AMEX Class Action??

[woomp001]

Hi all,

On reflection, because the looming AMEX devaluation is so retrospective, I wonder if a class action is worth exploring?

The fundamental issue here, is that AMEX users like myself, elected to use the card, and pay the associated surcharges, under the understanding that they would in kind, receive a certain amount of reward points, that in turn could be spent at a certain rate, to deliver a certain utility.

Now, AMEX have at the stroke of a pen, effectively halved the stored value of the members points balance.

Imagine if a big bank just came out and announced that they were halving everyone's account balances??



If AMEX feels the need to adjust down earn rates moving forward into the future, then that is fine! Everyone could then make new decision's based on the new metrics.

But this move by AMEX is deeply retrospective. It alters the contractual basis on which choices were made long in the past, and to a meaningful degree, and with significant financial repercussions.

My circa 3M points are probably worth circa 60K today, and will be worth circa 30K next week.

These points were not free. They cost me significant amounts of surcharges, from which AMEX derived significant merchant fees, for me to acquire.

The fact that AMEX has doubled the points for a select group of their customers, is prima facie evidence that they recognize the significance of this.

The fact however that they haven't done it for all, even for good customers with large balances, could be the potential basis for a claim?

Does anyone else have any thoughts on the matter?

 

[andye]

I would think the chance of success wouldn't make it worth the cost of an initial legal consultation

 

[lilkid28]

Just ring them see if they can double your points balance first. If not, then just transfer them all out.

 

[andye]

To clarify, its pretty hard to argue a financial loss for a removal of flexibility, particularly for something as nebulous as a reward point.
Given the notice, there is no other significant loss

 

[Daver6]

Surely the T&Cs you agreed to allow them to do this?

They only people to gain out of this will be the lawyers. Perhaps if you can pay with your Amex....

 

[andye]

There is of course a separate argument about whether it is bad for business.
Amex have clearly made a decision on this (with a little bit of fuzziness for last-minute doublings)

 

[woomp001]

Plenty of litigation specialists, that work under the "no win, no fee' model...

 

[Chicken]

From MEMBERSHIP REWARDS - TERMS AND CONDITIONS - Effective 15 November 2018

"4.1 Subject to these terms, you will accrue a designated number of points (earn rate) (as notified to you from time to time) for every one Australian dollar purchase of goods and services, charged and billed on your account."

So they can change how much you earn at any time

"16.2 We may vary the number of points required to purchase a specific reward at any time without giving you prior notice. However, we will give you at least 60 days’ notice if we choose to significantly increase the number of points required to redeem rewards as a whole unless this increase is as a result of an increase in the cost to us in providing such rewards."

They have gone above and beyond their 60 days. Also, they are allowed to increase redemption rate anytime if their supplier increases their cost (example, SQ increase the price for selling KF mile)

Good luck

 

[andye]

Plenty of litigation specialists, that work under the "no win, no fee' model...

Your ability to engage one on that basis will reflect the likelihood of success

Maybe try Kerrigan & Buckley's

 

[Happy Dude]

Just transfer them to SQ or CX and enjoy first class travel, at your whim, for the next few years for you and your loved ones. The likelihood of spending them all on saver/standard awards is low and getting lower.

 

[unfunkable]

It's just a game . goal post's have been moved - adapt and move on !

 

[SuperSaeen]

Based on the membership reward terms, Amex seem to be well within their rights to devalue the redemption rates. Doubt it leaves much basis for a successful lawsuit.

There is however, a good lesson in all this; that it’s worth reading the terms before investing so heavily in any loyalty program and incurring significant transaction charges to accrue points. I’ll admit, I hadn’t read the terms until Chicken posted it above.

Don’t get me wrong, retrospective changes while not illegal, are definitely a **** move. And it’s pretty evident that Amex have lost significant brand equity with quite a few of their customers. Even then, the way Amex handled the devaluation, is still better than how other banks handled their respective devaluations.

So personally, I still feel more comfortable warehousing points with Amex, knowing I will at least be given the opportunity to redeem before any future changes come into effect.

