Another great crew Dfw-syd

[parsonstrish]

I don't know about other long haul crews but I always find the qf 7 & 8 crews great. Another great crew 24/11. Well done Andrew & crew.

 

[opusman]

The US crews are usually excellent, maybe because they tend to be more senior.

UK/DXB crews, not so much.

 

[Brettmcg]

The US crews are usually excellent, maybe because they tend to be more senior.

UK/DXB crews, not so much.

On what do you base your claim that "US crews [...] tend to be more senior"?

This may have been the case on B744 services, but is certainly not true for routes operated by the A380.

 

[opusman]

On what do you base your claim that "US crews [...] tend to be more senior"?

The more senior you are the more priority you have when bidding for routes, and my impression is that most FAs don't particularly like the desert as somewhere to spend a couple of days. Hence you tend to get more senior FAs bidding for the USA and Asia.

 

[Brettmcg]

The more senior you are the more priority you have when bidding for routes, and my impression is that most FAs don't particularly like the desert as somewhere to spend a couple of days. Hence you tend to get more senior FAs bidding for the USA and Asia.

You obviously don't understand how Qantas crew their flights. QCCA (those who operate 380 routes) don't/can't bid for trips.

 

[RooFlyer]

On what do you base your claim that "US crews [...] tend to be more senior"?

This may have been the case on B744 services, but is certainly not true for routes operated by the A380.

You obviously don't understand how Qantas crew their flights. QCCA (those who operate 380 routes) don't/can't bid for trips.

Sorry to the OP if this diverts the thread ... but do tell us more brettmcg. How are crews chosen for the A380 routes? Are there any differences in the method of choosing for the LHR route Vs LAX? American 747 vs A380 routes? Genuine question - interesting subject.

 

[Brettmcg]

Sorry to the OP if this diverts the thread ... but do tell us more brettmcg. How are crews chosen for the A380 routes? Are there any differences in the method of choosing for the LHR route Vs LAX? American 747 vs A380 routes? Genuine question - interesting subject.

FYI - taken from Airline Hub Buzz

QANTAS, like other airlines has created different divisions for the resourcing of its cabin crew. The main scope for this is to gain cost efficiencies by offering a lower pay scale and in general award conditions not as favourable as those offered to existing staff, normally referred to as “legacy staff”. In 2008 with the introduction of the A380, QANTAS created QANTAS Cabin Crew Australia Ltd (QCCA). The cabin crew working under this company work under a different award to the their legacy “QANTAS Airline” (QAL) colleagues.

Basically, QAL crew bid on a seniority system as mentioned by opusman. These are the crew members who, under most circumstances, operate the A333 and B744 routes. Longer-serving crew tend to bid for the longer trips away (JNB/SCL/LAX/JFK) because this means higher slip allowances etc., however there's obviously no hard and fast rule and it all comes down to personal preference and flying patterns.

QCCA crew have no ability to bid for trips. They can swap among themselves, but aren't able to determine the destinations to where they fly. For MEL-based QCCA crew, this pretty much means shuttling backwards and forwards between LAX and DXB. Having said that, I'm told that in the next roster period there'll be varied flying which means some MEL crew will pax through the network and operate out of SYD to places like DFW and HKG. It's not often that Australian-based QCCA crew get up to LHR, as most of the DXB-LHR tags are operated by the LHR base. It does happen from time to time, but a handful of LHR crew operating all the way through to AUS seems to be more common.

Then there are Jetconnect Longhaul (based in NZ) who operate on both the A380 and the B744 (I believe this is a legislative issue - CASA won't allow it, the CAA does). I'd say the varied flying and choice of destinations makes up for their average pay scale.

 

[yohy?!]

interesting - it sounds like you have direct confirmation from someone on the QCCA contract?

if not i'd be a bit suspect on this as it's a pretty standard arrangement amongst airlines that I can only imagine would have created a lot of bad blood if they removed it from the contract.

i know someone who flies for Jetconnect Longhaul and have asked what their arrangement is.

 

[Kendall Roy]

Have noticed some of the Kiwi crews running the 7/8 since it went to A380. A good bunch that are always up for a chat!

Unfortunately I'm looking at other carrier options in light of the recent "enhancements" to extra leg room seats.

 

[Brettmcg]

interesting - it sounds like you have direct confirmation from someone on the QCCA contract?

if not i'd be a bit suspect on this as it's a pretty standard arrangement amongst airlines that I can only imagine would have created a lot of bad blood if they removed it from the contract.

i know someone who flies for Jetconnect Longhaul and have asked what their arrangement is.

They didn't "remove it from the contract" because it was never in there to begin with. QCCA is a completely separate EBA from the older QAL agreements.

I have confirmation from a CSM, CSS and two BFAs that this is the case. Any further evidence you require?

 

[yohy?!]

They didn't "remove it from the contract" because it was never in there to begin with. QCCA is a completely separate EBA from the older QAL agreements.

I have confirmation from a CSM, CSS and two BFAs that this is the case. Any further evidence you require?

