Upcoming Qantas Frequent Flyer Changes

[epsc]

Anon Coward, you have missed the point. When our benefits are being reduced/degraded, it is not constructive to say 'just be thankful or go elsewhere'. Do you REALLY think Qf wants all the WPs to do that? It's a matter of quid pro quo - they get a lot out of us, and when others are getting their benefits enhanced, the most loyal of the bunch, namely WPs, should not be in the position of not even maintaining status quo!

And please, fellow-correspondents, don't apologise for those of us who have had the temerity to politely express out concern and ask for an explanation. The 'I'm sure it will get better for us' line simply does not reflect what has happened in the last 12 months.

 

[kirk7]

As a WP and Velocity Gold, I do feel that with the new changes- the gap between Platinum and Gold is very close in terms of benefits.

With Virgin announcing new lounges across the country (yet to try it), I'm getting swayed to shift my business to Virgin (especially those transcontinental flights to Perth).

I think if QF increased the status bonus to 125% there would not be this problem, even then its less % increase over the Silver and Gold as 150% will make it on par with the rest of the increases.

 

[simongr]

Red Roo

I'd like to appologise on behalf of some of the folk here.

Not all of us think you've done a bad thing. Yes you've eroded a fair bit of benefits off WP's in the last 18 months but this change has actually improved the overall QFF program. Some of the WP's feel a bit left out but they will get over it. If you sit back and look at it WP's a better place to be than SG that's for sure.

I hope you arent apologising on my behalf as I certainly feel I have nothing to apologise for!

Yes Wp is better than SG - is it twice as good though? On my case this three times as good?

 

[Blackadder]

so here it says that the new status bonus for Silver and Gold will be applied to AA & BA ? :?:

Yes the new changes apply to QF,AA,BA. Ticketed with a QF flight number
Also applies to existing booking made prior to the 17th May, for travel after 17th May if I am reading it correctly.

 

[Leumas]

I think you'll need to tighten up your WHERE clause with a

AND last_membership_year_QFSC >=

I can assure that we have run a lot of SQL for this review and exercised our spool pretty well!

Well, technically you haven't officially announced (just like the rest of the P1 level) if QF status is a condition. It's only been mentioned in passing.

I was responding to QF quotes mentioned in various press reports that you don't know how many members are involved and still working it out. If you do know, simply be honest, and stop trying to put spin on everything - just say it's commercially sensitive.

 

[serfty]

You sure about that (int exit rows?), because I selected 16A on my LAX-BNE flight coming up in a couple of weeks and it didn't cost me anything.

I too can select exit row seats as a WP at no extra cost ... on domestic flights and in PE, Business and First Classes internationally.

If I wish to do so in economy on international flights it costs from $40 (T-T) through $80 (Asia to/from Oz/Europe) to $160 (Oz to/from Europe/USA).

 

[Blackadder]

I too can select exit row seats as a WP at no extra cost ... on domestic flights and in PE, Business and First Classes internationally.

If I wish to do so in economy on international flights it costs from $40 (T-T) through $80 (Asia to/from Oz/Europe) to $160 (Oz to/from Europe/USA).

That came with the latest advance seat selecting changes, nothing changes there AFAIK (ie free to PS/SG/WP,CL on QF Dom and in Y+/J/F on QF Int)

 

[LiamR]

Has anyone seen this?

The Qantas Difference

 

[medhead]

The 'I'm sure it will get better for us' line simply does not reflect what has happened in the last 12 months.

In this case however, these announcements did include changes to upgrade arrangements and service delivery. We've been told these will be targeted at platinum. I just think we can express our feelings on the changes but should reserve final judgement until these extra details are announced. The wait is annoying, but just there is light at the end of tunnel (hopefully).

 

[connieguy]

The Gold Status bonus will increase from 50% to 75% and the Silver Status bonus from 25% to 50% when you fly Qantas (with a QF flight number on your ticket).

So what is going on here Red Roo?

Simple answer.

It appears that QF seems to think most of their WPs fly in J or F and that the increased J and F cabin bonuses will compensate the WP lack of any increase in the Status level increase.

Bottom line is:

1) If you are WP and fly in Y+, J or F, you get more miles per flight due to the increased J and F Cabin bonuses.

2) If you are WP and fly in Y or below, you get nothing extra.

Here is the Existing and Old QF Cabin versus Status miles earning matrix:



Which very clearly shows WPs who fly in Y or discount Y have been given nothing extra based on Status and Cabin variables.

