Responsible Service of Alcohol Laws and Qantas Lounges

[JohnPhelan]

I've certainly seen - and actually been travelling with - people denied more drinks in the QF lounges. So the policy is certainly there.

As always, it's a subjective call on the part of the individual member of staff.

 

[Berlin]

Although in the Baden-Wurttemburg region I found you can't buy alcohol from petrol stations after 10:00pm......

Oh yes- in Bavaria not either, I noticed that last time I was there. It certainly was different back when I grew up there- my granny filled me up with her very "special" fruit punch for the first time when I was three :shock:

 

[harvyk]

There has only been once where I've seen ppl in the lounge who should be cut off, and for all I know they where.

I also suspect that QF take their RSA responsibilities far more serious than any suburban club or pub (where I have seen lots of ppl who should have been cut off, but where not), because unlike at a pub where once you've had enough they can get a big guy to throw you out the door, it's a bit more difficult and expensive at 37,000 feet.

The problem is that alcohol does not affect a person at the exact time they drink it. It's not like once I finish a beer I have exactly 1 beers worth of alcohol in my blood. It's more a bell curve which means there is a delay from once I have finished that beer to the time all the alcohol is in my blood, to of course the moment that the last of the alcohol has left my system.

 

[777]

Oh yes- in Bavaria not either, I noticed that last time I was there. It certainly was different back when I grew up there- my granny filled me up with her very "special" fruit punch for the first time when I was three :shock:

And you reckon parents who let their kids fly are irresponsible?!?!

I agree drunk preschoolers have no place on planes before anyone asks.

 

[Berlin]

And you reckon parents who let their kids fly are irresponsible?!?!

Let's better not start THAT discussion again. :shock:

My liver simply got trained very early so that I can make the best out of the Flounge in later age

 

[samh004]

The problem is that alcohol does not affect a person at the exact time they drink it. It's not like once I finish a beer I have exactly 1 beers worth of alcohol in my blood. It's more a bell curve which means there is a delay from once I have finished that beer to the time all the alcohol is in my blood, to of course the moment that the last of the alcohol has left my system.

And lets not forget, altitude can affect you, so if you've already flown and been pressurised, you may be feeling (and looking like you're feeling) the effects despite not having very much.

 

[RooFlyer]

Get out your tin foil hats, its conspiracy time.

QF and all other airline lounges should be bound by the liquor licence of that particular state.

Liquor licences are available to the public on the internet

Here is QLD and NT QP. http://notes.nt.gov.au/ntt/dibrglll...56e0f0027a51c?OpenDocument&Highlight=2,qantas

https://secure.olgr.qld.gov.au/form....pdf?sid=d0403e5d-5d4a-4c30-947a-6005aa238517

Yay! Thanks for that. Maybe worth running a poll on. What do you think?

 

[RWJ777]

In the Domestic J Lounges I have never seen it, but walking out of the J Lounge in MEL into the QP to the exit on a Friday afternoon it's pretty much guaranteed. Also, who hasn't sit in front of work colleagues travelling back together who boarded drunk, and continue to drink as much as they can on the MEL-SYD sector?

All of this is much exacerbated by the break in RSA supervision; a few (or more) drinks at the QP or J lounge and then onto a flight meaning that the nexus of oversight started in the lounges is lost with the fresh provision of service on the aircraft. This is, of course, limited in Y by virtue of generally only one drink being available, but in J they positively foist the alcohol on you, especially if you're the only one, or one of few, drinking a particular wine.

So even if each server is doing so responsibly, their connection is broken by the different steps in the travel chain; a flying pub crawl of sorts.

 

[ashleyn]

Let's better not start THAT discussion again. :shock:

My liver simply got trained very early so that I can make the best out of the Flounge in later age

That was a great thread, I vote it the best for 2013 already. It really got people going.

 

[amaroo]

Let's better not start THAT discussion again. :shock:

My liver simply got trained very early so that I can make the best out of the Flounge in later age

I understand. Spent some time in a few factories in Bavaria.....beer dispensing vending machines on the floor:shock: and we think our unions have total control:!:

 

[Mal]

All of this is much exacerbated by the break in RSA supervision; a few (or more) drinks at the QP or J lounge and then onto a flight meaning that the nexus of oversight started in the lounges is lost with the fresh provision of service on the aircraft. This is, of course, limited in Y by virtue of generally only one drink being available, but in J they positively foist the alcohol on you, especially if you're the only one, or one of few, drinking a particular wine.

So even if each server is doing so responsibly, their connection is broken by the different steps in the travel chain; a flying pub crawl of sorts.

Surely if this was an issue, then you would see many diversions due to alcohol issues. Strangely you don't. Likewise, there are only a couple of times i can recall seeing issues onboard due to alcohol - and in at least one of the cases, the person had pre-drunk outside of the lounge.

 

[RWJ777]

Surely if this was an issue, then you would see many diversions due to alcohol issues. Strangely you don't. Likewise, there are only a couple of times i can recall seeing issues onboard due to alcohol - and in at least one of the cases, the person had pre-drunk outside of the lounge.

