Wind Generation and the Electricity Grid

[Pushka]

Seems the Xens maybe a better alternative? No?
At least you’ve got progressive solar and batteries in place and further development, despite rear guard fighting from the fed LNP.

The trouble is we have a Labor Government that after 16 years really needs to go (and that applies to any colour Govt) but a very ineffectual opposition in the Libs. Xens is full of gimmicks but no policies. Yep, that wonderful battery powers 30,000 households for an hour. They day they flicked the switch, the town where it is housed had a major blackout. Murphy’s law at its best.

 

[TheRealTMA]

The trouble is we have a Labor Government that after 16 years really needs to go (and that applies to any colour Govt) but a very ineffectual opposition in the Libs. Xens is full of gimmicks but no policies. Yep, that wonderful battery powers 30,000 households for an hour. They day they flicked the switch, the town where it is housed had a major blackout. Murphy’s law at its best.

Plus there’s this How Tesla's big battery is bringing Australia’s gas cartel to heel

 

[RooFlyer]

At least you’ve got progressive solar and batteries in place and further development, despite rear guard fighting from the fed LNP.

Darn; we were getting along so well ...

Ah! So solar and batteries are 'progressive' are they? Where does hydro fit in ... that renewable, carbon free, base load energy source that the Greens hate with a passion. I guess we conservatives can claim that one .

Trouble with batteries is that they can't power anything ... until there is surplus energy to charge them up. Not seeing much surplus energy in SA any time soon. Mostly they take power from Victoria and further afield generated by that wicked coal. And as the clowns in charge of Victoria force some coal power stations there to close, that'll mean both SA and Victoria both up s**t creek energy-wise.

It is just so funny to know Wetherill's green eco-state was kept afloat by diesel generators.

I'd love to see Nick X become the Premier of SA - then he won't have anyone else to screw to support on his pet projects for his vote; it'll be on him, and people will see the consequences. Sorry, Pushka, that will mean your state will be cactus in a year or so, but at least you have a new hospital (takes cover). You sure it wasn't 'biodiesel' or canola oil powering that hospital system?

Plus there’s this How Tesla's big battery is bringing Australia’s gas cartel to heel

The Groidian? You're kidding, right? Green Left Weekly has better copy, is more balanced, and is free.

 

[TheRealTMA]

Darn; we were getting along so well ...



The Groidian? You're kidding, right? Green Left Weekly has better copy, is more balanced, and is free.

Well that does it! No RF coming to our house with the next coffee machine! You’d probably bring lumps of coal instead of coffee beans!

Try this left wing rag then - 'That's a record': Elon Musk's Tesla battery in South Australia responded in just 140 milliseconds after a coal-fired power plant failed

Or perhaps this? Commentators who don't understand the grid should butt out of the battery debate | Ketan Joshi

 

[drron]

Well that does it! No RF coming to our house with the next coffee machine! You’d probably bring lumps of coal instead of coffee beans!

Try this left wing rag then - 'That's a record': Elon Musk's Tesla battery in South Australia responded in just 140 milliseconds after a coal-fired power plant failed

Or perhaps this? Commentators who don't understand the grid should butt out of the battery debate | Ketan Joshi

I really dont think a Communications consultant is a real expert on the grid.
But another problem with wind power-they cause bushfires.And when they burn out neighbours property the lovely ethical,morally right companies deny liability.
Of course when they cause a fire the water tankers cant fly within 3 Km of the source of the fire.
Wind Farm Neighbours Burnt Out by Bushfire Sparked by Infigen Pursue $Millions in NSW Supreme Court

This one has lovely pictures of fire starters-aka wind turbines.
BUSHFIRE RED ALERT: Wind Power Really Is Setting the World on FIRE

 

[Quickstatus]

Well that does it! No RF coming to our house with the next coffee machine! You’d probably bring lumps of coal instead of coffee beans!