The angle of the apparent inequity of point doubling offers. Where Amex have shielded some customers from the retrospective changes, even though, they were subject to the exact same terms and conditions, might be worth exploring further with a lawyer. (Referring to non platinum charge card holders, who were able to successfully get points doubled)

Businesses generally do have quite a bit of leeway to discriminate between its customers with targeted offers, so there might be a requirement to prove malicious intent for it to have any legal merit.

Edit: typo

 

[Chicken]

The angle of the apparent inequity of point doubling offers. Where Amex have shielded some customers from the retrospective changes, even though, they were subject to the exact same terms and conditions, might be worth exploring further with a lawyer. (Referring to non platinum charge card holders, who were able to successfully get points doubled)

Say, you call up your bank regarding your loan, you cry over the phone, then the operator say "Alright, I'll give you 0.5% off your home loan, now stop crying, I'm going to hang up now"

I then call up the bank, cry over the phone, then the operator say "Don't like it? Go take a hike".

Do you think I should explore this with a lawyer, because the operator went above and beyond with you?

 

[SuperSaeen]

Say, you call up your bank regarding your loan, you cry over the phone, then the operator say "Alright, I'll give you 0.5% off your home loan, now stop crying, I'm going to hang up now"

I then call up the bank, cry over the phone, then the operator say "Don't like it? Go take a hike".

Do you think I should explore this with a lawyer, because the operator went above and beyond with you?

Not going to disagree that Businesses can discriminate. Hence the next part of my statement

Businesses generally do have quite a bit of leeway to discriminate between its customers with targeted offers, so there might be a requirement to prove malicious intent for it to have any legal merit.

Edit: typo

My only point there was that, since the point doubling isn’t just a standard targeted offer/discount but specifically a protection against a particular change in policy to some customers (not apparent from the outside what the basis for it are). If the op feels he has been unfairly discriminated against, he can explore it with a lawyer. A small legal fee for him to get some peace of mind against the large sum of points that he feels he is being shortchanged on.

 

[Chicken]

A small legal fee for him to get some peace of mind

The key here is, that the lawyer should not be accepting AmEx, but dragon visa!

 

[SuperSaeen]

The key here is, that the lawyer should not be accepting AmEx, but dragon visa!

And definitely no surcharges!

 

[Dr Ralph]

Hi all,

On reflection, because the looming AMEX devaluation is so retrospective, I wonder if a class action is worth exploring?

Easy question to answer.

The answer is categorically no.

This is a game. The rules change. Play the game under the new rules. Move on to the next opportunity and stop taking it so personally.

The fact however that they haven't done it for all, even for good customers with large balances, could be the potential basis for a claim?

Nope. Discrimination in a contract like this is pefectly valid.

Surely the T&Cs you agreed to allow them to do this?

Yep.

Based on the membership reward terms, Amex seem to be well within their rights to devalue the redemption rates.

Definitely.

And the reality is that it could have been a lot worse.

It's just a game . goal post's have been moved - adapt and move on !

1000% agree.

Being bitter about the changes isn't going to solve anything.

Your ability to engage one on that basis will reflect the likelihood of success

And the percentage that they want if they win your case.

There's a reason that law firms offer a no win no fee basis, and it's definitely not to assist the client!

 

[drron]

Imagine if a big bank just came out and announced that they were halving everyone's account balances??

Unfortunately this has al ready happened in Cyprus.
Bank Deposits Confiscation: The "Cyprus Experiment" and the Launch of a Global Trend - Global Research

It was planned for some years by the economic elite.Soon after this event New Zealand passed bail in laws and Australia now has such laws on the books.So the next GFC you better not have bank deposits larger than the govt.quarantee-they might just disappear the excess.

Bottom line-a class action against Amex is a waste of time.

 

[Chicken]

So the next GFC you better not have bank deposits larger than the govt.quarantee-they might just disappear the excess.

Yep, always use gift cards, so you can sell them on eBay for rice and flour!

And points

 

[theblank]

On reflection, because the looming AMEX devaluation is so retrospective, I wonder if a class action is worth exploring?

becuase someone is crying over a price increase or reduction in value. its not even worth thinking about.