This suggests the QF focus of this change is to encourage more Silver and Golds to travel with QF.

So are WPs who can't afford to fly J or F (and thus spend a LOT of time with their butts in the least comfortable and cramped Y aircraft seats) the disadvantaged group with this change? Sure seems so.

Oh my aching butt, back and knees from being 1.9 meters tall and sitting in Y seats.

 

[zeiron]

One of you is more profitable.

that may very well be the case.....but QF themselves have set the goalposts, and irrespective of how you score the goal, you've scored. penalty kick or long range shot? doesnt mattter, a goal is a goal
personally I think the jump from SG to WP is too large, given the "added" benefits of WP Vs SG are IMO, negligible.

Really? So if I spend $13k on a F class return between SYD-LHR, then I'm only contributing the same profit as someone who does 65 $200 SYD-MEL returns?

im not sure I understand your point? except to say that, whilst the net result may be the same, you need to remember the very point of a FF program.... and the key word is FREQUENT. Should 1 F class trip make you as loyal or frequent as a 200 Y- flyer? more profitable, likely. more frequent, absolutely NOT!

Im certainly not complaining about F/J/W and Status bonus's etc, but to suggest that an individual making the choice to fly 200 sectors with QF is somehow less worthy than someone who flies once in F, is simply ludicrous. I am amazed at the snobbishness and expectations of some people. If you are so rich to always fly F then do you really give a $hit about status and FF programs? Your fare class will get you all of the benefits you are complaining about having lost with these new enhancements. People, it seems want their cake and to eat it also!

 

[zeiron]

Oh my aching butt, back and knees from being 1.9 meters tall.

I wondered how long this would take to come up??
people seem to forget that air travel is a form of getting a thing (in this case, a human) from A to B. the size of the package is defined as the seat that you purchase. if you dont fit in the package, there are other options available to you.

looking at Australia post as an example. A standard domestic letter, must be of a certain size and weight. if the item you want to send does not confirm to the size and weight, then you are charged accordingly. Cargo carriers also have weight and volume restrictions. do you think it would be fair to send 1 metric tonne of cargo that filled the belly of a 747 freighter for the price of the weight of cargo alone?

At the end of the day, and as I once overheard a surly UA FA tell a grumpy passenger, there are 3 classes of service on this aircraft and in future you may prefer to select one that is more appropriate to your needs.

the world (or an airline) owes you zero. they do not and should not care if you are fat, tall, short or thin. they are offering you a seat. if you fit, bonus. if you do not, bad luck!

Oh and one final point.... a consumer has a right to choose any product they wish to buy. Wether that be a flight on a particular airline or alliance , or membership of a particular FF program. YOU HAVE A CHOICE. if you dont like it, find one that you do. but all this whingeing and moaning that SG's get too many benefits vs the toff WP's who for some reason think they are better than everyone below them and are now horrified that there will now be people above them (P1), is IMO simply ridiculous and somewhat childish.

 

[OverrideServlet]

So anyway. The guy that cuts my hair has this interesting loyalty model.

He explained to me that on my first visit to his salon I would be given a 30% discount. Upon each subsequent visit the discount would be reduced by 5%. I thought this was totally absurd but I didn't question it because I tend to only visit a salon once or twice before moving on to try another.

It turns out that I always get amazing haircuts there. So despite long surpassing the point at which my loyalty discount reached 0%, I still go back.

I've pretty much achieved WP status there. I don't have a shiny card to show for it but I get a personalised greeting even when I'm just strolling past the entrance on my lunch break (reminiscent of CX). I'm invited to return to the salon between appointments for free touch ups or modifications (Any Time Access?). And, if it happens to be quiet when I visit they'll offer a free head massage & hair treatment, etc (op-up?).

Do I find it a tough pill to swallow that I'm paying full price when some NB walks in off the street gets a 30% discount? No, because I always feel like a million bucks when the ride is over.

Anyway, I thought it was an interesting comparison. As I've mentioned a couple of times in this thread if QF is going to erode/devalue/whatever any benefits I get from being loyal to them then the base level product is going to need to be really good to keep my business.

 

[medhead]

So are WPs who can't afford to fly J or F (and thus spend a LOT of time with their butts in the least comfortable and cramped Y aircraft seats) the disadvantaged group with this change? Sure seems so.

Oh my aching butt, back and knees from being 1.9 meters tall.

Clearly more rewards are going to be there for those flying in premium cabins. For those of us flying mostly Y, we might benefit from the upgrade situation, but this is a pretty clear message.

