SYD-NYC/LA-SYD - Korean Air or Qantas?

[sydneyswans910]

Hey everyone,

I'm new on AFF and need your advice

I'm planning to fly SYD-NYC on the 28th-30th June (dates flexible), and from LA-SYD either on the 18th or 19th July. Korean Air is showing up at around $2200, Qantas is $2650. Is it worth it to fly the extra hours to stopover at Seoul (approx an extra 15hrs all up) and save some money, or go Qantas? On QF I can fly the A380 as well, while Korean Air is the B777-200/200ER, 777-30ER and 747-400 (not too sure whether these are good, especially for long haul). Are there any other airlines I should consider?

Thanks!

 

[Boris spatsky]

I take it that this is in Economy? If Korean offer a free overnight in Seoul each way, then take it. They ate a great airline. Aus to NYC in Y without a stop on QF would hurt.

 

[Hvr]

Welcome to AFF. The answer, it depends. On your frequent flyer program, how much you value your time and what seats you are seeking amongst myriad other factors.

Another route to New York from Sydney is to take Cathay Pacific from HKG and fly direct (or stop over briefly in Vancouver).

Happy travelling.

 

[Mwenenzi]

For Korean Air worth looking at the connection times (time of day).
If an overnight hotel (at your cost) changes the game
Is time or $ more important to you.

Others
- United
- Virgin
- Delta
- Hawaiian
- Air NZ via Auckland
- Air Canada [edit checked: very $$]

For these I have no idea of the connection USA west to east coast. May need a different airline

 

[Balwyn3103]

Does Korean Air now have in-seat IFE? The last time I flew them regularly they didn't and they had always run out of Western food by the time they got to me. Anecdotal evidence I know but shows how negative experiences get burnished in the memory.

 

[browski]

Korean Airlines is better because enroute to NYC, you avoid LAX.

 

[sydneyswans910]

Thanks for the replies! What's wrong with transiting in LAX? I will also be flying from Mexico to LAX when I return (flying with United), I will have a 3.5hr layover - taking into account the possibility of delays, is that enough time?

If I fly QF, here is one of the options:

[TABLE="class: full listAvailFlight"]
[TR="class: tr_first"]
[TD="class: firstcell"]13:05[/TD]
[TD]Sydney[/TD]
[TD]09:45[/TD]
[TD]Los Angeles[/TD]
[TD]Qantas flight QF11[/TD]
[TD="class: aircraft"]Airbus Industrie A380-800[/TD]
[TD="class: duration"]22h 25m[/TD]
[TD="class: cabinClass"][/TD]
[TD="class: listalternative"][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR="class: tr_inter tr_buttoncell"]
[TD="class: firstcell"]12:55[/TD]
[TD]Los Angeles[/TD]
[TD] 21:30[/TD]
[TD]New York (New York)[/TD]
[TD]United Airlines flight UA108[/TD]
[TD="class: aircraft"]Boeing 737-900
[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]

That allows for 3 hours (if it arrives on time).. There are other flights which leave later in LAX, but I don't want to arrive in New York too late.

Otherwise this is the Korean Air option:

28 Jun
SYD - 07:55 -> Seoul (ICN) 17.25 (10 hr 30m)
BOEING 777/200

Seoul (ICN) - Depart 19:30 → New York (JFK) - Arrive 20:40
Duration: 14hr 10mn - BOEING 777-300ER

Total duration: 24hr 40mn (26hr 45mn with connections)


18 Jul
LAX – 23.30 → Seoul – 03.50 (+2 days)
12hr 20m - Boeing 747-400

20 Jul
Seoul – 19.10 → SYD 06.25 (+1 day)
10 hr 15 m - Boeing 777/200
Total duration: 22hr 35mn (37hr 55mn with connections)


Miles is not too important (only Bronze with QF), it also appears that the times are better with QF. The prices with Korean Air also seem to change constantly - now it's at $2300. Is the aircraft used on Korean Air comfortable/good for sleeping? Don't mind too much about IFE as I can bring my netbook

 

[browski]

Thanks for the replies! What's wrong with transiting in LAX? I will also be flying from Mexico to LAX when I return (flying with United), I will have a 3.5hr layover - taking into account the possibility of delays, is that enough time?

