Amber Electric

[Jacques Vert]

Ive always said to Amberrphiles - show me the 12 months electricity bills and total 12 months electricity import/export/ solar self consumption from the grid.
Don't show me the spot prices as spot prices are not indicative of anything.

OK. I've now been with Amber for over 12 months . My average cost for buying from the grid for the past 12 months has been 17.8 c/kWh.

OTOH, my average FIT for the past 12 months has been 24 c/kWh.

There have been very few price spikes in my area in the past couple of months but it's still working for me (haven't had a bill for more than 12 months and currently $1,384.97 in credit).

My referral code: mates.amber.com.au/EXT84RTG

 

[Quickstatus]

My average cost for buying from the grid for the past 12 months has been 17.8 c/kWh.

You forgot to provide the other half
Need actual energy consumption and energy export

 

[AuSammy]

OK. I've now been with Amber for over 12 months . My average cost for buying from the grid for the past 12 months has been 17.8 c/kWh.

OTOH, my average FIT for the past 12 months has been 24 c/kWh.

There have been very few price spikes in my area in the past couple of months but it's still working for me (haven't had a bill for more than 12 months and currently $1,384.97 in credit).

My referral code: mates.amber.com.au/EXT84RTG

The thing I ponder is whether the return achieved covers the reduced lifetime of the batteries due to increased cycling.

 

[Jacques Vert]

You forgot to provide the other half
Need actual energy consumption and energy export

I don't have that information readily available at present .

 

[VPS]

OK. I've now been with Amber for over 12 months . My average cost for buying from the grid for the past 12 months has been 17.8 c/kWh.

OTOH, my average FIT for the past 12 months has been 24 c/kWh.

There have been very few price spikes in my area in the past couple of months but it's still working for me (haven't had a bill for more than 12 months and currently $1,384.97 in credit).

My referral code: mates.amber.com.au/EXT84RTG

so how much effort are you putting in to make sure you're getting the best bang for you buck

 

[Quickstatus]

OTOH, my average FIT for the past 12 months has been 24 c/kWh.

Forgot to mention that the break even point for FiT which involve discharging the battery is in most cases more than 24c/kWh. In order to get 24c you would need to discharge the battery.

It's false economy to export at 24c when it is costing you more to charge the battery and the discharge the battery.

My average avg cost of buying electricity is 11c/kWh
When I export I only export excess solar.

Average monthly power bill $95
Not including cost of battery and solar on a c/kWh basis

In the last 12 months approx
Import from grid 29MWh
Export to grid 11MWh
Solar production 35MWh
Consumption 50MWh
Battery charge/discharge 15MWh

 

[Jacques Vert]

so how much effort are you putting in to make sure you're getting the best bang for you buck

I did a fair bit of checking around initially before deciding to give Amber a go but I haven't bothered checking other options for many months. However, if you have a better option I'ld be happy to hear it.

 

[Jacques Vert]

Forgot to mention that the break even point for FiT which involve discharging the battery is in most cases more than 24c/kWh. In order to get 24c you would need to discharge the battery.

It's false economy to export at 24c when it is costing you more to charge the battery and the discharge the battery.

Not sure I understand the point you are making.

In simple terms, if I'm averaging 24c/kWh for exporting and paying an average of 17.8c/kWh for importing (if and when I need to) then I'm making a profit. When I'm exporting excess solar then that is, of course, much better.

There is also the cost of the poles and wires but I currently have that covered thanks to all the lovely members here that have used my referral code.

As I'm currently averaging around $100 a month credit, I'm happy with that. But if anyone has a better deal then please let us know.

 

[Quickstatus]

I'm averaging 24c/kWh for exporting

What is the cost of discharging the energy from your battery so you can export at 24c/kWh?
It is not zero.

The cost can be estimated by amortising the capital cost of the battery over the warranted kWh over the warranty period usually 10 years. This needs to include opportunity cost.