Try this left wing rag then - 'That's a record': Elon Musk's Tesla battery in South Australia responded in just 140 milliseconds after a coal-fired power plant failed

Or perhaps this? Commentators who don't understand the grid should butt out of the battery debate | Ketan Joshi

Ah yes - classic example of “confirmation bias”.

In the meantime AGL poised to take profits into the banking style profits.

An energy market dominated by players who can come and go as they please gaming the system. A system created to suit their model of non guaranteed intermittent supply. And then bring in a battery to temporarily smooth out the consequences. The “reduction” in peak prices is a red herring because the underlying prices will still be the highest in the world.

 

[Denali]

Im not well read on the subject but why doesnt the Govt doesnt sponsor more home solar panels to help ease the crisis? Hundreds of thousands of homes that can supply electricity to the grid or to the home are available.

I know when we talk about our rebuild, my husband is adamant that we're going solar/off grid as much as possible.

Of course, if you live in Florida youre screwed because the energy lobbyists locked up that option because by law they have to feed back into the grid and not allowed to power up their own homes.

 

[RooFlyer]

Well that does it! No RF coming to our house with the next coffee machine! You’d probably bring lumps of coal instead of coffee beans!

Try this left wing rag then - 'That's a record': Elon Musk's Tesla battery in South Australia responded in just 140 milliseconds after a coal-fired power plant failed

I hope your coffee beans are organic, because my coal will be.

That other left wing rag appears to have the same editorial quality issues as the Groidian:

Elon Musk’s gaint lithium ion battery in South Australia

and ..

Last week, when the coal-fired Loy Yang power plant in Victoria tripped and went offline, the Tesla battery delivered 100 megawatts into the national electricity grid in 140 milliseconds.

So it dumped the lot into the grid 140 milliseconds? Those wires must have been hot ... and that doesn't help keep my beer cold after the 0.14 seconds.

and ...

By comparison, South Australia’s Torrens Island power station would take half an hour to an hour to energise and synchronise into the market, according to Koutsantonis.

That's like saying "My torch was able to light up the room at the flick of a switch, whereas we'd have to wait at least 8 hours for enough daylight for that the solar array over there to power up and synchronise into the market, or to wait an unknown time until the wind blows hard enough for the wind turbine to turn."

Some time ago I used to run a renewable energy company, believe it or not ... I dare say I still know more about electricity grids than Mr Koutsantonis. He can install 100 Musky batteries, but if there isn't surplus energy to charge them, and then to recharge them in the event of a generator failure, then they are just so many lithium storage facilities.

 

[TomVexille]

This discussion reminds me of the fallacy of "Earth Hour". The generation system still produces the same amount, they just shed the excess onto a load bank.

 

[Quickstatus]

Im not well read on the subject but why doesnt the Govt doesnt sponsor more home solar panels to help ease the crisis? Hundreds of thousands of homes that can supply electricity to the grid or to the home are available.

The crisis is 3 parts: 1) intermittent unguaranteed frequency variable supply 2) gaming of the market as a consequence and 3)collapsing baseload supply because of ideology. Any solution that involves more of the same is not going to solve the crisis.

AGL says baseload coal is bad because it would affect their banking level profits.

 

[Quickstatus]

Earth hour was

This discussion reminds me of the fallacy of "Earth Hour". The generation system still produces the same amount, they just shed the excess onto a load bank.

Earth hour is interesting, a feel good event which causes power consumption to go up after earth hour such that the overall consumption for the evening is higher than adjacent evenings

 

[Pushka]

Im not well read on the subject but why doesnt the Govt doesnt sponsor more home solar panels to help ease the crisis? Hundreds of thousands of homes that can supply electricity to the grid or to the home are available.

I know when we talk about our rebuild, my husband is adamant that we're going solar/off grid as much as possible.

Of course, if you live in Florida youre screwed because the energy lobbyists locked up that option because by law they have to feed back into the grid and not allowed to power up their own homes.

