Australian Reports of the Virus Spread

HappyFlyerFamily

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I'm not sure its worth getting into state based comparisons, but its clear that the current settings in NSW are not working. When something is not working it's time to try something different.

The issue with vaccines is that they still haven't made it to all the most vulnerable, let a lone had time to take effect. And unfortunately it is not just the most vulnerable who are getting sick, going into ICU, and dying. And that's just with the relatively low infection rates. There's no way you can let the virus run and end up in a very desperate situation.

I think what NSW needs is stricter settings and, more importantly, faster vaccination. It's worth the other states slowing their vaccination to get the outbreak in NSW under control. Big focus on the higher risk LGAs and work outwards from there.
On State v State - agree. But a Nobel prize laureate started that one. But didn't give a clear specific detail.

Its sort of like people previously asking for a plan (eg to open international borders/post-vaccination). Saying a harder lockdown doesn't mean anything - Sydney needs specific detailed ideas.

And to say NSW authorities are letting it run is not reality - they are using their toughest measures.
 

Must...Fly!

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And to say NSW authorities are letting it run is not reality - they are using their toughest measures.
This is true.

I understand the point about vaccine availability. But when you consider that Melbourne's lockdown was not lifted for 112 days it makes you think. I don't believe that a discussion about the costs of COVID zero against the increasing vaccine rollout plan to be pointless or invalid.
 

TheRealTMA

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Re Lockdown Protests etc.

This sums it up brilliantly.

'Extremism researcher Dr Ross said while it was good that people valued democracy and were concerned about protecting individual liberties and freedoms, the anti-lockdown movement misunderstood what democracy means.

“They talk about their rights as citizens, but we also have a collective responsibility as citizens,” Dr Ross said.

And debating the ideas themselves is often counterproductive: “You can’t really debate that idea that the world is run by a satanic cabal of paedophile lizards.”'

Anti-lockdown protests a coalition of the alienated and the far-right
 

SydneySwan

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A new idea - all the other States and regional NSW can feed Sydney, please drop off the food at the State border/Greater Sydney boundary, so we can shut down critical food supplies/logistics in Sydney - NSW will organise a team of ADF to pick up and deliver home to home. (quip)
Will they do requests? I don’t like my food too spicy.
 

Seat0B

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HappyFlyerFamily

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This is true.

I understand the point about vaccine availability. But when you consider that Melbourne's lockdown was not lifted for 112 days it makes you think. I don't believe that a discussion about the costs of COVID zero against the increasing vaccine rollout plan to be pointless or invalid.
My guess for now is that Sydney lockdown won't end until 150 days (mid to end November).

Sydney Winter 2021 is tracking better than Melbourne Winter 2020 in terms of case numbers at similar points, so there is hope lockdown will end, but of course the main difference is Delta.

The other thing that is now known for Sydney Winter 2021 is positive case out in the community while infectious, but I'm not aware of an equivalent figure being publicised during Melbourne Winter 2020, so it makes it difficult to confirm how Sydney now is really tracking.

I think the numbers are pretty clear and that the increasing numbers out in the community while infectious means that Sydney is not at the halfway point (remember there is a tail) and its week 4 of lockdown.

Some specific ideas that might be feasible are:
- distribute free rapid tests to all households, probably initially starting with the epicentre 5 LGAs or critical worksites (problem: household getting negatives will feel more at liberty to undertake non-critical activities)
- extra vaccine should go to the epicentre LGAs/critical worksites - I think those currently booked should remain (problem - vaccines take weeks/month to have an effect on numbers)
- all retail should be click and collect/large business should support free delivery, except for those households without digital access.
 

VPS

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Is it justified to lock down as hard and aggressively with vaccines distributed & available to the most vulnerable?

I am not a nutjob (at least, I don't think so...), to me it's a perfectly valid question.

Not sure there is a lot of difference between Melbourne's previous settings and Sydney's current ones?
I will let others get involved in that discussion. I'm steering clear of making inflammatory statements and in fact I find all the COVID threads slightly depressing so tend to ignore most of them. Everyone has an opinion and many are inflexible to others points of view.
 

bcworld

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- all retail should be click and collect/large business should support free delivery, except for those households without digital access.
If that includes supermarkets I just don't think it's logistically possible. Click and collect just does not function when everyone tries to use it - unless you're happy for absolutely everything you ordered to be substituted for something else.
 

Pushka

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1 new case in SA, 87yo linked to others and in quarantine throughout.
Out of lockdown 12:01am Wednesday. Still some restrictions to stay for week and some for longer
Other than the sad catering industry the restrictions are significantly eased. But given the super events were in such establishments it’s wise to open up slowly in those areas. Without JK though at 25% capacity it’s hard to see many opening up yet. Gyms reopening and this is a great thing in our house. 😬
 

dajop

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Is it justified to lock down as hard and aggressively with vaccines distributed & available to the most vulnerable?