 

[VPS]

I did a fair bit of checking around initially before deciding to give Amber a go but I haven't bothered checking other options for many months. However, if you have a better option I'ld be happy to hear it.

No other options but someone recommended Australia Cheap Electricity & Gas Provider | GloBird Energy

My question was really about whether you need to monitor your usage and when to buy and sell or does Amber do that for you

 

[Jacques Vert]

What is the cost of discharging the energy from your battery so you can export at 24c/kWh?
It is not zero.

The cost can be estimated by amortising the capital cost of the battery over the warranted kWh over the warranty period usually 10 years. This needs to include opportunity cost.

OK; I thought that you might be alluding to something like that and I admit I haven't looked into it that deeply. A more simple, if less accurate, method may be that if the payback period ends up being less than the life of the battery then I'm in front; although I won't know that for a few more year's yet.

 

[Jacques Vert]

No other options but someone recommended Australia Cheap Electricity & Gas Provider | GloBird Energy

My question was really about whether you need to monitor your usage and when to buy and sell or does Amber do that for you

Amber does it for me although you have the option of doing it manually.

Initially I did it manually as I thought I was smarter than the algorithm . I soon realised that a) I didn't have the time and b) I wasn't as clever as I thought I was and ended up with a bill for that month .

Since I've let Amber do its thing, I've received a credit every month including through winter although part of that has been referral credits.

 

[Quickstatus]

payback period ends up being less than the life of the battery then I'm in front

But that assumes a couple of things.

1)The cost of using the battery for the house is less than using the grid at the time the battery is used
2)The income from Fit is more than the cost of using the battery for export.

My suspicion is that 24c/kWh is less than the cost of using the battery on cents/kWh basis. If 24c/kWh is equal to the cost of using the battery to export, then the actual income that can be attributed to the payback period will be Zero.

My 48kWh battery has a cost of 23c/kWh. The cost of charging it from solar is about 5cents/kWh usingthe same calculation. But because I also have free 3 hours, I attribute half of the battery charging at Zero cents. So net 2.5c/kWh
This means the electricity that comes out of the battery is 25.5c/kWh.

This means that if the annual average Fit is 24c/kWh, exporting through amber actually cost me 1.5c/kWh and is a financial loss.

It is easy to amortise the capital over the warranty period
Use an amortisation calculator. Enter the capital amount of battery and opportunity interest rate - offset home loan rate for example.
Use 10 years or whatever the warranty period is
Use monthly as Amber has monthly bills.

Find the warranted kWh in the warranty.

Divide the total monthly payments by the warranted kWh to bet the $/kWh and convert to cents/kWh

Only export from the battery when the FiT is greater than the battery c/kWh (including the cost to charge the battery)

 

[Jacques Vert]

But that assumes a couple of things.

1)The cost of using the battery for the house is less than using the grid at the time the battery is used
2)The income from Fit is more than the cost of using the battery for export.

My suspicion is that 24c/kWh is less than the cost of using the battery on cents/kWh basis. If 24c/kWh is equal to the cost of using the battery to export, then the actual income that can be attributed to the payback period will be Zero.

My 48kWh battery has a cost of 23c/kWh. The cost of charging it from solar is about 5cents/kWh usingthe same calculation. But because I also have free 3 hours, I attribute half of the battery charging at Zero cents. So net 2.5c/kWh
This means the electricity that comes out of the battery is 25.5c/kWh.

This means that if the annual average Fit is 24c/kWh, exporting through amber actually cost me 1.5c/kWh and is a financial loss.

It is easy to amortise the capital over the warranty period
Use an amortisation calculator. Enter the capital amount of battery and opportunity interest rate - offset home loan rate for example.
Use 10 years or whatever the warranty period is
Use monthly as Amber has monthly bills.

Find the warranted kWh in the warranty.

Divide the total monthly payments by the warranted kWh to bet the $/kWh and convert to cents/kWh

Only export from the battery when the FiT is greater than the battery c/kWh (including the cost to charge the battery)

Thanks for the detailed reply.

I'll have a closer look into it when I get time.