suspect it may not be as simple as that.
I'm so hoping that when Premier Gutwein announces his next stage of de-restrictions in a couple of weeks, that direct flights between HBA (at least) and SYD and ADL will be in place.* He's hinted to that effect but hedging his bets. If anything, the Victorian situation might have helped the case for direct flights bypassing MEL, but dependent on the airlines supplying the services, of course. AND I'm assuming that with SA and NSW travel, there won't be quarantining on return! If so, I'm so off the the Barossa.

OTOH, stories emerging in Tas about people arriving from Vic on the 'Spirit of Tasmania' ferry (ie in cars) and not isolating. Stopping for coffee, lunch etc on their drive to Launceston and Hobart. If its true, then the Premier needs to jump on it; quarantine slackness now won't be easily forgiven.

* Might be HBA-LST-SYD/ADL. I've been hearing of HBA-LST-MEL flights for a while now; I haven't gone HBA-LST for 40+ years! A very short hop (I think its JQ, but think of the SCs if QF :)
 

p--and--t

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Way back at the beginning - February - every positive person was isolated in hospital. Discussed this with SIL who is in Casualty in a large public hospital and at that time I was very surprised that soon people who were positive would be sent home to isolate
Not my recollection in AU, from memory, that was happening in Japan.
 

lovetravellingoz

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With greater Melbourne going back into lockdown now, i suspect they may ease up on the hard lockdown of the tower blocks . What they really need to do is remove anyone from those blocks who is positive and put them into hotel isolation, as it would be hard to keep distance from other family members in a small apartment with a shared bathroom.
At present they do not yet now who is positive, and who is not.

The 5 day lockdown period is to allow enough time to test everyone, or at least everyone that was willing to be tested. After this they will have better knowledge on what to do next. If there are too many refusniks then it may be 14 day quarantine for all.

I would tend to believe if one person in a household is already infected, then that anyone else who is sharing an apartment with them will also be already be infected even if they do not yet have the viral load to test positive. So I doubt splitting up families would decrease the cases. In the case of many it would be traumatic. ie Young children removed from parents.

The current plan is that after the 5 days that they will change to Phase 3 restrictions to match the rest of Melbourne.
 
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p--and--t

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With greater Melbourne going back into lockdown now, i suspect they may ease up on the hard lockdown of the tower blocks
Clearly stated today they will not happen right now and whether it happens at all will depend on the results of tests over the next 5 days.
 

Pushka

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Maybe I am misinterpreting what you mean, but the following SA instruction has people who test positive just going into self-isolation and not
being isolated in hospitals.

View attachment 221917



Also if you want to quarantine people, then if they are not very unwell it would be prudent to not have them in hospitals where there is risk of other ill people catching covid 19 from them.
Yes. A bit awry with interpretation. I said at the beginning, in Feb-March all positives were isolated in hospital. By late March it was home isolation which I went on to state how difficult that could be for many households.
Post automatically merged:

Not my recollection in AU, from memory, that was happening in Japan.
I’m talking about SA and I remember it 😉

the first couple from Wuhan. Isolated at RAH. The next SA people from Princess Diamond. Flown back to SA by air ambulance and isolated at RAH and so on until it became self iso at home. Neither of these cases required hospitalization just isolation. One of them was a younger woman who was positive not ill.
 
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Not my recollection in AU, from memory, that was happening in Japan.
It was definitely happening in Queensland as Tom Hanks and wife were initially isolated in hospital and then allowed out to isolate in a hotel. I remember him twittering that they were well but it was just the procedure that everyone initially isolated in a hospital.
 

p--and--t

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I’m talking about SA and I remember it 😉

the first couple from Wuhan. Isolated at RAH. The next SA people from Princess Diamond. Flown back to SA by air ambulance and isolated at RAH and so on until it became self iso at home. Neither of these cases required hospitalization just isolation. One of them was a younger woman who was positive not ill.
It was definitely happening in Queensland as Tom Hanks and wife were initially isolated in hospital and then allowed out to isolate in a hotel. I remember him twittering that they were well but it was just the procedure that everyone initially isolated in a hospital.
I stand corrected. 🙃
 

lovetravellingoz

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Well given the number of positive cases in Vic at present, multiplied by all their close contacts who are all meant to be in self-isolate then the last thing you would want to do is to tie up Melbourne's hospitals with accommodating them.

Then add to those numbers the 25K per day who are being tested. At least all the symptomatic ones should be self-isolating. There is a bit of a lag in testing and so you may be talking about quarantine accommodation for 50-70K. That simply is not feasible.

Probably the most significant change that came in today in my opinion was the no visitors rule. Spread through people mixing in homes has been a key recent driver. Knock this on the head and the case rate should plummet.

The other key driver of the hotel security guards has already been cut off, though their legacy is still rippling through. Though family spread was a multiplier of this source and no visitors will assist in choking this off too.
 

Pushka

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Went to my dental hygienist today and one of the questions at reception was “Have you visited Melbourne in the last two weeks”. I was tempted to say yes just to see what would happen, but then decided it would be like mentioning bombs at an airport.
😂. Funny you should think that.

Because I was thinking similarly just now. Our office in Adelaide, which is blessedly Covid free, is managed by the local Council. They are supposed to provision the reception desk and attend to issues. We haven't seen them since 23rd March! Heating has been broken now (and Adelaide just had its coldest day this year, today) and they simply said for us to bring our own heater, blankets and hot water bottle! 🤪🤷‍♀️. And then they sent an email saying they wouldn't be back in until 23rd July when it was safe ! FFS - MrP never stopped going into the office. Yet on social media they keep stating how the hub is open for business and how busy they are! Maybe, but certainly not doing their work for us! just busy tweeting methinks.

