Qantas Project Sunrise goes ahead, 12 new A350-1000s ordered

[SYD]

3x SYD-LHR
3x MEL-LHR
2x PER-LHR
2x SYD-JFK (or 1x SYD-JFK at 3 weekly)
2x SYD-European or North American AA hub city (DFW or MIA)

Some uncertainty over whether PER-LHR will utilise the Sunrise aircraft or not. If PER-LHR is utilising a standard Long Haul aircraft, then perhaps replace PER-LHR with a MEL-European destination or North American hub.

MEL-JFK is not a certain lock for a Sunrise route, thus excluded from the list, also taking into considering SYD-JFK may not be daily to start off with.

I was pondering the actual number of total aircraft mentioned in that article - I’m sure the official numbers are in the QF Investor presentation and various press releases but is it something like:
12x “Sunrise” 4 Class A350s
12(?)x additional 4 Class A350s (without extra tanks but have F) - hence the ability to do F on LAX, SIN/LHR.
and
X(?)x 3 Class A350s to replace A330s
as well as additional B789s.

 

[moa999]

Don't believe QF has announced a layout for the 12 non-Sunrise 350s, and not due until FY28
Other firm order is for 4 789s and 8 78Xs from FY27
Plus purchase rights and timing flexibility on both

 

[SYD]

Don't believe QF has announced a layout for the 12 non-Sunrise 350s, and not due until FY28

That was part of the article and speculation on the config of non-Sunrise and A330 replacements. The article jumps around a bit, but states:

“The A350s which will replace the A380 superjumbo will be fitted out with the same suites and seats as their ultra-long range Project Sunrise siblings” (but no “well being zone”, instead extra whY seats)

It also says, “In addition to the non-stop Project Sunrise A350 flights, a dozen A350-1000 jets will also progressively replace the ageing A330s on international routes”. Which it goes on to say they’ll forgo F, will retain J, PE and whY. As well as considering more PE seats than the other A350s.

Other firm order is for 4 789s and 8 78Xs from FY27

The article states “a dozen factory-fresh Boeing 787s, beginning in 2028.” Which is consistent.

 

[leesionn]

That was part of the article and speculation on the config of non-Sunrise and A330 replacements. The article jumps around a bit, but states:

“The A350s which will replace the A380 superjumbo will be fitted out with the same suites and seats as their ultra-long range Project Sunrise siblings” (but no “well being zone”, instead extra whY seats)

It also says, “In addition to the non-stop Project Sunrise A350 flights, a dozen A350-1000 jets will also progressively replace the ageing A330s on international routes”. Which it goes on to say they’ll forgo F, will retain J, PE and whY. As well as considering more PE seats than the other A350s.


The article states “a dozen factory-fresh Boeing 787s, beginning in 2028.” Which is consistent.

I interpreted it in either one of two ways:

1. The non-Sunrise, A380 replacement A35Ks get all the same suites minus the wellbeing zone OR;
2. The non-Sunrise A35Ks are all fitted out with the same suites as the Sunrise A35Ks BUT omitting first class (i.e. keep the same seats for business, premium economy and economy) and minus the wellbeing zone.

In the case of my first interpretation, I'd assume that QF orders more A350s and omits first class in them, these ones being earmarked for A330 replacement.

But of course, I could be incredibly wrong.

 

[SYD]

I interpreted it in either one of two ways:

1. The non-Sunrise, A380 replacement A35Ks get all the same suites minus the wellbeing zone OR;
2. The non-Sunrise A35Ks are all fitted out with the same suites as the Sunrise A35Ks BUT omitting first class (i.e. keep the same seats for business, premium economy and economy) and minus the wellbeing zone.

In the case of my first interpretation, I'd assume that QF orders more A350s and omits first class in them, these ones being earmarked for A330 replacement.

But of course, I could be incredibly wrong.

Write or wrong, the article is pretty clear that there’s supposed to be two sub-variants of Four (4) Class A350s (F, J, PE and Y).

The third A350 variant (as A330 replacements) will be only Three (3) Class. The exact details of which are currently pure speculation but suggest only J, PE and whY.

 

[Daver6]

I'm calling it now. That well being zone either will be enhanced within a few years of operation or won't even make the starting line.

 

[SYD]

I'm calling it now. That well being zone either will be enhanced within a few years of operation or won't even make the starting line.

Replaced by these beauties!

We call 'BS' on these airline seats

Rumours of “standing-only” airline seats have been swirling for years, but Airline Ratings like many in the industry are calling BS on this concept and this is why.

www.airlineratings.com

 

[RSD]

Is there any advantage to ordering B787's as well as non-Sunrise A350's? Wouldn't it be better to drop the B787's and have more A350's Qantas is going to end up like Ansett (and the Egyptian Air Force) where they have a few of everything...

