Air Canada MEL > SYD > YVR - impossible to select seats on VA

[simmomelb]

I've booked an airfare (2 bookings - 4 pax) directly with Air Canada and entered my Velocity number. Booking appears in my Velocity app, and all looks good. I tried to select seats from MEL to SYD for the VA metal, and Air Canada states to contact Virgin Australia for this, VA app states to contact Air Canada for this.
Call both, Air Canada confirmed I need to contact VA, I called VA and they said they can't select a paid-for seat as it was booked via Air Canada.
There are 4 of us going, on 2 separate bookings. I am personally on Platinum, and I managed to score Econ X via the VA call centre (due to "no payment"), yet my brother and partner could not, as they need to pay (being red), yet neither airline can take the payment to select Econ X.
Has anyone else had this issue?

 

[MEL_Traveller]

I've booked an airfare (2 bookings - 4 pax) directly with Air Canada and entered my Velocity number. Booking appears in my Velocity app, and all looks good. I tried to select seats from MEL to SYD for the VA metal, and Air Canada states to contact Virgin Australia for this, VA app states to contact Air Canada for this.
Call both, Air Canada confirmed I need to contact VA, I called VA and they said they can't select a paid-for seat as it was booked via Air Canada.
There are 4 of us going, on 2 separate bookings. I am personally on Platinum, and I managed to score Econ X via the VA call centre (due to "no payment"), yet my brother and partner could not, as they need to pay (being red), yet neither airline can take the payment to select Econ X.
Has anyone else had this issue?

I’ve never had an issue assigning seats on VA when booked as an aeroplan award. Just needed the VA PNR.

And a friend of mine just two weeks ago managed to pay for economy X on an aeroplan award (business unavailable for that leg so was seated in economy… but somehow the call centre managed to boom and pay). Interestingly the call centre offered the use of velocity points to pay for the seat as well as cash!

 

[simmomelb]

I’ve never had an issue assigning seats on VA when booked as an aeroplan award. Just needed the VA PNR.

And a friend of mine just two weeks ago managed to pay for economy X on an aeroplan award (business unavailable for that leg so was seated in economy… but somehow the call centre managed to boom and pay). Interestingly the call centre offered the use of velocity points to pay for the seat as well as cash!

This wasn't Aeroplan Award, but a cash flight.
I've called both Air Canada (usual wait time 90 to 120minutes) and VA (usual wait time zero to a couple of mins), and both are refusing to be able to assign a seat on the VA leg from MEL to SYD :/
VA stated because it was booked through a "travel agent" being Air Canada, they aren't allowed to make changes, yet Air Canada tell me to call VA for the VA metal seat selection - can't win.
Glad it worked out for your friend, though
I'll keep annoying them, but it shouldn't be this difficult.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

This wasn't Aeroplan Award, but a cash flight.
I've called both Air Canada (usual wait time 90 to 120minutes) and VA (usual wait time zero to a couple of mins), and both are refusing to be able to assign a seat on the VA leg from MEL to SYD :/
VA stated because it was booked through a "travel agent" being Air Canada, they aren't allowed to make changes, yet Air Canada tell me to call VA for the VA metal seat selection - can't win.
Glad it worked out for your friend, though
I'll keep annoying them, but it shouldn't be this difficult.

Is the VA fright a codeshare? Or prime VA number?

If the latter, did you get the VA PNR?

You get the same message ‘booked through an agent’ for reward bookings… so in theory it should be same same.

 

[simmomelb]

Is the VA fright a codeshare? Or prime VA number?

If the latter, did you get the VA PNR?

You get the same message ‘booked through an agent’ for reward bookings… so in theory it should be same same.

Codeshare

Have the VA PNR

Even the VA website/app says, "seat selection unavailable" and the Air Canada site shows "This flight is operated by VIRGIN AUST INTL FOR VIRGIN AUST. Seat selection is not available on our website. You’ll need to complete your seat selection with the airline operating your flight. Seat fees may apply."

 

[MEL_Traveller]

Codeshare

Have the VA PNR

Even the VA website/app says, "seat selection unavailable" and the Air Canada site shows "This flight is operated by VIRGIN AUST INTL FOR VIRGIN AUST. Seat selection is not available on our website. You’ll need to complete your seat selection with the airline operating your flight. Seat fees may apply."

Maybe the codeshare is complicating it?

Award tickets are all prime numbers, and never had an issue in the 6+ aeroplan issued awards for travel on VA. But you have to call, as you did.

Only difference here is that is seems you are on an AC flight number, operated by VA.

 

[simmomelb]

Maybe the codeshare is complicating it?

Award tickets are all prime numbers, and never had an issue in the 6+ aeroplan issued awards for travel on VA. But you have to call, as you did.

Only difference here is that is seems you are on an AC flight number, operated by VA.

