Western Sydney Airport (WSI) Discussion

[dairyfloss]

I doubt Air NZ, which has expressed an interest to fly there, would look at it like that.

I'm quite sure they do - Air NZ will continue to fly the vast majority of it's flights and pax from SYD.

NZ would see this as an opportunity to lure a number of pax away from booking a possible QF/JQ/EK/LA/VA flight originating from SYD, by offering an option to those pax at a more convenient location for them, originating and returning to WSI.

With no curfews, lower fees and perhaps little need for premium services like operating a business lounge - at least not one of their own - they could also offer more competitive (or more profitable!) fares for these flights from WSI, as well.

 

[elanshin]

Will this be Sydney's Avalon?

No. Firstly even if there's no passenger flights (highly unlikely), WSI will become Sydney's main frieght airport. Closer proximity to one of the main logistics hub area for Australia as well as cargo flights like leaving at all hours including overnight.

As mentioned, it'll also be used for the midnight and overnight slots for at least SQ (maybe CX).

I can also see LCC looking at WSI as well. Like say zipair or AirJapan wants in on JQs monopoly on LCC to Japan route, they could fly NRT - WSI for example and put in a real challenge there. I could see Indigo expanding to WSI when they get a compliment of 787s.

 

[Beano]

No. WSI has a much bigger catchment population than Avalon (based on the number of people that live closer to WSI than SYD vs those that live closer to AVV then MEL). And it will get some flights at times that SYD has a curfew, that dynamic doesn't exist between MEL and AVV.

Avalon has Geelong! Less than 30 minutes away. Even, at the moment, avoiding curfew, WSI is not a proposal for someone doing business in the Sydney CBD. And what about Air NZ idea? That's a major Trans-Tasman carrier! Is this a catchment for holiday travellers or freight? The next thing is hotel availability; Penrith, Parramatta, Liverpool, or even Cabramatta? Arriving early/late evening what are the options? Another 90 minute journey or hire a car to cut it to 60 minutes and bomb along the M4 or M5? Missing the curfew, does that mean arriving at midnight or 4 o'clock in the morning? Not my idea of a good business trip. We will have to wait and see what happens. Presumable the owners did a business case, so must have thought it worthwhile for something?

 

[dairyfloss]

Avalon has Geelong! Less than 30 minutes away. Even, at the moment, avoiding curfew, WSI is not a proposal for someone doing business in the Sydney CBD. And what about Air NZ idea? That's a major Trans-Tasman carrier! Is this a catchment for holiday travellers or freight? The next thing is hotel availability; Penrith, Parramatta, Liverpool, or even Cabramatta? Arriving early/late evening what are the options? Another 90 minute journey or hire a car to cut it to 60 minutes and bomb along the M4 or M5? Missing the curfew, does that mean arriving at midnight or 4 o'clock in the morning? Not my idea of a good business trip. We will have to wait and see what happens. Presumable the owners did a business case, so must have thought it worthwhile for something?

On Air NZ - there are a lot of Māori and pacific islander people and their families who live and work in Sydney's west and who would see WSI as a positive development for travel to/from NZ & the islands. As I noted above, it's only a supplemental location for Air NZ, and unlikely to impact on their primary volume out of SYD. If you are staying in the CBD, you'd have to be pretty desperate or restricted to be coming and going from WSI. If you are visiting family who live in the greater west or mountains (or a business there), however, it could be quite handy.

 

[SYD]

Avalon has Geelong! Less than 30 minutes away. Even, at the moment, avoiding curfew, WSI is not a proposal for someone doing business in the Sydney CBD. And what about Air NZ idea? That's a major Trans-Tasman carrier! Is this a catchment for holiday travellers or freight? The next thing is hotel availability; Penrith, Parramatta, Liverpool, or even Cabramatta? Arriving early/late evening what are the options? Another 90 minute journey or hire a car to cut it to 60 minutes and bomb along the M4 or M5? Missing the curfew, does that mean arriving at midnight or 4 o'clock in the morning? Not my idea of a good business trip. We will have to wait and see what happens. Presumable the owners did a business case, so must have thought it worthwhile for something?

WSI catchment (total Pop within 1 hr) is the 3rd largest in Oz after SYD and MEL.

No, someone flying from AKL going to Sydney CBD for a meeting is still going to go to fly to SYD. But if their meeting is in Parramatta, then WSI might be ok.

The earlier post was suggesting that someone living in the WSI catchment could be better off taking NZ to AKL and onto other destinations from there.

Pretty sure there’ll be other airlines taking up WSI slots pretty soon.

 

[jase05]

The next thing is hotel availability

Marriott are building a property at WSI and others will eventually follow suit.

WSI won’t be for everyone but dependant on which airlines end up there I’d definitely prefer a transit there than SYD if coming from interstate.

 

[stm1sydney]

Avalon has Geelong!