From everything that I have seen the A350 is the better aircraft compared the B787.

 

[Berlin]

I just hope Qantas will offer a direct service to Europe which is not just annoying Heathrow. London in itself isn’t of much interest to me personally and I absolutely loathe changing planes there. Paris, Frankfurt, even Helsinki for OneWorld connections would all be more useful in my personal opinion.

 

[moa999]

From everything that I have seen the A350 is the better aircraft compared the B787.

Remember QF already has 14 (edit from 11) 789s.

I suspect they both have their place.. the 350-1000 in particular is quite a bit larger to the 789.

 

[RSD]

I just hope Qantas will offer a direct service to Europe which is not just annoying Heathrow. London in itself isn’t of much interest to me personally and I absolutely loathe changing planes there. Paris, Frankfurt, even Helsinki for OneWorld connections would all be more useful in my personal opinion.

And going via Heathrow to get to continental Europe means that you are flying past your destination by a couple of hours. Most of us don't want to fly MEL-ADL via PER so flying say SYD-FCO via LHR makes even less sense. With Virgin in disguise doing Qatar now perhaps QF might do a daily service to DXB again so as pax can connect on to EK.

 

[RSD]

Remember QF already has 11 789s.

How far through their say 20 year life cycle are they?

I suspect they both have their place.. the 350-1000 in particular is quite a bit larger to the 789.

They are damn site nicer in Y than the B787's

 

[SYD]

How far through their say 20 year life cycle are they?

Only 6-8 yrs

They are damn site nicer in Y than the B787's

Give me an A330 in whY!

 

[Himeno]

How far through their say 20 year life cycle are they?

VH-ZNA was delivered in October 2017

 

[mviy]

QF would likely want to use both Boeing and Airbus to try to get better pricing from each.

Both SYD and JFK have curfews. I would think 3 aircraft would be needed for the SYD-JFK route just like SYD-LHR

 

[Himeno]

QF would likely want to use both Boeing and Airbus to try to get better pricing from each.

Both SYD and JFK have curfews. I would think 3 aircraft would be needed for the SYD-JFK route just like SYD-LHR

LGA has a curfew, JFK doesn't.

For a period when both QF1/2 and 9/10 were one stop A380s, they adjusted the times which allowed the use of 5 aircraft to cover both routes daily (which freed up an aircraft to go to DFW IIRC).

 

[Daver6]

I just hope Qantas will offer a direct service to Europe which is not just annoying Heathrow. London in itself isn’t of much interest to me personally and I absolutely loathe changing planes there. Paris, Frankfurt, even Helsinki for OneWorld connections would all be more useful in my personal opinion.

QF already do have direct services elsewhere. Both Paris and seasonally Rome. You're just living in the wrong city for it to be direct for you

 

[evanb]

This is all just a speculative reach by ET and everyone is reading too much into it. Qantas haven't confirmed the options for the additional A350s (i.e. the A380 replacements). We don't even know how many options they have!

Furthermore, the config of the non-PS A350s and the B787-10 haven't been confirmed. All that has been confirmed by both VH and CW is that they'll both have premium economy. There's also been no confirmation that the non-PS A350s will have F. In fact, CW's comments at CAPA indicate that they haven't made final decisions on the configs yet.

 

[evanb]

For a period when both QF1/2 and 9/10 were one stop A380s, they adjusted the times which allowed the use of 5 aircraft to cover both routes daily (which freed up an aircraft to go to DFW IIRC).

Correct. They won't need 3 aircraft for SYD-LHR-SYD and they won't need 3 aircraft for SYD-JFK-LHR. 2 each should be sufficient, however in reality to operate both routes daily they'll need 5 since the scheduling won't allow both to operate back-to-back. Furthermore, the turns will be tight meaning that they'll need more redundancy.

Remember QF already has 11 789s.

I suspect they both have their place.. the 350-1000 in particular is quite a bit larger to the 789.

They have 14 B789s, with another 4x arriving from 2027 or thereabouts. They also have 8x B787-10s coming.

 

[elanshin]

Is there any advantage to ordering B787's as well as non-Sunrise A350's? Wouldn't it be better to drop the B787's and have more A350's Qantas is going to end up like Ansett (and the Egyptian Air Force) where they have a few of everything...

From everything that I have seen the A350 is the better aircraft compared the B787.

QF already has 787 ops. Also with the aircraft manufacturing crunch right now, getting both aircraft makes more sense and allows for faster delivery.

The 787-10 and a359 roughly both fits similar mission profiles for heavy asia trunk routes.