Article: How I Make Qantas Reward Availability Work for Me

My observation is that many members on this site do find availability to Europe and the USA using their QFF points. Most however are not flying Qantas, for the majority of us that are bronze or silver, partner airlines offer the only real opportunity to book those premium seats. I have done just that, commencing a OWA in HKG to Europe and back to Aust whilst planning to add further flights about 6 months later for a second trip. It will be my fifth OWA flying J since 2015.

I do think that domestic rewards offer tremendous value but once again, many of us who don't fly for business don't actually fly that often, maybe one or two trips a year so points continue to accumulate.

Finally, for many of us, accumulating points via QFF is by far the easiest way to accrue points in Australia, other programs just don't offer the same opportunities and to some extent, we conversely don't accrue enough points to justify being in multiple programs.

QFF is clearly difficult for most travellers to understand hence the complaints but for those of us that put the effort into understanding some of the nuances, it offers tremendous value. I guess in a perverse way this is a good thing because if the program ever becomes easy to use, then I might as well spend my points purchasing toasters from the Qantas store.
 
I somewhat agree with Matt on the article. Yes you can get good value on domestic flights redeeming QF points, as I've done it to travel to destinations like PER from SYD which historically have been quite expensive fares. In my opinion where Qantas Points are a waste are for flights to NZ where you are paying a ton of points for virtually no savings. I mean by the time you pay the taxes and fees how much money are you truly saving on a QF fare? $100? And for that you burn through 40,000 points, not great value in my book!

I have also had success booking long haul flights in business with Qantas, most recently flying SFO to SYD (via LAX) on American in J for myself and my partner as a classic award. Where he is right is that yes, other programs do offer better availability to certain regions. For instance, last year I flew to Europe no problem on Etihad using my Aeroplan points, all in business class. More recently I flew to Brazil in business class on LATAM, this time using upgrade credits I got as a result of a LATAM Black status match. $800 USD for a one-way fully refundable economy fare that could then be upgraded to business class using those credits is a no brainer compared to forking out 108,400 points just to fly business on QF to SCL.

Another point Matt touches on briefly but I think should be stressed is that you can almost always force frequent flyer programs to open award availability up for you. And no I don't mean being a Platinum member, I mean using routings to your advantage. For instance, Qantas may not have availability to London Heathrow from Sydney when you're checking. Fair enough. But what about Sydney to Singapore, Tokyo or Kuala Lumpur? More than likely they do. And usually at one of these connection points you'll be able to find a J classic award flight to Europe in the days following your arrival into the hub. So instead of flying direct to LHR, why not spend a couple of days in SIN, then fly on to HEL or LHR, as the case may be. And for the return? Fly back via the US! Spend a little quality time New York or LA. Fact of the matter is you'll spend a similar amount of points flying around the world in business class as you would booking that return flight to LHR in business. And you get to visit some extra countries and continents along the way. And isn't that the whole point of aspirational travel?

-RooFlyer88
 
Good article and @Mattg I 100% concur with the first line of your last paragraph 'Some people will probably disagree with my take on this, and that’s of course totally fine!' I would suggest that the masses have no idea how the program works as an example it you look on the QF website the points required to get from SYD-LHR in J is 144 600 points. If you find the seats on a OW partner it jumps to 159000 (through flight) and if it is a combination of say CX or JL to AY the points get even higher. This is where knowledge to the QF OW program comes into play. @kangarooflyer88 touches on this in his post, we have travelled a few times going the long way round to stay within the rules.
I would dissagre with your comments on the SQ program to North America as you just need look for SEA rather than LAX or SFO and on the other side EWR rather than JFK.
 
I would dissagre with your comments on the SQ program to North America as you just need look for SEA rather than LAX or SFO and on the other side EWR rather than JFK.
For SQ, I suspect North America isn't much of an issue given the partners they have (AC and United). Then again, you can already book those at reasonable rates with Virgin Australia. Indeed, you can often get close in business class award availability on United operated flights (this was ultimately how I got back to SYD from SFO last time).

But I think Matt's point stands Qantas is great, there are sweet spots and instances where you can really make it work for not just short haul but also long haul trips in premium cabin. I think the key these days is to understand multiple awards programs and leverage them to your advantage. Even if there is Qantas classic award availability you sometimes can do better going elsewhere. For instance, Australia to Europe is 90,000 Qatar Avios points one-way in business class which knocks the socks off anything Qantas has to offer on their own operated flights, especially from the East Coast.

