Qantas Reveals new A321XLR and 787 Business Class Seats (new 787 frames only)

[MEL_Traveller]

They were pretty awful on the A330s. Literally like lying in a coffin, 6ft under due to the higher privacy walls!

https://runwaygirlnetwork.com/2023/07/coffin-class-new-inward-facing-herringbone/

But they should perhaps be given the benefit of context? Plenty other major airlines were still flying angled lie flats… so in comparison these seats - at the time - better than a lot of the alternatives!

 

[sevenfourtyseven]

Hopefully the updated J seats on the 787's don't get stuck in the current certification mess other carriers are encountering with new/updated seats and end up delaying the deliveries next year.

 

[Berlin]

There might be a bit more space on the sides, helping to ease that “coffin” feeling a bit. But the biggest issue persists: You hurt your neck trying to look out the window. And that’s what I tend to do over half the flight time- enjoy the views from above which are ten times more special than some silly movie on the IFE screen if you ask me.

Air NZ’s coffin class ALWAYS gave me neck pain for days. I started to actively avoid the entire airline on their widebodies because of that. And in other aspects, I quite like Air NZ.

 

[Melburnian1]

There might be a bit more space on the sides, helping to ease that “coffin” feeling a bit. But the biggest issue persists: You hurt your neck trying to look out the window. And that’s what I tend to do over half the flight time- enjoy the views from above which are ten times more special than some silly movie on the IFE screen if you ask me.

Air NZ’s coffin class ALWAYS gave me neck pain for days. I started to actively avoid the entire airline on their widebodies because of that. And in other aspects, I quite like Air NZ.

Many others must share your sentiments, as Air NZ has abandoned that layout.

 

[WilsonM]

Many others must share your sentiments, as Air NZ has abandoned that layout.

*will abandon that layout - I don't think the refurbs are done yet. VS also has the same herringbone coffins on its older planes.

But this product was chosen for economics, make no mistake - it takes up less room than reverse herringbone, enough to actually matter. Qantas can still advertise lie-flat, direct aisle access - unfortunately, on point-to-point Australia to Asia (except SIN) and transcon, it really doesn't feel the need to compete, as there's enough QF loyalists to ignore the competition.

I'm not saying this won't happen, but I'm a bit surprised they didn't announce a small section of 2-2 recliners on the A321XLR, basically a Premium Economy cabin - I feel like that would've sold quite well?

 

[jase05]

Yeah, I think that is a good point - they will be leisure routes so business class will be mostly boomer couples. The coffins are terrible and don't lend themselves to pairs of travellers. I quite like the SQ 737M business class seats 2-1-2 (couple, throne, couple) on each side - spacious and comfortable and full-length lie-flat. Not much privacy though.

Only had the one ITA A321 J flight and was very impressed with their setup for a narrow body.. I’d have no problem flying in those on longer routes. Not sure why other airlines haven’t followed their model

 

[MEL_Traveller]

Only had the one ITA A321 J flight and was very impressed with their setup for a narrow body.. I’d have no problem flying in those on longer routes. Not sure why other airlines haven’t followed their model

reverse herringbone, less efficient, too expensive.

 

[moa999]

Hopefully the updated J seats on the 787's don't get stuck in the current certification mess

Qantas had previously said they'd roll out the same seats for that reason.
So one would hope theyve got comfort that it's only a minor change to an existing design.

 

[elanshin]

Qantas had previously said they'd roll out the same seats for that reason.
So one would hope theyve got comfort that it's only a minor change to an existing design.

I was going to say the seat should already be certified as its flying, but actually its only flying on a350-900s not b787s.

Seat would need certification given it now has a suite door. It'd mainly an evolution of the current seat but it is updated and QF is also likely to install the row 1 suite First as well.

 

[downgraded]

These Herringbones on the A321 look horrific! I always loathed Air NZ for this stupid coffin seat design and now Qantas comes 20 years later just to install similar rubbish on their new planes!

I’m someone who LOVES looking out of the window so I absolutely hate locked 787 windows and seats pointing away from the window which guaranteed leave me with neck pain when I get off the flight.

Total fail from Qantas if you ask me! And no, that stupid flimsy door will not help, if anything it will make it feel like a coffin even further!

Not forgetting QF refitted the a330s in the 232 recliner config then had to block the middle seat with a tray because they so under estimated market backlash. The herringbone config has no quick fix but it's a bad choice from a team that doesn't appear to have considered actually asking for user feedback - looks more like "lie flat" = tick

 

[elanshin]

The herringbone config has no quick fix but it's a bad choice from a team that doesn't appear to have considered actually asking for user feedback - looks more like "lie flat" = tick

User feedback = other airlines.
This seat and setup isn't new. JetBlue is the first implementation and has been flying transatlantic for years now - lots of people love it. Some enough to fly them over widebodies alternatives.