The vaccine diversion discussion has interesting dimensions, politically it is a minefield though. If the PM pushed for it, there's a chance it could backfire spectacularly if there's an outbreak in Melbourne or Brisbane, re-inforcing the "Prime Minister of Sydney" narrative.

Diverting vaccines from Vic and Qld to SW Sydney may have merit, but if that has merit, NSW government probably already has in its power to divert Pfizer away from areas with very low (or no) community transmission within NSW to the most affected LGAs. They could take vaccine from Newcastle, Wagga/Riverina, Coffs/North Coast to send to SW Sydney already.
 

HappyFlyerFamily

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The vaccine diversion discussion has interesting dimensions, politically it is a minefield though. If the PM pushed for it, there's a chance it could backfire spectacularly if there's an outbreak in Melbourne or Brisbane, re-inforcing the "Prime Minister of Sydney" narrative.

Diverting vaccines from Vic and Qld to SW Sydney may have merit, but if that has merit, NSW government probably already has in its power to divert Pfizer away from areas with very low (or no) community transmission within NSW to the most affected LGAs. They could take vaccine from Newcastle, Wagga/Riverina, Coffs/North Coast to send to SW Sydney already.
NSW are thinking of diverting appointments (first and/or second) that have been locked in for weeks to critical epicentre workers so the 'rest' of Sydney/NSW might remain unvaccinated. So this strategy will have massive ramifications when the epicentre moves - and it is a when in my opinion not if.
 

drron

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In a world sense Sydney is not doing too badly.The USA with 3 times as many fully vaccinated might not be gettingout of the woods until mid October according to one "expert".
Justin Lessler, an epidemiologist from the University of North Carolina who helps run the COVID-19 Scenario Modeling Hub, told NPR in the most likely scenario, of the four scenarios included in the ensemble projection, only 70% of eligible U.S. residents get vaccinated and the delta variant becomes 60% more transmissible. Lessler said this trajectory would climax with approximately 60,000 COVID-19 cases and 850 deaths each day in mid-October.

But it's not only covid.
Common respiratory viruses are making a comeback, and a particularly severe flu season could be on the horizon, the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention warned Friday.



And as well another Asian country that had done well is in crisis.
HANOI (AFP) - Vietnam locked down eight million people in Hanoi on Saturday (July 24), the latest attempt to curb a serious coronavirus outbreak that has already forced a third of the country to stay home.

Vietnam’s health ministry reported 7,968 coronavirus infections on Saturday, a record daily increase and up from Friday’s record of 7,307.

The centre of the normally bustling capital was empty and shops were shuttered as the lockdown came into force, although people could still be seen on the streets in the outskirts of the city.

 

jase05

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Other than the sad catering industry the restrictions are significantly eased. But given the super events were in such establishments it’s wise to open up slowly in those areas. Without JK though at 25% capacity it’s hard to see many opening up yet. Gyms reopening and this is a great thing in our house. 😬
Still some gyms that may not open. The 1 person per 8sqm is just lunacy and completely out of nowhere
 

HappyFlyerFamily

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Still some gyms that may not open. The 1 person per 8sqm is just lunacy and completely out of nowhere
I read an article that WHO is doing a global review/phone hookup on Delta - so it might mean that 1.5 metres and less than 15 minutes contact are insufficient measures. So 1 per 8 sqm is not really out of nowhere.
 

jakeseven7

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I read an article that WHO is doing a global review/phone hookup on Delta - so it might mean that 1.5 metres and less than 15 minutes contact are insufficient measures. So 1 per 8 sqm is not really out of nowhere.

And Delta Plus which is more infectious than Delta. Boy I hope we are ready for that!
 

jase05

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I read an article that WHO is doing a global review/phone hookup on Delta - so it might mean that 1.5 metres and less than 15 minutes contact are insufficient measures. So 1 per 8 sqm is not really out of nowhere.
But weddings, pubs and everything else is 1 per 4sqm still. Seems like gyms just get harsher restrictions
 
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jakeseven7

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Snow was supposed to be good

——

Greater Sydney family fined for ditching lockdown to go skiing​


A family from Greater Western Sydney copped thousands of dollars' worth of fines after travelling to Thredbo to go skiing on the weekend.

 

Must...Fly!

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Diverting vaccines from Vic and Qld to SW Sydney may have merit, but if that has merit, NSW government probably already has in its power to divert Pfizer away from areas with very low (or no) community transmission within NSW to the most affected LGAs. They could take vaccine from Newcastle, Wagga/Riverina, Coffs/North Coast to send to SW Sydney already.
Agreed.

I actually think diverting Pfizer vaccines away from the other states is not the right choice. While yes it may be in the short term, the reality is that Delta IS infectious, leaks from hotel quarantine WILL continue to occur and it completely impossible to predict where. In that context, as broad an immunity as we can obtain across the country will serve us best.

However, every unused dose of Astra-Zeneca sitting on storage shelves should be going straight to NSW. That will be replaced quickly enough by freshly manufactured doses from CSL.
 

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