Another thing that I haven't seen brought up are strategies to get business class affordability. Yes it's nice to book business class flights on points, but sometimes that just isn't possible. Some alternate strategies I have used to get business class cheaply:
  • Using an upgrade instrument:
    • Using points to upgrade a flight (in one instance I spent 35,000 United miles + $650 USD co-pay to upgrade LHR - SYD (via LAX) to Polaris business class - not a bad use of points!) [QF, UA, AA, DL, EK are some examples of airlines offering this]
    • Upgrade using upgrade credits or certificates [UA, AC, LA are some examples of airlines offering this]
  • Upgrade with $$$:
    • At any time - some airlines will provide cash upgrade offers in your manage booking page. These offers can be lucrative at times. For instance, BA offered me an upgrade from economy to business for £50 for Dublin to Manchester. Doesn't sound like a big deal until you realize you get lounge access, a meal on board plus extra tier points with BA for status [BA, UA, AY are some examples of airlines offering this]. Some airlines also have quirks for this process. For instance, on United, you can often call up reservations and ask them what the GGBUYUP offer is. This upgrade offer is different in that United re-tickets you fare so that you earn as though you bought a business class ticket to begin with.
    • By placing a bid - some airlines let you name your own price for an upgrade with the offers being considered close to check-in. Obviously the higher the bid, the more likely your offer will stand [ QF, LH, AC, VA are some examples of airlines offering this]
    • By accepting an upgrade offer at check-in. Many (and I would hazard a guess to say nearly every) airlines offer this option at check-in. After all, they have a very good sense of their inventory and they'd rather sell the seat than it go out empty.
  • Buy with $$$:
    • Just buy it outright - in some instances it can make sense to simply buy the long haul business class ticket outright. As an example, I had to fly to a conference in Glasgow (GLA) in July 2022 from Toronto (YYZ). The cheapest economy fare was $850 CAD but I saw I could book KLM business for ~$1600 CAD. Not only that, Delta Airlines was running a status match offer meaning I could match my Qantas Gold to their Delta Gold and have it through January 30, 2024 by earning the MQMs from these KLM flights. FlyerTalk's Premium MilageRun Deals can be a good source of inspiration here
    • Positioning Flights - If you have enough patience, sometimes it can make sense to book a cheap economy flight to a hub known for cheap business class flights. For instance, I hear there are often cheap business class flights from Manila to Europe on the usual suspects. Of course there are some logistics involved here to ensure you don't misconnect, but the savings can be quite substantial.
Each of these approaches has their own strengths and weaknesses. Buying the ticket outright with points or $$$ means you are guaranteed that seat in business whereas with upgrade you are rolling the dice. However, upgrades can often be more cost effective than points in the long run.

-RooFlyer88
 
Great article. One thing I personally love is the Finnair availability. They release availabilities 365 days and they're quite generous. Right now you'd have no problem finding 6 seats in J from Bangkok to Helsinki (though you'd arrive 10pm) or 3-4 seats from many other Asian cities. They're a good hub for northern Europe. Shame that airspace above Ukraine, Russia, et.al is closed. It adds a few hours of flying some routes.

I also find QFF really useful within North America and North America to UK
 
Some good info here - but I think Part 2 would be great if the comparison of points conversion tables could be listed to show what card has the best transfer value to air points. Dummies like me are not across any program except QFF so knowing what a RTW J trip would cost would be excellent (and save me a lot of time :) )
 
I am glad some people get good value out of the QFF program. However the sweet points in the article have very little relevance for us.
Domestically we have switched to VA. much easier to get gold/platinum. Besides we both have OW life time sapphire. The only time I would consider QF would be to PER and AA offers excellent value for J awards.

Then there are several places we will no longer be going to - USA, Russia and China because we have already been several times.
Then Japan became a problem after my last visit. If i turn up I will be questioned by an Immigration officer. according to my lawyer who does work on immigration cases it is likely i would be allowed in but a chance I could be refused entry. A nd though it is very unlikely might be sent to Immigration detention. I am not going to risk it. The only premium awards to places we want on QFF were awards with JAL that are now out of the picture.