Yeah, I think we'll give up and accept a random seat. Air Canada call centre wait times are outrageous.

After all, it's only the VA metal short flight MEL to SYD that's the issue. No biggie, just annoying.

 

[Lukeyd]

Same issue here when booking a VA flight with the AC codeshare number. Air Canada call centre can't do any seat selection, and the Virgin Australia call centre can only allocate a 'free' seat - there is no way I can pay to select a seat. Seems like a weird IT limitation.

 

[simmomelb]

Same issue here when booking a VA flight with the AC codeshare number. Air Canada call centre can't do any seat selection, and the Virgin Australia call centre can only allocate a 'free' seat - there is no way I can pay to select a seat. Seems like a weird IT limitation.

Exactly. So if you are platinum + you can get VA to allocate you a free Econ X seats. If it's any seat that requires a payment, it's impossible to select via Air Canada or Virgin Australia. Both websites state to call the other airline and the call centres do the same.
Yet calling either gets you nowhere.
So if free seats can be allocated it's not an IT limitation, it's an agreement that the airline that sold you the ticket, is their responsibility, as per their agreement, to sell you the seat, yet there has been a major communication breakdown between Air Canada and Virgin Australia as to this process, since they started their relationship.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

Exactly. So if you are platinum + you can get VA to allocate you a free Econ X seats. If it's any seat that requires a payment, it's impossible to select via Air Canada or Virgin Australia. Both websites state to call the other airline and the call centres do the same.
Yet calling either gets you nowhere.
So if free seats can be allocated it's not an IT limitation, it's an agreement that the airline that sold you the ticket, is their responsibility, as per their agreement, to sell you the seat, yet there has been a major communication breakdown between Air Canada and Virgin Australia as to this process, since they started their relationship.

But if you are in a AC code share, operated by VA, you wouldn’t be entitled to free economy x as a platinum or higher? The rules are that it has to be operated by VA with a VA fright number. Unless they just mean operated by VA and it happens to carry a VA flight number as well as any other code shares.

It seems code shares are the main problem here. VA can assign seats with a pure VA flight number, even if issued by AC.

 

[simmomelb]

But if you are in a AC code share, operated by VA, you wouldn’t be entitled to free economy x as a platinum or higher? The rules are that it has to be operated by VA with a VA fright number. Unless they just mean operated by VA and it happens to carry a VA flight number as well as any other code shares.

It seems code shares are the main problem here. VA can assign seats with a pure VA flight number, even if issued by AC.

You can definitely book your flights directly via the Air Canada website, Melbourne to Vancouver via SYD or BNE (VA on the domestic leg) and call VA for a free econ X seat if you are Platinum. I'm travelling with 5, 3 of us are Platinum, and we 3 easily managed to get VA to allocate our Econ X seats via the call centre, which they specifically said they could do as there is no charge for those seats due to Platinum status. They said the issue is where there is a charge, eg, Gold, Silver, Red wanting to buy Econ X, for example.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

You can definitely book your flights directly via the Air Canada website, Melbourne to Vancouver via SYD or BNE (VA on the domestic leg) and call VA for a free econ X seat if you are Platinum. I'm travelling with 5, 3 of us are Platinum, and we all easily managed to get VA to allocate our Econ X seats via the call centre, which they specifically said they could do as there is no charge for those seats due to Platinum status. They said the issue is where there is a charge, eg, Gold, Silver, Red wanting to buy Econ X, for example.

VA flight number on the domestic, as opposed to an AC flight number (code share)?

Agree there are no issues for a prime VA flight booked via AC.

 

[simmomelb]

VA flight number on the domestic, as opposed to an AC flight number (code share)?

Agree there are no issues for a prime VA flight booked via AC.

The flight number is AC, being AC2795, MEL to SYD with Virgin.
The return from BNE to MEL is AC2728.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

So other than a paid domestic seat, seems to work ok.

 

[simmomelb]

So other than a paid domestic seat, seems to work ok.

I stand corrected. I just called VA for the 4th time, and today they took the payment for Econ X.
Odd, they couldn't/wouldn't before.

UPDATE: VA has just called me back to say they removed passengers from row 3 and will now refund my money, as it was booked via Air Canada and cannot select seats when this is done, random seats will be reallocated. WHAT A JOKE!

Air Canada's website states...

This flight is operated by VIRGIN AUST INTL FOR VIRGIN AUST.​

Seat selection is not available on our website. You’ll need to complete your seat selection with the airline operating your flight. Seat fees may apply.

 

[FlyingKangaroo]

I stand corrected. I just called VA for the 4th time, and today they took the payment for Econ X.
Odd, they couldn't/wouldn't before.