The best way to describe LAX is to imagine that 9/11 happened the previous day to when you arrived and you are wearing a "I love New York" t-shirt written in Arabic.

You are better off flying KE.
Also, Fly United from Mexico to SFO (not LAX) and then connect to your Korean Airlines flight from there. Arrives SFO at 9.30am, departs SFO for ICN at 1.50pm

Enjoy.

 

[Alanslegal]

I know its the same price but SYD-HNL on JQ, HNL-NYC. Gives you a day or three stopover in Hawaii if you are interested.

 

[ozbeachbabe]

You could buy a one way positioning airfare SYD/AKL fare on AR1181 Thu 26 Jun for a total of AUD229.31 or do a one way frequent flyer award ticket if you have enough points.

The airfare below is for travel AKL/JFK/AKL booked through www.jetabroad.com.au however there would be nothing to stop you asking to checkin JFK to SYD only then cancel the SYD/AKL flight on arrival in SYD.

As for flying KE, I'm currently watching an Air Crash Investigation episode where a KAL cargo 747 crashes in STN so let's say I'm not in a hurry to book flights with them any time soon!

In this episode of ACI the Captain's attitude direction indicator (ADI) wasn't working properly but the F/O & F/E sat there liked stunned mullets ignoring the ridiculous angle of bank seen on the F/O's ADI because there's no such thing as CRM when the guy in the left hand seat has a distinguised career in the Korean Air Force.

http://www.airdisaster.com/cgi-bin/airline_detail.cgi?airline=Korean+Air+Lines

[TABLE="class: orderSummaryTable orderSummaryCollapsed"]
[TR]
[TD="class: firstColumn"]1 Adult
[/TD]
[TD]AUD 2,176.40
[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]
[TABLE="class: orderSummaryTable orderSummaryTotal"]
[TR="class: orderSummaryTotalRow"]
[TD]FINAL PRICE:
[/TD]
[TD]AUD 2,176.40
[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]

Many economy airfares are NON-REFUNDABLE and changes may not be permitted once purchased. Changes, if permitted, will incur penalties. Jetabroad booking fees are NON-REFUNDABLE Show Details

Cancellations and Changes
Please note that most domestic and international economy fares are NON-REFUNDABLE. Most business and first class fares are PARTIALLY REFUNDABLE. Where an airfare is partially or completely refundable, a Jetabroad processing fee of AUD $100 per ticket will apply in addition to any penalties levied by the airline(s). Most airfares allow changes to the dates and/or routings, but in most cases, change penalties will apply. Some airfares cannot be changed at all. Jetabroad booking and service fees are non-refundable. If you have any question regarding change or cancellation fees, please contact us PRIOR to completing your purchase.

Flight Details

[TABLE="class: flightSegmentTable"]
[TR]
[TH]Depart
[/TH]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Thu 28 Jun 6:15 AM
Auckland (AKL)
[TABLE="class: departAirportTable"]
[TR="class: flightBookingLegsRow"]
[TD="class: leftCell"]Qantas Airways QF50
[/TD]
[TD="class: rightCell"]Auckland-Sydney Economy Class
[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR="class: flightBookingLegsRow"]
[TD="class: leftCell"]Qantas Airways QF107
[/TD]
[TD="class: rightCell"]Sydney-Los Angeles Economy Class
[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR="class: flightBookingLegsRow"]
[TD="class: leftCell"]Qantas Airways QF107
[/TD]
[TD="class: rightCell"]Los Angeles-New York Economy Class
[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR="class: flightBookingLegsRow"]
[TD="class: leftCell"]Total travel time
[/TD]
[TD="class: rightCell"]26h 40m
[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]

[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TH]Arrive
[/TH]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Thu 28 Jun 4:55 PM
New York JFK, New York (JFK)
[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]