Besides we have traveled extensively and have reasonable stashes of points in BA,AA,LM, and now VA. Also have status in BA, AA and SQ. SQ gold will be replaced by VA gold next year. And on OW we both have life time status.

I have found it much easier to get premium awards through VA. those points will be used on SQ,
I also find it easier to see premium awards on QR with either BA or AA than QFF. They will be our preferred way to Europe.
And LM would be whatever we can get.

Now whilst mine is a nearly unique one there are obviously quite a few people who would prefer their long haul awards on SQ and/or QR rather than what they can find on QFF. Velocity points aren't hard to earn.
 
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Good article.
I been using the strategy of using points to Asia then 'cheap' J fares onward from there, for years, I believe to good effect.
For example, I managed to combine decent QF point redemptions and a good-value revenue fare this year:
QF129 SYD-PVG ( J - 82k points + $94) in early May.
Then CX NRT-HKG-SYD return for ~$4420 in J, starting end of May with a night in HK both directions and returning to Tokyo in mid-July.
From Tokyo I was looking for either reward seats or another revenue fare, to the US.
The Qantas site offered HND-HEL-LHR-ORD (AY-AY-BA) in J for 195k points + $1085. I'd never been to Helsinki so worked in 3 days/nights there for some sight-seeing - fabulous in summer. Also a chance to fly Finnair's new A350-900 with the non-reclining J seat on both AY legs - nice crew and service but the seat was meh.
BA (LHR-ORD) on a B777 was great. Cabin felt new, service, food and crew were fantastic! Very pleasantly surprised.
Return to Aus was on QF4 JFK-AKL-SYD for 144k points & ~$320 (??), mid-August.
All booked around Dec/Jan.
Seemed to be reasonable availablity when I was looking and I was surprised how easy it was to find seats out of the US, 6-7 months out - I was prepared to be a bit flexible with travel dates.
We also fly my business partner's family from the US to Asia each northern summer in J, mostly with QF points on AA/BA.
Looking at my QF redemptions summary, we've booked a reasonable amount of flying for myself, business partner, and our families over the last 12 months using points, but very little revenue spend with QF. Others may have a different opinion as to the overall value equation but the seats are there if you look (and can flex).
We also accumulate Amex MR points which are much more flexible but you have to calculate the different value equation: eg: 2.15 MR/$ being offset by 3 MR points to 1 Krisflyer Mile to work out if it suits.

Image 15-10-2024 at 8.12 AM.jpeg
 
I can't help but feel that some posters on this article have really missed the point. I thought Matt's article was based on a simple premise - that there are ways to use your QF points to your advantage. We could have a thread about which is the best FF program, and we could be defending QF (the "apologisers") or attacking QF because we don't like it (or worse). That's fine, there are lots of threads on here where that can and does happen.

However, recognising that the QFF program is the biggest for Australians in terms of participation, and that a relatively small airline lacks the capacity to compete with much larger airlines for CRs, then useful tips about how to get around the lack of capacity is useful for those that were not already in the know.

Thanks @AFF Editor
 
<redacted>
I was responding to an article regarding the use of Qantas points. If you asked me a couple of years ago, I would have told you in no undertain terms that Qantas points are useless and that anyone who focuses on accumulating them is a schmuck. I was simply making the point (as Matt was in his article) that actually the situation is more complex, more nuanced, than that.
And I think that's something a lot of people don't appreciate about using points to redeem award tickets. You need to come into the flight search process thinking of alternatives to get you where you need to go. Maybe you need to travel on an alternate date, or to/from a nearby airport. Maybe Aeroplan has better availability than Qantas does at the moment. Or maybe you just book the economy classic award now so you have a ticket ready to go, but keep searching in the interim, hoping that an award seat pops up between now and when you depart.
I'm with @Greg555 for much of this. The article is not objective. It reads like apologia. Fundamentally, the message should be less of "your expectations of QFF are misaligned" and more of "you can get value from QFF only if you understand that QF has no intention of serving up what the average punter is led to believe is possible and that you will need to think creatively in a way that only experienced FFs can".
People need to stop treating these frequent flyer programs like WebJet or Expedia. In most programs you cannot generally just specify when you want to go and where and have business or first class awards pop up like that. The fact of the matter is airlines open a limited set of award seats up in any program, and they can be snapped up quickly. What I tell people all the time is your effort and ingenuity will be awarded with heavily discounted business class flights.
I am glad some people get good value out of the QFF program. However the sweet points in the article have very little relevance for us.
Domestically we have switched to VA. much easier to get gold/platinum. Besides we both have OW life time sapphire. The only time I would consider QF would be to PER and AA offers excellent value for J awards.
I think domestic Australia was just one example Matt gave as to where there can be value in those QFF points. However, he does mention other regions where you can often find international long haul availability in Premium Cabin like flights to Asia.
I have found it much easier to get premium awards through VA. those points will be used on SQ,
I also find it easier to see premium awards on QR with either BA or AA than QFF. They will be our preferred way to Europe.
And LM would be whatever we can get.
You do have a point. Different frequent flyer programs will have different availabilities and often times it makes sense to leverage those other programs for certain bookings. With that being said, I think a "balanced diet" of points in various programs will enable you to get the best availability when searching for award seats as they may be some availability that say United has but that Qantas or AA doesn't have, making your Virgin points useful.