Contract should obviously be EBA - my bad in this post-unionist world of ours

I guess this really explains the service "anomalies" we regularly see with QF commonly: inferior contracts and poorer conditions begetting resentful/disinterested staff

 

[parsonstrish]

Contract should obviously be EBA - my bad in this post-unionist world of ours

I guess this really explains the service "anomalies" we regularly see with QF commonly: inferior contracts and poorer conditions begetting resentful/disinterested staff

I disagree, as in my small sample of crew on 7 & 8 always friendly, helpful & passenger focused. Upon embarking @ Dfw, one of the crew, this trip, said let me help you & took my bag to my seat. Replying to my experience of crew on this route. Disinterested crew, go aa.

 

[Brettmcg]

Contract should obviously be EBA - my bad in this post-unionist world of ours

I guess this really explains the service "anomalies" we regularly see with QF commonly: inferior contracts and poorer conditions begetting resentful/disinterested staff

Couldn't disagree more. My service experiences with QCCA crew have been totally superior to interactions with many QAL crew. On average I would say QCCA crew are more motivated and enthusiastic about the product and brand, and have nowhere near the sense of entitlement of their QAL colleagues. That's not to say that there aren't still great QAL crew around, but YMMV.

 

[Limewood]

On our QF J flight DFW/BNE had 2 senior (and I mean old) FA guys, they were simply fantastic, friendly and attentive, couldn't fault in any way.

 

[Quickstatus]

I find that the A380 crew is fantastic.

It is impossible to have everyone acting cheerful and motivated all the time. Though in the LOTFAP waitstaff are perpetually cheerful and motivated because they want your tip.


OT: I must remember to tip 20% only on the pretax amount.

 

[Sprucegoose]

On our QF J flight DFW/BNE had 2 senior (and I mean old) FA guys, they were simply fantastic, friendly and attentive, couldn't fault in any way.

dont underestimate old blokes...theyve been around...

 

[RooFlyer]

They didn't "remove it from the contract" because it was never in there to begin with. QCCA is a completely separate EBA from the older QAL agreements.

I have confirmation from a CSM, CSS and two BFAs that this is the case. Any further evidence you require?

I'd enjoy your contributions more if you dialled down the tone a bit. Thanks for the info on the dichotomy of employment conditions - I think it may explain some of my more extreme good/bad experiences in J, when I reconcile it to the route/aircraft.

I disagree, as in my small sample of crew on 7 & 8 always friendly, helpful & passenger focused. Upon embarking @ Dfw, one of the crew, this trip, said let me help you & took my bag to my seat. Replying to my experience of crew on this route. Disinterested crew, go aa.

Would it be that you (usually) fly F? That would (should) certainly tilt the general experience towards the positive (Although as I've posted elsewhere, on a F between MEL and LAX I think it was I has one terrific young lady as a F FA and two absolute male drones - theirs would have been a bad performance on a LCC in Y !!)
____

I'm not one to point the finger at QFi in particular for bad or uneven service. This year I think I've flown 5 different airlines in long haul J and except for CX, none were uniformly very good or very bad, including CX and SQ.

 

[parsonstrish]

If only F, nope j.

 

[DC3]

Well, Brettmcg, you certainly got a few nibbles there. Or should I say, bites.

 

[smit0847]

FYI - taken from Airline Hub Buzz


Basically, QAL crew bid on a seniority system as mentioned by opusman. These are the crew members who, under most circumstances, operate the A333 and B744 routes. Longer-serving crew tend to bid for the longer trips away (JNB/SCL/LAX/JFK) because this means higher slip allowances etc., however there's obviously no hard and fast rule and it all comes down to personal preference and flying patterns.

QCCA crew have no ability to bid for trips. They can swap among themselves, but aren't able to determine the destinations to where they fly. For MEL-based QCCA crew, this pretty much means shuttling backwards and forwards between LAX and DXB. Having said that, I'm told that in the next roster period there'll be varied flying which means some MEL crew will pax through the network and operate out of SYD to places like DFW and HKG. It's not often that Australian-based QCCA crew get up to LHR, as most of the DXB-LHR tags are operated by the LHR base. It does happen from time to time, but a handful of LHR crew operating all the way through to AUS seems to be more common.

Then there are Jetconnect Longhaul (based in NZ) who operate on both the A380 and the B744 (I believe this is a legislative issue - CASA won't allow it, the CAA does). I'd say the varied flying and choice of destinations makes up for their average pay scale.

This was my understanding as well. QF were trying to get their absurdly well compensated legacy staff onto lower pay-and-perk contracts but the legacy staff were naturally refusing to do so. The only carrot QF had to dangle was that they were getting new planes (A380) for the most popular routes so they forced anyone wanting to work on the A380 to agree to a much lower, more QF-favourable contract. This has nothing to do with age (in reference to someone saying they had older QF crew on their A380) - it just happened that a lot of the A380 crew are younger because they were never on a legacy contract, so don't realise how poor their A380 conditions are compared to their legacy colleagues. Older crew could sign up to the A380 contract regardless of whether they were legacy crew or new to QF but most don't. I did not know A380 crew could not bid for trips but that makes sense given how poor the rest of their conditions are.

A question I do have, when a 747 is unexpectedly subbed onto an A380 route for a one-off service recovery, say, is it crewed by legacy, or A380 staff?