So, just now I was tempted to tell them that closer to their return date we were being isolated because someone we know had Covid.
 

nutwood

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The logical way to consider broad scale isolation should be based on maps, not State boundaries. At the moment, the general population is on-side but given time, it's likely complacency will kick in. When that stage is reached, enforcement of locked down areas will become an issue. It would make sense to consider the country as a whole and draw dotted lines around areas, based on ease of enforcing said dotted lines, rather than political boundaries.
Who in their right mind would try and subdivide Albury Wodonga when there's miles of relatively empty country either side, through which a line could be drawn?
 
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Pushka

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The logical way to consider broad scale isolation should be based on maps, not State boundaries. At the moment, the general population is on-side but given time, it's likely complacency will kick in. When that stage is reached, enforcement of locked down areas will become an issue. It would make sense to consider the country as a whole and draw dotted lines around areas, based on ease of enforcing said dotted lines, rather than political boundaries.
Who in their right mind would try and subdivide Albury Wodonga when there's miles of relatively empty country either side, through which a line could be drawn?
Because as soon as interpretation is involved it gets very difficult for authorities to police.
 

p--and--t

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😂. Funny you should think that.

Because I was thinking similarly just now. Our office in Adelaide, which is blessedly Covid free, is managed by the local Council. They are supposed to provision the reception desk and attend to issues. We haven't seen them since 23rd March! Heating has been broken now (and Adelaide just had its coldest day this year, today) and they simply said for us to bring our own heater, blankets and hot water bottle! 🤪🤷‍♀️. And then they sent an email saying they wouldn't be back in until 23rd July when it was safe ! FFS - MrP never stopped going into the office. Yet on social media they keep stating how the hub is open for business and how busy they are! Maybe, but certainly not doing their work for us! just busy tweeting methinks.

So, just now I was tempted to tell them that closer to their return date we were being isolated because someone we know had Covid.
I don't know about commercial leases, but under the residential tenancy provisions in Adelaide, our agent has told us in the past in SA the tenant is entitled to a rental reduction if the a/c or heating is inoperative for more than a reasonable time (equivalent to how long to organise to get a technician there with spare parts for a repair)
 

dajop

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The logical way to consider broad scale isolation should be based on maps, not State boundaries. At the moment, the general population is on-side but given time, it's likely complacency will kick in. When that stage is reached, enforcement of locked down areas will become an issue. It would make sense to consider the country as a whole and draw dotted lines around areas, based on ease of enforcing said dotted lines, rather than political boundaries.
Who in their right mind would try and subdivide Albury Wodonga when there's miles of relatively empty country either side, through which a line could be drawn?
I've thought the same. The challenge is where to draw the lines? But if you managed the line, for example at the border of the Greater Hume Shire in NSW, you would probably have a much smaller number of exemptions to manage who need to cross the line, than at the border between Albury and Wodonga.

At least with Albury/Wodonga the population and many services are present relatively evenly across both sides of the borders. There are other places where the NSW town is functionally a suburb of the bigger Victorian town (i.e.Echuca/Moama,, Mildura/Buronga)
 

nutwood

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Because as soon as interpretation is involved it gets very difficult for authorities to police.
Shouldn't be that hard. If there's only a handful of roads in and out of an area, you stick big flashing signs (governments love them!) stating that you're entering a COVID zone. Much of Australia can be divided along lines with very limited numbers of roads. Much as I hate to encourage them, minor tracks can be dealt with by a few large rocks, carefully positioned. Much easier than dividing the middle of a city, even if there is a river to help!
 

Pushka

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Shouldn't be that hard. If there's only a handful of roads in and out of an area, you stick big flashing signs (governments love them!) stating that you're entering a COVID zone. Much of Australia can be divided along lines with very limited numbers of roads. Much as I hate to encourage them, minor tracks can be dealt with by a few large rocks, carefully positioned. Much easier than dividing the middle of a city, even if there is a river to help!
And I'd have thought ensuring that security guards would be well trained to secure Covid risk travellers safe in quarantine too but look what happened!

Assuming that Victoria country is Covid free given its school holidays is a risk strategy and just heard a family of four from Melbourne holidaying in Port Fairy Victoria are positive.
 

nutwood

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I've thought the same. The challenge is where to draw the lines? But if you managed the line, for example at the border of the Greater Hume Shire in NSW, you would probably have a much smaller number of exemptions to manage who need to cross the line, than at the border between Albury and Wodonga.

At least with Albury/Wodonga the population and many services are present relatively evenly across both sides of the borders. There are other places where the NSW town is functionally a suburb of the bigger Victorian town (i.e.Echuca/Moama,, Mildura/Buronga)
You're totally correct. The challenge is where to draw the lines and in the short term, it's a lot easier to simply use existing borders. The reality is though that this might be with us for a while, with (hopefully!) sporadic outbreaks. It'd make sense to put some effort into working out the most practical ways to quarantine geographical areas, whilst not inconveniencing those not involved in the outbreak.
Why should Mildura businesses suffer because of a Melbourne outbreak?
 

Pushka

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You're totally correct. The challenge is where to draw the lines and in the short term, it's a lot easier to simply use existing borders. The reality is though that this might be with us for a while, with (hopefully!) sporadic outbreaks. It'd make sense to put some effort into working out the most practical ways to quarantine geographical areas, whilst not inconveniencing those not involved in the outbreak.
Why should Mildura businesses suffer because of a Melbourne outbreak?
Everything that is happening right now is happening at lightening speed to get the best outcome to suppress Covid. In order to do as suggested requires logistical effort and police/ADF training in things that won't do anything to achieve the primary goal, which is to suppress Covid. Business considerations sadly, come in a distinct second. But possibly as time unfolds this can be refined appropriately.
 

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