Oh one other point, and probably something you already know but thought I'd bring it up: you're aware that your BA Avios points can be transferred 1 to 1 for free to other Avios point earning programs like Qatar, Iberia and FinnAir via the Avios website right? The reason I bring this up is that Qatar tends to have excellent pricing on business class awards to Europe starting at 90,000 one-way flying with them between Australia and Europe? Iberia by the way can be great because you can find business class awards between Europe and North America for as little as 35,000 Avios IIRC.
Now whilst mine is a nearly unique one there are obviously quite a few people who would prefer their long haul awards on SQ and/or QR rather than what they can find on QFF. Velocity points aren't hard to earn.
That's true. Virgin Australia points are also relatively easy to earn, and there are some tricks my colleague showed me which allow one to earn Virgin points for effectively less than a cent per point. However, I would maintain that there are more ways to earn points on Qantas than there are on Virgin. For instance, Qantas Wine's often excellent bonus point sales. At the same time, Qantas through its points club program does offer perks for high earners like lounge access and status credit rollover.
However, recognising that the QFF program is the biggest for Australians in terms of participation, and that a relatively small airline lacks the capacity to compete with much larger airlines for CRs, then useful tips about how to get around the lack of capacity is useful for those that were not already in the know.
This is really a crucial part. And one of the things I think many Australians, and members of this forum take for granted is the many ways you can earn Qantas Points. Qantas makes it so easy to earn points from wine to gift card purchases at Woolies to even lucrative transfers from hotel loyalty programs as is the case now with the Choice Hotels promotion. And I must say, as someone who has been a Canadian resident earning Aeroplan points, and a UK resident at one point earning BA Avios point, Qantas Points are way more easier to earn. Sure I can point to times where I can buy Aeroplan points outright for cheap during special promotional sales, but those are few and far between. However, as someone in Australia on a student visa, with no ability to get Australian credit cards, I still find plenty of opportunities to earn QF points, particularly with gift cards at Woolies.
 
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Interesting comments re domestic bookings. I only travel Y domestically unless a tag sector on an international itinerary. Only ever used points once a few years back for domestic where the cash fare was through the roof but managed to score a last minute CR ticket.

Maybe I am as a retiree in a position through flexibility and only using points for non time critical leisure travel that many on AFF aren’t.

Im a lowly Bronze but by being flexible and taking advantage of QF partners my partner and I have managed QFF CR multi J sector trips to Canada, Fiji, Malaysia, Jordon, Qatar, Morocco, Egypt, Thailand and all within the last 18 months.

Flexibility and having an open mind about connections rather than point to point is a key.
 
Yes they made earning points a breeze

My long haul strategy has been BFOD pay if necessary and throw in non-Australian origin to significantly discount the price

However, since hitting the superannuation pension phase and seeing massive tax cuts as result, (boring I know and having paid Orf the mortgage & child support done) my Dream strategy had been to use rewards points but in the absence of realistic offers for the months I wished to long haul, use the mortgage / tax savings (50% plus of income) to pay for revenue tics to overcome the lack of reward tics

That then meant re-routing points for other options like the domestic cricket season and internal European (Morocco) flights

Never been a real big spender and certainly not so keen on Just spending for the sake of making EXTRA points - and think of all the clutter in the apartment - it’s a pass from me
 
I somewhat agree with Matt on the article. Yes you can get good value on domestic flights redeeming QF points, as I've done it to travel to destinations like PER from SYD which historically have been quite expensive fares. In my opinion where Qantas Points are a waste are for flights to NZ where you are paying a ton of points for virtually no savings. I mean by the time you pay the taxes and fees how much money are you truly saving on a QF fare? $100? And for that you burn through 40,000 points, not great value in my book!