Diversions of service occur if there is trouble on board, if a passenger is being rowdy, or failing to follow lawful directions, or posing a threat to other pax, crew or indeed to him/herself. RSA has a much lower threshold -- and aims to prevent any of these events from occurring. RSA deals with potential as much as actual.

My point is that RSA is fractured by different servers of alcohol in different 'links' of the flight chain: service in a lounge and then different service on board, despite all being part of the one flight experience and the one RSA obligation by the same service provider.

 

[Simo]

I have never seen anything like you have maybe a person who seems a bit drunk but nothing like what you have described.

I was at DRW lounge with a mate and they would not serve us any more drinks until we had finished the drinks in front of us.

 

[Shelf]

^That sounds like a challenge!

 

[ChrisFlyer]

I'm not knowledgeable on the RSA laws, but how does this fit in with serve yourself wine where you can pour as much as you want - up to the size of the glass available.

I'm actually not sure, and I used to work in a bar (and have a current RSA qualification)! There was nothing about self-service alcohol in the course (I have a Qld RSA, which is apparently different from the NSW/VIC course), only a footnote about how pressurised cabins can increase the effect of alcohol (on some people with smaller body types/lower alcohol tolerances, having 3 standard drinks on the ground results in the same behaviour as only one in the air). Eg. have 4 standard drinks on the ground and hop straight onto a flight - for such people, they will then show signs of having consumed ~12 standard drinks. It didn't really go into it in very much detail, though I imagine that the majority of people with higher tolerances wouldn't be affected anywhere near as much... I wouldn't mind backing that up with a bit of medical research one day when I have a bit more time to Google and JSTOR though!

To self-service - I suppose it's implied that staff would need to keep an eye on patrons and ask them not to consume any more when appropriate, though outside of airport and hotel lounges, I can't really think of anywhere else that is self-serve (bottle service in restaurants aside, as they usually serve it to you by keeping your glass full-ish anyway). Though I must say, I do also love the BNE F lounge for the free-pour Baileys - I'll never go on a rant about the alcohol in that lounge

 

[Mal]

Diversions of service occur if there is trouble on board, if a passenger is being rowdy, or failing to follow lawful directions, or posing a threat to other pax, crew or indeed to him/herself. RSA has a much lower threshold -- and aims to prevent any of these events from occurring. RSA deals with potential as much as actual.

But seeing this is a rare event and in many cases caused by a bogan self serving alcohol before and on the flight... I can't see the link. Drunks in nightclubs cause fights. The worst I've seen onboard is passing out and or needing to use the lav.

I still dont agree with the assertion that rsa fails in qantas lounges.

 

[RWJ777]

But seeing this is a rare event and in many cases caused by a bogan self serving alcohol before and on the flight... I can't see the link. Drunks in nightclubs cause fights. The worst I've seen onboard is passing out and or needing to use the lav.

I still dont agree with the assertion that rsa fails in qantas lounges.

My point is that I think the oversight of it is fractured in the different steps of travel; someone in the lounge might be ensuring RSA for a particular passenger (of which there have been accounts here) and then that passenger leaves the lounge and gets on a flight and the RSA starts over again (unless of course the person is very obviously intoxicated or obnoxious).

But I appreciate that you have a different view, which is fine. And I also appreciate the respectful and measured manner in which you have expressed it. Too often lately here, people have expressed different views in an aggressive manner.

 

[samh004]

My point is that I think the oversight of it is fractured in the different steps of travel; someone in the lounge might be ensuring RSA for a particular passenger (of which there have been accounts here) and then that passenger leaves the lounge and gets on a flight and the RSA starts over again (unless of course the person is very obviously intoxicated or obnoxious).

What you need is some futuristic world where the boarding pass (or QF card) has an RFID and information is recorded on it, somehow, with every drink and every pour, so that when boarding the place, the cabin crew immediately know that they're not to serve you any more, or more likely, bring you a coffee and a pillow.

It's not too futuristic, but we're not there yet!

 

[The Rok]

What you need is some futuristic world where the boarding pass (or QF card) has an RFID and information is recorded on it, somehow, with every drink and every pour, so that when boarding the place, the cabin crew immediately know that they're not to serve you any more, or more likely, bring you a coffee and a pillow.

It's not too futuristic, but we're not there yet!

Please Sam, delete that post and scrap that idea from your mind, it would leave me high & dry, pun intended.

Christmas morning I drank 3 bottles of very nice champagne and topped it off in the afternoon/evening with about 10 bottles of corona.

I have been known to drink upwards of 20 (yes 20) pints of bulmers or Heineken and still be fully in control of my actions. The amount people should be allowed to drink has little or nothing to do with the number of standard drinks, but how the individual human body processes those drinks.

 

[Blinky]

Not airline related, so a bit off topic, but I went to a movie in Gold Class on my own, and ordered a bottle of wine. The waiter (who looked 18) asked me if I was driving, and I said no. He then proceeded to tell me that a whole bottle was a lot to drink, but reluctantly sold it to me. RSA gone crazy.