Population of Geelong: less than 300,000
Population of W.Sydney: 3,000,000

 

[TomVexille]

Avalon has Geelong! Less than 30 minutes away. Even, at the moment, avoiding curfew, WSI is not a proposal for someone doing business in the Sydney CBD. And what about Air NZ idea? That's a major Trans-Tasman carrier! Is this a catchment for holiday travellers or freight? The next thing is hotel availability; Penrith, Parramatta, Liverpool, or even Cabramatta? Arriving early/late evening what are the options? Another 90 minute journey or hire a car to cut it to 60 minutes and bomb along the M4 or M5? Missing the curfew, does that mean arriving at midnight or 4 o'clock in the morning? Not my idea of a good business trip. We will have to wait and see what happens. Presumable the owners did a business case, so must have thought it worthwhile for something?

Business trip does not necessarily mean the CBD. A lot of businesses will be closer to WSI than SYD.

 

[Beano]

Business trip does not necessarily mean the CBD. A lot of businesses will be closer to WSI than SYD.

Well, I suppose there is Wetherill Park, Horsley Park and Blacktown, or near, which are a hive of business activity. Seriously though, I do have clients there but can't find time to visit, being out of Sydney. This could be an opportunity.

 

[ausfox]

When you drive the M7 and M4 which are just to the east of WSI there are an enormous number of large industrial/commercial premises.
I would suggest that these are targets for carriers into WSI as well as the passenger market.

 

[RooFlyer]

Not to mention the AeroWest I think it’s called, new business centre being developed right next to the airport. Build it and they will come, etc.

 

[SeaWolf]

Business trip does not necessarily mean the CBD. A lot of businesses will be closer to WSI than SYD.

Also, business travel goes the other way as well, with people who live near WSI using it to take business trips to other cities as a more convenient option than flying from SYD.

 

[antycbr]

Also, business travel goes the other way as well, with people who live near WSI using it to take business trips to other cities as a more convenient option than flying from SYD.

They might appreciate not having triple figure cab charges being able to fly from WSI.

 

[Bundy Bear]

They might appreciate not having triple figure cab charges being able to fly from WSI.

And if the parking wasn’t too expensive you could just drive and park at the airport.

 

[elanshin]

They might appreciate not having triple figure cab charges being able to fly from WSI.

It can already be a triple figure cab charge from SYD to the CBD (and yes officially on the meter).

 

[SYD]

It can already be a triple figure cab charge from SYD to the CBD (and yes officially on the meter).

Take the train. Solo, crazy not to.

 

[HS-TQE]

They should. If they don't then that's just giving the buck all over to QF Group.

In typical VA/Bain fashion, I'd be guessing a short lead up time (as opposed to well in advance for QF group) with VA treating WSI as a regional station with 5-6 flights a day to BNE and MEL at the very minimum with crews operating same-day returns.

I feel VA will do the bare minimum out of obligation to 'compete' although the WSI ceo has recently mentioned they are 'still hoping' for VA to sign on in 2025 after the NZ announcement.

 

[jpp42]

When you drive the M7 and M4 which are just to the east of WSI there are an enormous number of large industrial/commercial premises.
I would suggest that these are targets for carriers into WSI as well as the passenger market.

Absolutely. My company runs advanced manufacturing, and operations facilities in Western Sydney that require business travellers from all over AU (and further afield). Heck, I know one executive from Texas who prefers to fly AirNZ , he would be very happy to fly HOU-AKL-WSI to remove the slog out to Western Sydney from SYD. There will be many other business travellers like him. It's amazing how many people think it's all about the CBD.

By the way, Parramatta is closer to SYD than WSI!

 

[Beano]

Absolutely. My company runs advanced manufacturing, and operations facilities in Western Sydney that require business travellers from all over AU (and further afield). Heck, I know one executive from Texas who prefers to fly AirNZ , he would be very happy to fly HOU-AKL-WSI to remove the slog out to Western Sydney from SYD. There will be many other business travellers like him. It's amazing how many people think it's all about the CBD.

As far as I can see Parramatta is the closest where there are a good selection of hotels, restaurants etc, as well as being a historic city. Not on a par with Sydney but OK. Good shopping too.

By the way, Parramatta is closer to SYD than WSI!

Too true, but a major centre nearby. However, the exits from WSI are southwards or eastwards so Penrith and Liverpool are the nearer major centres, though I am not sure what is there.

I think we have to dissociate from the concept of Sydney as a centre when flying to WSI. We should treat WSI as if it were another, totally different city area, say like flying into Rockhampton!

 

[markis10]

We should treat WSI as if it were another, totally different city area, say like flying into Rockhampton!

Does that mean WSI floods easily, has poor mobile coverage and gets invaded by Singapore on a regular basis? And I forgot to add, the local youth practice stealing the reproductive parts of all the bull statues around town to hang near their towballs?