I have also had success booking long haul flights in business with Qantas, most recently flying SFO to SYD (via LAX) on American in J for myself and my partner as a classic award. Where he is right is that yes, other programs do offer better availability to certain regions. For instance, last year I flew to Europe no problem on Etihad using my Aeroplan points, all in business class. More recently I flew to Brazil in business class on LATAM, this time using upgrade credits I got as a result of a LATAM Black status match. $800 USD for a one-way fully refundable economy fare that could then be upgraded to business class using those credits is a no brainer compared to forking out 108,400 points just to fly business on QF to SCL.

Another point Matt touches on briefly but I think should be stressed is that you can almost always force frequent flyer programs to open award availability up for you. And no I don't mean being a Platinum member, I mean using routings to your advantage. For instance, Qantas may not have availability to London Heathrow from Sydney when you're checking. Fair enough. But what about Sydney to Singapore, Tokyo or Kuala Lumpur? More than likely they do. And usually at one of these connection points you'll be able to find a J classic award flight to Europe in the days following your arrival into the hub. So instead of flying direct to LHR, why not spend a couple of days in SIN, then fly on to HEL or LHR, as the case may be. And for the return? Fly back via the US! Spend a little quality time New York or LA. Fact of the matter is you'll spend a similar amount of points flying around the world in business class as you would booking that return flight to LHR in business. And you get to visit some extra countries and continents along the way. And isn't that the whole point of aspirational travel?

-RooFlyer88

Agree. For Europe etc be inventive via Asia. Even though I was platinum my chances of reward seats for Europe/USA didn’t exist no matter how long you looked out. I think Matt is looking through rose coloured glasses. I have switched despite my status.
 
Agree. For Europe etc be inventive via Asia.

Definitely.

I used HKG and SIN as intentional stopovers on the way to / from Europe last year. Got BA and AY premium reward seats to / from, and QF to / from Australia.

If you look for MEL > LHR or similar, there'll be almost nothing but if you look MEL > HKG or SIN > LHR, some options may come up.
 
Definitely.

I used HKG and SIN as intentional stopovers on the way to / from Europe last year. Got BA and AY premium reward seats to / from, and QF to / from Australia.

If you look for MEL > LHR or similar, there'll be almost nothing but if you look MEL > HKG or SIN > LHR, some options may come up.
I’m looking at this strategy now trying to get 2xJ rewards to the UK in the second half of October next year. SIN>LHR in early October has plenty of Finnair availibility so will probably be the go for the date range I am after. Of course there are no reward seats out of Oz to SIN but I might get lucky down the track.
 
Of course there are no reward seats out of Oz to SIN but I might get lucky down the track.
Does Singapore Air fly between Oz and SIN? I suspect so but could be mistaken here. If that is the case then the obvious program to look at would be Virgin Australia as they do have Singapore Air listed as an awards partner. Don’t know about the availability situation though.
 
too many flights to enumerate and out of more ports than Qantas for instance (ADL)

In the usual booking window for reward flights, there is great availability on SQ out of Australia in general.
Do you know anything about ANA? Specifically do they operate many flights between Japan and Australia? Also are there any carriers in OneWorld (or I suppose ANA) that fly between Japan and the UK?

I guess the point I am making here is that it is possible for OP to salvage the situation here by forcing airlines to book him and his partner in business either through creative routings, other frequent flyer programs like Virgin or even mixing Virgin and Qantas to construct the award ticket.

-RooFlyer88
 
Do you know anything about ANA? Specifically do they operate many flights between Japan and Australia? Also are there any carriers in OneWorld (or I suppose ANA) that fly between Japan and the UK?

I guess the point I am making here is that it is possible for OP to salvage the situation here by forcing airlines to book him and his partner in business either through creative routings, other frequent flyer programs like Virgin or even mixing Virgin and Qantas to construct the award ticket.

-RooFlyer88

Yes to ANA Oz-Japan and yes to OW Japan-UL (Jl).

But I doubt the OP could 'force' a reticketing such as you suggest.
 

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