Iberia's implementation seem reasonably well received and reviewed as well albeit not as well as JetBlue's.

Those 2 both look to have the same seat as QF.

Granted people seem to hate the AA version and implementation although that's a different seat design. United just showed their new Polaris with this configuration to mixed reactions.

Honestly, it'll probably come down to execution of the small details and soft product.

 

[SYD]

User feedback = other airlines.
This seat and setup isn't new. JetBlue is the first implementation and has been flying transatlantic for years now - lots of people love it. Some enough to fly them over widebodies alternatives.

Iberia's implementation seem reasonably well received and reviewed as well albeit not as well as JetBlue's.

Those 2 both look to have the same seat as QF.

Granted people seem to hate the AA version and implementation although that's a different seat design. United just showed their new Polaris with this configuration to mixed reactions.

Honestly, it'll probably come down to execution of the small details and soft product.

Also, despite the many comments above about the “economics” ie better use of space, it actually provides a bigger lie flat bed than reverse herring bone.

I guess we’ll see (no pun intended) if you can look out the window.

I’m happy to give them a try if or when the opportunity arises. Row 1 will be highly coveted.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

There are plenty of examples of seats in a similar situation where looking out the window is difficult… not least SQ…

https://thislifeintrips.com/wp-content/uploads/2024/07/TLITs_20240529_SIN_A380_011.jpg.webp

(courtesy of thislifeintrips)

 

[RooFlyer]

I’m happy to give them a try if or when the opportunity arises. Row 1 will be highly coveted.

I haven't heard that QF will monetise those front-row seats, that have extra room, into a 'business studio' product, like other airlines.

 

[SYD]

I haven't heard that QF will monetise those front-row seats, that have extra room, into a 'business studio' product, like other airlines.

I didn’t say they will just that they’ll be the pick of the bunch. Although possibly bassinet seats?

Alas, probably also blocked for CL/P1 access only.

 

[RooFlyer]

I didn’t say they will just that

No, I was just say’n

 

[QfHrGr]

The other problem I see with Qantas lining premium pax like corpses against the wall in their individual private coffins is the inward facing setup. During take off and landing, we have to have the window shades up so any external problems can be sighted. Well, the premium pax all lined up with their backs to the windows will be totally oblivious to any external issues. Very smart Qantas.

I suspect it won't get much Asian patronage if Qantas intends to fly these on Asian routes when there are other options.
As the cantonese saying goes (phonetically presented) - "choy³, tai kah lai see" to cleanse away the evil spirit. Me thinks the presentation is too closely associated with death.

 

[esseeeayeenn]

The other problem I see with Qantas lining premium pax like corpses against the wall in their individual private coffins is the inward facing setup. During take off and landing, we have to have the window shades up so any external problems can be sighted. Well, the premium pax all lined up with their backs to the windows will be totally oblivious to any external issues. Very smart Qantas.

I suspect it won't get much Asian patronage if Qantas intends to fly these on Asian routes when there are other options.
As the cantonese saying goes (phonetically presented) - "choy³, tai kah lai see" to cleanse away the evil spirit. Me thinks the presentation is too closely associated with death.

I think the shades up rule is more so rescuers can see in.

Does anyone have figures for how many A321s QF is ordering with these suites and how many will just have recliners? I want to know how likely we are to get the suites on trans con routes.

If I were running Qf (new thread idea?) I would introduce domestic PE and sell the recliners as that.

 

[moa999]

how many A321s QF is ordering

Current QF order book is for 48 321XLRs with 16 being the lie flat version.
The 16 lie-flat versions were part of an Aug 2025 order for an additional 20 aircraft, taking the order from 28 to 48.

Also an unknown number of options.

Receive 6 in FY26, and 8 then 5 expected over FY27 and FY28

Qantas have seemingly juggled the specs to get a lie flat delivery from CY28.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

The picture in post 1 unfortunately shows the one - or maybe 2 - rows which are misaligned and have the seat right on top of the window. You can see from the row behind that the window is forward of the seat, meaning just a slight turn if the head to look out the window.

Perhaps easier to look out than a window immediately beside you requiring a full 90 degree neck turn. Or one of the SQ windows in my previous post where you really strain to look out.

There will be ‘good’ seats and misaligned seats in this configuration, just as there are in most business cabins. Pick your seat wisely.

I’ve flown the VS version many times, never noticed anything *outrageous* in terms of looking out the window. I mean, it’s just a bad seat in general, but the window issue didn’t strike me as anything particularly bad