UPDATE: VA has just called me back to say they removed passengers from row 3 and will now refund my money, as it was booked via Air Canada and cannot select seats when this is done, random seats will be reallocated. WHAT A JOKE!

Air Canada's website states...

This flight is operated by VIRGIN AUST INTL FOR VIRGIN AUST.​

Seat selection is not available on our website. You’ll need to complete your seat selection with the airline operating your flight. Seat fees may apply.

Very frustrating, and also very clear here now that this is simply 100% an IT limitation. Reading your earlier posts, and from too many frustrating experiences of my own, I wondered to what extent the call centre staff in Manila were simply repeating what you were already seeing on the screen. So often when you speak to them it feels as if they really are looking at the exact same interface you are and parroting it back.

But in this case, it appears someone actually tried to help and managed to do something, but the system later rejected the change -- perhaps part of a routine system sweep that ran into a snag when trying to confirm the $0 "charge" for EconX. I always noticed that choosing an EconX seat as a Plat still took me to that $0 "payment" page, which seems like an unnecessary formality but actually gives some insight into how the system manages/processes these as "charges" even when it's $0.

Indeed it means it's time to give up. VA's IT systems make Qantas look downright modern, which is a pretty scathing indictment.

I'm surprised they even bothered to call you to tell you, tbh.

 

[simmomelb]

3E 3F

Indeed it means it's time to give up. VA's IT systems make Qantas look downright modern, which is a pretty scathing indictment.

I'm surprised they even bothered to call you to tell you, tbh.

Well, when I booked Sao Paul to Chile on LATAM with Qantas, that was a pain to select seats on LATAM but I finally managed it. Then obviously the Chile to Sydney leg was fine (just saying, not easy either in my experience, but at least I got it done).

That was nice of them to call me back, yep. They did process the payment BTW, it's on my card (link was provided to pay this). Just waiting for the refund.

Basically, the manager I spoke with explained that it's not a system limitation; they are not allowed to take any financial transactions for a booking made through another travel agent/airline, if they do, it takes the sale away from that airline. Which reminded me that this is standard for most airlines.
The same as booking via a travel agent, if you want to make any changes, which incurs a fee, you must contact the travel agent directly, not the airline (generally).
As much as it annoys me, it all makes sense now.
They ended up putting those 2 family members in row 18 as they are free (no charge seats), and the other 3 of us are in row 3 due to platinum and no charge also.
The issue really is that Air Canada won't take a payment for Econ X, as it is really their responsibility, given it was booked via them.

 

[FlyingKangaroo]

Basically, the manager I spoke with explained that it's not a system limitation; they are not allowed to take any financial transactions for a booking made through another travel agent/airline, if they do, it takes the sale away from that airline.
The same as booking via a travel agent, if you want to make any changes, which incurs a fee, you must contact the travel agent directly, not the airline (generally).
As much as it annoys me, it makes sense now.
They ended up putting those 2 family members in row 18 as they are free, and the other 3 of us are in row 3 due to platinum and no charge also.

There has to be more to it than that, though, as I have had no issue making ancillary purchases for things like seats, pre-paid baggage, etc., directly with an operating carrier even when it was not the ticketing carrier or source of booking if booked via third party.

Seems to be an issue on some airlines and not others. Best I can surmise is the way those ancillary services are structured in some airlines' systems must be different to how they are in others such that some airlines can treat these add-on purchases as separate from (and therefore not "changing") the actual ticketed booking itself (that they understandably cannot touch).

 

[FlyingKangaroo]

Example re: above ^^^

Last week I helped a family member book a cash flight with American Airlines from Sweden to the US. All except the domestic US sectors are actually operated by Finnair. The Finnair sectors have AA codeshare flight numbers. AA website directed to Finnair. Finnair website tried to throw up an error when selecting online. Had no issue at all calling in and paying for seat assignments directly with Finnair (aside: I still think this is asinine in premium cabins, but alas, becoming a trend!).

Similar fact patterns; different outcomes, which to me means it's not black-and-white one way or the other. Something else is at play.

 

[simmomelb]

There has to be more to it than that, though, as I have had no issue making ancillary purchases for things like seats, pre-paid baggage, etc., directly with an operating carrier even when it was not the ticketing carrier or source of booking if booked via third party.

Seems to be an issue on some airlines and not others. Best I can surmise is the way those ancillary services are structured in some airlines' systems must be different to how they are in others such that some airlines can treat these add-on purchases as separate from (and therefore not "changing") the actual ticketed booking itself (that they understandably cannot touch).

Yep, I just know the times I have booked via Flight Centre for Qantas or United, I was always redirected back to Flight Centre for any extras/changes etc.

I genuinely thought I'd managed to get the upgrade when I was emailed the Sabre payment link and made the payment, until I saw Virgin Australia appearing on my mobile screen 30 minutes later. Doh!!!