 

[connieguy]

Clearly more rewards are going to be there for those flying in premium cabins. For those of us flying mostly Y, we might benefit from the upgrade situation, but this is a pretty clear message.

Crystal clear. Fly J or F or find another FF program.

Last year I did 3,200 SC and earned 8 x 5,000 miles = 40,000 miles. This year if I do the 3,200 SC again and I will get 4 x 8,000 miles = 32,000 miles. Ok 8,000 miles is not a big loss but on top of the ZERO increase in the miles I will learn from the 3,200 SCs I will earn flying in Y seats, it is an insult.

 

[gumpy]

Simple answer.


View attachment 2240

Which very clearly shows WPs who fly in Y or discount Y have been given nothing extra based on Status and Cabin variables.

This suggests the QF focus of this change is to encourage more Silver and Golds to travel with QF.

Does the status bonus difference of 25% matter to you? Expecially when it's people below you getting more than before as oppose to you getting less... You just want to feel more important than the people below you and it upsets you that they're encrouching on your importance... QF value WPs... if you think otherwise because of a 25% points earning change then I don't know what to say...

 

[MEL_Traveller]

Simple answer.



This suggests the QF focus of this change is to encourage more Silver and Golds to travel with QF.

So are WPs who can't afford to fly J or F (and thus spend a LOT of time with their butts in the least comfortable and cramped Y aircraft seats) the disadvantaged group with this change? Sure seems so.

Oh my aching butt, back and knees from being 1.9 meters tall and sitting in Y seats.

Exactly - and what i was alluding to several pages up in the thread.

Some of this is clearly about the competition from Virgin - and keeping mid tier flyers with QF that might otherwise jump ship.

QF beancounters will already have modelled the impact of these changes.

I would not hesitate to say most platinums are flying on corporate dime . Who would willingly fork out $16k to fly First class to London on a QF 747 rather than take the SQ/LH First class ticket for $10k??? You just wouldn't do it.

Who would willingly pat $10,$11 or $12k for a 747 skybed when you could fly Delta flat bed for $4500? If you are self funded it just doesn't make sense to fly Qantas premium. The points you get are a nonsense. The saving between the two airlines buys you a second business class ticket for free.

I know this is really tough.. but I made the decision to let platinum go. The 'freedom' you get from that is great. Lower fares, better airlines, better award redemption and the list goes on. All I have 'lost' from that is access to the F lounge when flying biz or economy.

The bottom line... markets respond to competition. If you don't like it then take the step and make the change!

 

[medhead]

Crystal clear. Fly J or F or find another FF program.

Last year I did 3,200 SC and earned 8 x 5,000 miles = 40,000 miles. This year if I do the 3,200 SC again and I will get 4 x 8,000 miles = 32,000 miles. Ok 8,000 miles is not a big loss but on top of the ZERO increase in the miles I will learn from the 3,200 SCs I will earn flying in Y seats, it is an insult.

Well clearly you need to take the 50000 points at 2400SC Hard to say anything else until we get the full WP1 details.

You've forgot the option to lower our expectations.

 

[connieguy]

Does the status bonus difference of 25% matter to you? Expecially when it's people below you getting more than before as oppose to you getting less... You just want to feel more important than the people below you and it upsets you that they're encrouching on your importance... QF value WPs... if you think otherwise because of a 25% points earning change then I don't know what to say...

I run a small business. I have no boss to buy me J or F tickets. I pay for my tickets. The miles help me to reduce my cost of flying. The Loyalty bonus changes just cost me 8,000 miles on the 3,200 SC I earned last year. The JQ Business changes just cost me $8,000 more for my flights to Asia. Every other position on the Cabin / Status matrix I just published gets MORE miles for the sectors they fly. For me, being a Discount Y WP I get nothing. You call that a fair go? You know how many miles I fly to get 3,200 SCs? HEAPS. And for all those miles and fares bought I now get -8,000 miles at an increased cost of $8,000.

Sorry mate but it you are Silver or Gold or WP and have someone paying for your J or F flying, it's sweet mate. But for me it is a sour pill QF have delivered that will effect my cost of flying to the negative in a big way.

 

[Reggie]

That's a fair point - however, there's plenty to distinguish AA's PLT and EXP levels, such as complimentary confirmed domestic upgrades on certain fares, a longer clearance window for other upgrades, 8 system-wide upgrades, waived award fees, and free drinks in the Y cabin.

Okay OT, is the free drinks in the Y cabin a EXP benefit over PLT? Does this extend to OWE?