They are going trial exactly this in SA. Let’s see how it works.

 

[RooFlyer]

Im not well read on the subject but why doesnt the Govt doesnt sponsor more home solar panels to help ease the crisis? Hundreds of thousands of homes that can supply electricity to the grid or to the home are available.

Besides the immense cost and that it wouldn't solve the 'crisis' that has been brought about the ideological pursuit of putting in intermittent small scale generators such as solar and wind at the expense of fossil fuels?

Then, because we'll still need the base load fossil fuel, or base load hydro generators (all hated by the Greens) there to supply energy in the morning, evening and night and when the wind isn't blowing. I'm all for people putting in solar panels - it drives demand for mining products, which is the industry I'm in - but pay for it themselves.

In fact, people should put up 10-20m high wind generation towers in their backyards too, to generate even more renewable energy. What's wrong with that?

 

[RooFlyer]

Further details on the Hospital blackout continue to emerge.

I feel your state's pain, but Jay Wetherill sure does a lot to entertain the rest of us.

Do you think that if he and his government spent more time on the basics of good government, rather than pursuing the compost economy, the population may have a better go of it?

Now I hear Wetherill and co are complaining about the latest health finding offer from the feds. Memo Jay - the robots are calling for you.

 

[TheRealTMA]

I hope your coffee beans are organic, because my coal will be.

I would have thought even you coal people would know that you can't have inorganic coffee beans. Just like inorganic coal.

 

[drron]

Noww Rooflyer don't be so hard on Elon.He is after all a miner.....
-
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-of Government subsidies.

 

[JessicaTam]

I really dont think a Communications consultant is a real expert on the grid.
But another problem with wind power-they cause bushfires.And when they burn out neighbours property the lovely ethical,morally right companies deny liability.
Of course when they cause a fire the water tankers cant fly within 3 Km of the source of the fire.
Wind Farm Neighbours Burnt Out by Bushfire Sparked by Infigen Pursue $Millions in NSW Supreme Court

This one has lovely pictures of fire starters-aka wind turbines.
BUSHFIRE RED ALERT: Wind Power Really Is Setting the World on FIRE

The 3km limit sounded a bit extreme, so I just made a phone call to a friend who flies water bombers in Victoria. They are comfortable flying within about 100m of the towers while they are operating. In the event of a fire closer than that, the companies can be contacted and the turbines are shut down so the bombers can get as close as they like.

And the article you linked to listed only 4 fires in Australia, with nothing since 2010. With the proliferation of wind towers recently, I reckon that is an enviable record.

 

[RooFlyer]

Why drron you've ... changed!

 

[drron]

The 3km limit sounded a bit extreme, so I just made a phone call to a friend who flies water bombers in Victoria. They are comfortable flying within about 100m of the towers while they are operating. In the event of a fire closer than that, the companies can be contacted and the turbines are shut down so the bombers can get as close as they like.

And the article you linked to listed only 4 fires in Australia, with nothing since 2010. With the proliferation of wind towers recently, I reckon that is an enviable record.

The 4 fires in Australia is from the second link from 2014.The first link describes a fire in NSW in January 2017.Obviously with the rising number of turbines the risk of fire is higher.
The 3000 metres is from this-
The Battle for Yorke Peninsula’s Heartland “ploughs on” at Curramulka

This describes why water bombers cant operate on a wind turbine tower-the water would knock the turbine over.
As Australia burns, an impassioned plea from a fire fighter’s wife

And then this.The pictures at the bottom pose an interesting question.
Saving the Heartland – SA’s Yorke Peninsula

 

[JessicaTam]

Do you believe 'Chad' or a pilot currently on duty in SW Vic who manages a water bomber company contracted across SA/Vic?

All those websites seem like blustering anti-turbine malarkey. Next they will be trying to convince us they cause health issues*.

*Apart from falling off one, of course.