Anyone experience deep vein thrombosis?

[Pushka]

I used to suffer dreadful ankle swelling, even on short domestic flights. Have done so for years. Then I took up an intensive gym programme. Last time I flew - no more swelling. Exercise those calves.

 

[cosi]

Vicarious veins can triger DVT

 

[legroom]

Maybe you were thinking of varicose veins.

If so, .... not really.

Vicarious veins can triger DVT

vicarious
vɪˈkɛːrɪəs,vʌɪ-/
adjective
[COLOR=#878787 !important][/COLOR]

• 1.
  experienced in the imagination through the feelings or actions of another person.
  [COLOR=#878787 !important]"this catalogue brings vicarious pleasure in luxury living"[/COLOR]
  [TABLE="class: vk_tbl vk_gy"]
  [TR]
  [TD="class: lr_dct_nyms_ttl"]synonyms:[/TD]
  [TD]indirect, second-hand, secondary, derivative, derived, at one remove,surrogate, substitute, substituted, by proxy; More
  
  
  
  [/TD]
  [/TR]
  [/TABLE]
  
  
  
  
• 2.
  acting or done for another.
  [COLOR=#878787 !important]"a vicarious atonement"[/COLOR]
  
  

 

[cosi]

Correct, my spelling mistake.

 

[drron]

The definitive word just released by the CDC-
Deep Vein Thrombosis & Pulmonary Embolism - Chapter 2 - 2014 Yellow Book | Travelers' Health | CDC

It is not due to the cramped seating in Y.Both BA and JAL in the early noughties studied DVTs and PEs.Although more people in Y had the condition the Incidence was greatest in F,intermediate in J and less frequent in Y.

I moved to the Sunshine Coast in the early nineties.By 1994 I termed dvts/pe as the Victorian Pensioner Syndrome whose incidence peaked in June and July as they packed themselves up and drove straight through to the Sunshine coast to over winter.

 

[legroom]

I did not realise that > 40 yrs old is already a risk factor.

I thought > 65 is more like it.

The definitive word just released by the CDC-
Deep Vein Thrombosis & Pulmonary Embolism - Chapter 2 - 2014 Yellow Book | Travelers' Health | CDC

It is not due to the cramped seating in Y.Both BA and JAL in the early noughties studied DVTs and PEs.Although more people in Y had the condition the Incidence was greatest in F,intermediate in J and less frequent in Y.

I moved to the Sunshine Coast in the early nineties.By 1994 I termed dvts/pe as the Victorian Pensioner Syndrome whose incidence peaked in June and July as they packed themselves up and drove straight through to the Sunshine coast to over winter.

 

[Pushka]

I did not realise that > 40 yrs old is already a risk factor.

I thought > 65 is more like it.

Greater than 40 seems to be the new 65 these days.

 

[cove]

I like the 65 age better than that 40 age but it reels in more of us.
Is there any advantage in taking a diuretic 24 hours before a long haul flight as a help. I tend to have to take 2 or 3 a year to remove puffy ankles.

 

[Pushka]

I like the 65 age better than that 40 age but it reels in more of us.
Is there any advantage in taking a diuretic 24 hours before a long haul flight as a help. I tend to have to take 2 or 3 a year to remove puffy ankles.

Exercise fixed that for me after years of swollen ankles even with diuretics.

 

[cove]

I walk but I compensate with over active teeth.

 

[robs12]

So I don't think anyone's replied yet who has actually had a DVT? I have, about 4 years ago. I'm a fit guy (marathon runner) in mid 40's, so was a bit of a surprise after a relatively short flight (5hrs). Several months on anti-coagulants and it resolved fully, thankfully.
Many people get their legs swelling up during flights - this is not a DVT, generally just fluid retention.
Symptoms of DVT usually occur a while later - swelling, pain, red skin (as blood flows through surface capillaries/veins rather than main veins).
I had no swelling, no redness. Just woke up in pain a couple of weeks after flight feeling like foot was about to explode. Thankfully got it checked out and diagnosed quickly.
If you are not aware, and brush it off, you can die. Many people die of complications after DVT, and it is thought many are never diagnosed. Nobody really knows how many people are effected, since only those who present to doctors are counted of course.
Went through the tests for genetic factors but all negative. And no other factors (not overweight, not a smoker, not taking the pill etc).
Am still flying (too much) - precautionary measures (according to two haematologists) are - keep moving - do those exercises!, keep hydrated, wear compression stockings, take aspirin before and during flight, stretch out if possible (Premium economy or business preferred!), anticoagulant injections are an option, but I've never taken them.
Having had a DVT, I am statistically more likely to get another than those who have not. But being aware of the risk, I believe the chances are now lower than for many other people. I hope!

 

[cove]

Thanks for that robs12. I asked because a young fit under 40 got it despite being very active and no reason was given to him. It took a few weeks of daily injections to fix it.

 

[JohnK]

I used to suffer dreadful ankle swelling, even on short domestic flights. Have done so for years. Then I took up an intensive gym programme. Last time I flew - no more swelling. Exercise those calves.

Everyone says that.

Should I exercise until my feet, shins and calves start to ache? Should I worry about my knees, upper leg and hip at any stage? Or just exercice full bore? Ah, I am just a wimp without any will power....

 

[SamR]

Another one here who has had a DVT. Admittedly, I was taking medication at the time that predisposed me to clotting (didn't know that at the time), and my circumstances are a little rare, but this is what happened.