[TABLE="class: flightSegmentTable"]
[TR]
[TH]Depart
[/TH]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Wed 18 Jul 6:45 PM
New York JFK, New York (JFK)
[TABLE="class: departAirportTable"]
[TR="class: flightBookingLegsRow"]
[TD="class: leftCell"]Qantas Airways QF108
[/TD]
[TD="class: rightCell"]New York-Los Angeles Economy Class
[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR="class: flightBookingLegsRow"]
[TD="class: leftCell"]Qantas Airways QF108
[/TD]
[TD="class: rightCell"]Los Angeles-Sydney Economy Class
[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR="class: flightBookingLegsRow"]
[TD="class: leftCell"]Qantas Airways QF55
[/TD]
[TD="class: rightCell"]Sydney-Auckland Economy Class
[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR="class: flightBookingLegsRow"]
[TD="class: leftCell"]Total travel time
[/TD]
[TD="class: rightCell"]27h 50m
[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]

[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TH]Arrive
[/TH]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Fri 20 Jul 2:35 PM
Auckland (AKL)
[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]

 

[browski]

That's a ludicrous argument as to why to fly or not fly an airline.

 

[sydneyswans910]

You are better off flying KE.
Also, Fly United from Mexico to SFO (not LAX) and then connect to your Korean Airlines flight from there. Arrives SFO at 9.30am, departs SFO for ICN at 1.50pm

Enjoy.

Didn't think about that, thanks heaps Unfortunately I need to depart the US in the evening in order to match up with my Mexico flight.

 

[mannej]

That's a ludicrous argument as to why to fly or not fly an airline.

How is it any different to those not wanting to fly Garuda, JQ or QF based on safety issues (which may or may not be founded).

 

[browski]

How is it any different to those not wanting to fly Garuda, JQ or QF based on safety issues (which may or may not be founded).

There is no difference. Most of those arguments are are always more a reflection upon the poster rather than any realised risk. In this case it was even more of a stretch because the poster has generalised that:
A. All the Korean Airline pilots are Korean
B. All the Korean pilots come from the airforce
C. That all pilots know the flight history of their co-pilots
D. That all KE pilots in the face of danger (and contrary to their training) will act differently to every other airline pilot in the world

 

[ozbeachbabe]

That's a ludicrous argument as to why to fly or not fly an airline.

In my book safety has everything to do with whether to fly or not to fly with an airline.

There is no difference. Most of those arguments are are always more a reflection upon the poster rather than any realised risk. In this case it was even more of a stretch because the poster has generalised that:

A. All the Korean Airline pilots are Korean
B. All the Korean pilots come from the airforce
C. That all pilots know the flight history of their co-pilots
D. That all KE pilots in the face of danger (and contrary to their training) will act differently to every other airline pilot in the world

I based my opinion on the facts and subsequent findings that were reported in the official investigations into multiple fatal KE crashes which are well documented and available on public record.

 

[Timtammi]

Macolm Gladwell had a section in his book called "Outliers" about that specific crash I believe and how cultural attitudes came into play, from memory the book also talked about how KE has specifically addressed this issue in their training. I have seen the Air Crash Investigation episode referred to above as well as read "Outliers" and I still fly KE when it suits.

Cheers

Timmi

 

[sydneyswans910]

Hey everyone, I just booked my flights with Korean Air! It ended up being more than $500 cheaper since Qantas went up But I have another query - my return leg (LAX-SYD) looks like this:

[TABLE="class: tableFlightConf"]
[TR]
[TH="colspan: 3"]Los Angeles to Seoul [/TH]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: space"][/TD]
[TD="class: space"][/TD]
[TD="class: space"][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: textBold flight"]Flight 1[/TD]
[TD="class: textBold, width: 83%, colspan: 2"] Wednesday, July 18, 2012 [/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: textColorBold"]
[/TD]
[TD="colspan: 2"] [TABLE="width: 100%"]
[TR]
[TD="colspan: 3"] [TABLE="width: 100%"]
[TR]
[TD="class: textBold, width: 15%"]Departure:[/TD]
[TD="class: nowrap"]23:30[/TD]
[TD="width: 90%"] Los Angeles, USA - Los Angeles International, terminal B [/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: textBold"]Arrival:[/TD]
[TD="class: nowrap"]03:50 +2 day(s) [/TD]
[TD] Seoul, Korea (Republic of) - Incheon International [/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]
[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: space, colspan: 4"][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: textBoldSmallFlight, width: 15%"] Airline: [/TD]
[TD="width: 35%"] Korean Air KE012 [/TD]
[TD="width: 50%, colspan: 2"] [TABLE="width: 100%"]
[TR]
[TD="class: textBoldSmallFlight, width: 29%"]Aircraft:[/TD]
[TD] Boeing 747-400 [/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]
[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD][/TD]
[TD]
[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]

[/TR]
[/TABLE]
[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD][/TD]
[TD="class: space, colspan: 2"] [/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]
[TABLE="class: tableFlightConf"]
[TR]
[TH="colspan: 3"] Seoul to Sydney [/TH]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: space"][/TD]
[TD="class: space"][/TD]
[TD="class: space"][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: textBold flight"]Flight 1[/TD]
[TD="class: textBold, width: 83%, colspan: 2"] Friday, July 20, 2012 [/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: textColorBold"]
[/TD]
[TD="colspan: 2"] [TABLE="width: 100%"]
[TR]
[TD="colspan: 3"] [TABLE="width: 100%"]
[TR]
[TD="class: textBold, width: 15%"]Departure:[/TD]
[TD="class: nowrap"]19:10[/TD]
[TD="width: 90%"] Seoul, Korea (Republic of) - Incheon International [/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: textBold"]Arrival:[/TD]
[TD="class: nowrap"]06:25 +1 day(s) [/TD]
[TD] Sydney, Australia - Kingsford Smith, terminal 1 [/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]
[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: space, colspan: 4"][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: textBoldSmallFlight, width: 15%"] Airline: [/TD]
[TD="width: 35%"] Korean Air KE121 [/TD]
[TD="width: 50%, colspan: 2"] [TABLE="width: 100%"]
[TR]
[TD="class: textBoldSmallFlight, width: 29%"]Aircraft:[/TD]
[TD] Boeing 777-200/200ER [/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]
[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD][/TD]
[TD]
[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]

[/TR]
[/TABLE]
[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]
I arrive in Seoul at 3.50am, and depart the same day at 7.10pm. Will there be hotels open at this time? Or is it alright to sleep in the airport, and then put my luggage somewhere and walk around Seoul for a bit?

 

[ozbeachbabe]

But I have another query - my return leg (LAX-SYD) looks like this:
I arrive in Seoul at 3.50am, and depart the same day at 7.10pm. Will there be hotels open at this time? Or is it alright to sleep in the airport, and then put my luggage somewhere and walk around Seoul for a bit?

I would be calling Korean Airlines in Australia & see if they are able to provide a hotel which may include return transfers & breakfast. Bear in mind that if you arrive in SEL at 0350 on 20 July your room would need to be booked for the night of 19 July to guarantee immediate checkin. Checkout is probably around 1000-1100 on 20 July so unless KE provide day use as well you'll have to hang around for half the day before your return SEL/SYD.

Even if you do have to checkout in the morning, the hotel should still be able to look after your luggage if you want to sight see assuming you'll still feel like it. It's also possible that KE may be able to check your bags through from LAX to SYD as it's still a same day connection from 0350-1910. For this reason I would have a change of clothes, toiletries & everything you need for an overnight stay in your carry on.

 

[sydneyswans910]

Thanks Oz!! Called KE but they won't provide accommodation.. I've looked up a few cheap hotels but would prefer staying in the airport (at least during the day so I can leave my luggage/carry on in a locker somewhere).. Any good places in the airport to sleep? Anyone made do with a bench/lounge chair before?

 

[laffer]

For future reference, I was a fan of Air Tahiti Nui to NYC via Tahiti. Nice modern airline. Tahiti was a nice stop - although damn expensive. My wallet still hurts.

Good luck with your flight and trip.