I did a fair bit of flying on a work trip one November. SYD-LHR-MAN-LHR-EWR-LAX-SYD. Seemed fine. Then, come Australia Day, I had the dreaded aching in my calf. Quite intense with inflammation, but I still had no idea what it was. I thought I'd pulled a muscle or something. I thought it would pass.

During February I started noticing mild shortness of breath. Still had no idea, neither did my GP. This culminated in me collapsing in late March and being hauled off to hospital. When they diagnosed me, the doctor said he didn't know how I was still alive. I had had a 23cm clot in my leg that had moved to my lungs. The mystery shortness of breath was probably bits of the clot breaking off, they said, but my body handled it.

I spent a week in hospital and have been on anti coagulants ever since. That was three years ago. I fluked the great fortune of being looked after by probably the best pulmonary doctor in the country, and it's been his decision to keep me on the drugs. I don't argue.

I guess the moral of the story (apart from hydrate and move around on your flights) is that the clots can get you even months after your flight. The thing about blood clots is that once they take hold, they can keep growing and clotting, because that's what clots do. I'm long hauling it later this year. I'll be doing the compression stockings and on board exercises, that's for damn sure.

 

[legroom]

SamR and rob12

Thanks for sharing your stories

It's rare but all of us needs to keep an eye on prevention and be aware of the symptoms and signs described so well by these two AFFers.

 

[Pushka]

Everyone says that.

Should I exercise until my feet, shins and calves start to ache? Should I worry about my knees, upper leg and hip at any stage? Or just exercice full bore? Ah, I am just a wimp without any will power....

A few months ago I hated the thought of the gym. I found a gym class I really enjoyed then decided I also was going to do gym work. And use a personal trainer once a fortnight who sets me a programme for each month and gets a good technique going. So I do gym work with free weights and machines.

I used to suffer dreadfully with swollen ankles - cankles (straight line between calves and ankles) until last time when I flew and realised I had no swelling whatsoever.

I guess leg work is what has worked. Working intensively on calves.

If you experience leg swelling I think that compression stockings would work against you and create areas where blood clots could form. When I was using them they would simply create areas of significant skin wrinkling because the swelling has to go somewhere if other areas are being compressed.

 

[serfty]

A friend of ours just under 40 years of age was subjected to 4 months of intensive DVT treatment after contracting it after being driven by her husband to/from the Sydney Olympics.

Afaik, she is still on preventative medication to this day.

 

[kiwitripper64]

I had a calf DVT about 7 years ago flying back from Germany. I was fit, around 40 and had no major risk factors. I probably overused the J hospitality, got a bit dehydrated and slept on the plane, so didn't walk around. When I got back I had a sore calf that felt like a small muscle strain, which was unusual as I had not been exercising. The skin around the calf was not tight or inflamed, so not a " classical symptomatic" DVT. After 2 days I popped down to radiology and had an ultrasound which showed a small clot in the calf. Because of the position of the DVT clot it was decided to not treat with anticoagulants, but wait and see. Sure enough, the calf cleared up a few days later.
One of the researchers just down from us was involved in an longhaul airline DVT study. DVT were first seen in WWII with people falling asleep in air raid shelters in deck chairs and not waking up. After the war this wasn't such a big issue. With mass travel the problem grew, but seemed to be a media issue around the time of the Sydney Olympics in 2000 where several athletes got DVT on the way to Sydney. ( there is some evidence that big leg muscles and large veins contribute to risk of DVT )
Their study on random long haul passengers showed that DVT were not uncommon, but most would not have have been diagnosed if they were not on the study as there were no or very minor symptoms. And most DVT did not require treatment. Anticoagulation is not without risks. Also of interest was that several people on the trial had PE ( pulmonary embolism ) that can be life threatening and requires urgent treatment but they did not have any symptoms apart from feeling a little tired. So it is hard to estimate how common DVT actually are because many of them do not have any symptoms and self resolve.
The advice given to me was take half an asprin/day for 3 days prior to travel, wear compression socks, have a balance between wine and water and try walk around the cabin a bit. This has worked so far I think, considering the problem in spotting a clotted vein

 

[JohnK]

If you experience leg swelling I think that compression stockings would work against you and create areas where blood clots could form. When I was using them they would simply create areas of significant skin wrinkling because the swelling has to go somewhere if other areas are being compressed.

I was prescribed compression stockings ~15 years ago. I wore them for 3 days and never again. Instead of the cut mark from normal socks being around the ankles the cut mark moved to just below the knee and this was much worse.

I wish I could exercise as easily as you make it sound but the reality is that it is not that simple. I must be at least twice your weight and I suffer from other conditions that make exercising almost impossible. Even golf after 11-12 holes I get really sore feet where I cannot stand on them without driving pain but my stubborness keeps me going. Golf isn't just about physical work out but a mental workout for me as well. Golf makes me feel better.

 

[drron]

Well John I can give you an excuse re exercising.
Got home yesterday after my knee operation.Last night my lower leg became swollen,very painful,red and hot.all the bad things go through your mind.
But my leg ultrasound showed no clots.No evidence of infection.My orthopod though had seen it before-too much exercise.So an afternoon with leg elevated,cold packs and no exercise things are improving.
Now if anyone in the past had told me I would be prone to harm from too much exercise I would have died laughing.