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Seat allocation stolen

Quickstatus

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To be fair, there may be a safety or security issue requiring a CL (VIP) to be seated in a particular seat. But I think most CLs not within that category would be horrified if they knew a simple seat request resulted in booting someone else out! It would be considered vulgar :( (I suspect most of them aren't told?)
My CLPO (industry parlance, aka CLWP1for AFF) friend who is a about 1 year from LTWP says he almost always gets his seat request 1A/K. Except when his mate who is another CLPO is also travelling on the same flight. His mate got the prize at the recent QF WP1 function for the passenger with the most QF flights in the year. Something like 150 or so.
I asked him about this scenario and he just shrugged his shoulders and said "No seat selection is guaranteed" and proceeded to tell me how one time he was booted from his seat selection by a certain Boy Band member who he says is not a true blue frequent flyer.
 

MEL_Traveller

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My CLPO (industry parlance, aka CLWP1for AFF) friend who is a about 1 year from LTWP says he almost always gets his seat request 1A/K. Except when his mate who is another CLPO is also travelling on the same flight. His mate got the prize at the recent QF WP1 function for the passenger with the most QF flights in the year. Something like 150 or so.
I asked him about this scenario and he just shrugged his shoulders and said "No seat selection is guaranteed" and proceeded to tell me how one time he was booted from his seat selection by a certain Boy Band member who he says is not a true blue frequent flyer.
i did qualify it with 'most' :)
 

2PAXfly

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Bet on a CL - from my knowledge of a couple of CL's - if they don't get upgraded to business, then Row 4 or 5 are their next option. They don't need to request it, its an automatic 'service', although they do have the option of refusing it once the lounge attendant brings them their ticket. If Bus was full - bet on a CL.
 

opusman

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Business was only half full, in fact the way I resolved this to my own satisfaction was upgrading on departure.
 

calmelb

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Here's what really annoyed me about the whole thing. OK, my seat can be stolen by a superior being such as a P1, I accept that. But I'm still WP dammit. I have "Aisle" in my profile. I had 4D allocated. They stole that, you'd think maybe they'd put me in 5D or 6D or even 12D. How hard would that have been? But nope, I had *no* seat assigned at all. 8D was available so when I checked in I grabbed that but would it have killed them to preallocate it to me as part of the whole seat theft thing? Apparently yes, it would have.
I’m the same with you on that. Except I couldn’t catch it until it was too late, still very annoying they couldn’t auto assign me a seat further forward (though I presume this was because they all got ‘blocked’ just before boarding started (I checked EF seatmap after I boarded) and so the automated system would’ve taken them as occupied
 

Quickstatus

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i did qualify it with 'most' :)
He wasnt told, but he did what most would do which is to board last and see who took his preciouso_O seat. He didnt recognise the person, but his daughter who was travelling with him said "DYK who is sitting in your seat dad?". Only then did he realise he was not the most important passenger on the flight. Some Boy Band punk pipped him to that.:)
 

MEL_Traveller

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He wasnt told, but he did what most would do which is to board last and see who took his preciouso_O seat. He didnt recognise the person, but his daughter who was travelling with him said "DYK who is sitting in your seat dad?". Only then did he realise he was not the most important passenger on the flight. Some Boy Band punk pipped him to that.:)
I'm talking about your friend. To expect your preferred seat if that means kicking someone else out would be considered by most CLs to be inappropriate. Unless there was an operational issue. Seating a VIP away from others to minimise potential disruption is an acceptable reason. I accept many CLs may not even be aware this is happening, so hard to blame them.
 

Quickstatus

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I believe we agree.

From his point of view he does not believe anyone is ever booted, because the seat selection is not guaranteed - only a request and that the airline finalises seating arrangements with regard to status and requests. Except for him of course :)
 

SooziQu

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Happened to me a few weeks ago. My booked 4A turned into 8C the day before the flight. Mentioned it to a lounge angel that I know, they couldn’t figure out what happened there, anyway as a goodwill gesture blocked 8B which is nice considering the plane was pretty packed. 4A/C lost their shadow too which made me feel a little better.
What's a shadow?
 

MEL_Traveller

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I believe we agree.

From his point of view he does not believe anyone is ever booted, because the seat selection is not guaranteed - only a request and that the airline finalises seating arrangements with regard to status and requests.
ohhh.... I see! That's an interesting take :)
 

Quickstatus

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Thats an empty seat anecdotally allocated by the airline so that its next to a passenger. There is an urban ?myth? that some passengers often get a shadow allocated due to their FF Status. It is not a Stop Sell but an empty seat not purchased by the time the flight departs.
 

SooziQu

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Thats an empty seat anecdotally allocated by the airline so that its next to a passenger. There is an urban ?myth? that some passengers often get a shadow allocated due to their FF Status. It is not a Stop Sell but an empty seat not purchased by the time the flight departs.

Thankyou. :)
 

Quickstatus

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Some passengers assume that an empty seat next to them is a shadow allocated by the airline rather than just a random occurrence and by extension validating their importance in the Status Totem pole - until the next time when they dont get a shadow.
 

Quickstatus

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To say a seat has been allocated is actually incorrect. All seats are “requests”
 

Pleb Status

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To be fair, there may be a safety or security issue requiring a CL (VIP) to be seated in a particular seat. But I think most CLs not within that category would be horrified if they knew a simple seat request resulted in booting someone else out! It would be considered vulgar :( (I suspect most of them aren't told?)
'Safety and security' is the justification used by those in power to justify the unjustifiable...

I estimate that 95% of the population do not have a clue who 95% of the CL actually are. I have sat next to numerous CL (the status on their boarding pass) over the years and not known who any of them were. A lot of them are family members of the primary CL. For most CL, there is no 'safety or security' issue at all, except for in their own minds.

For the very small number where some minor concerns may exist, they should be buying J tickets due to their 'importance' and then the 'safety or security' difference between sitting in row 1 or row 3 is minor. VVIP will have a 'minder/goon' where required, so they do not even need to sit next to a 'threat' (aka normal person). I had Pauline Hanson sitting directly behind me in 4K on a recent VA A332 flight BNE-PER without issue and you would struggle to find a more polarising figure in Australian politics.

If a CL does not know what is happening 'in the background' when they make a very late seat request on a full flight then they do not fly very much and/or are intellectually disabled. Most (if not all) are perfectly aware what is happening. It is like eating a steak, you might like eating it, but most do not want to think about (or care) how it exactly gets from the paddock to the plate...
 
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MEL_Traveller

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To say a seat has been allocated is actually incorrect. All seats are “requests”
Qantas uses the term 'selection'. As there is no distinction between paid seat selection and complimentary seat selection, they must be considered one and the same. That is, per their terms and conditions, unless there is an operational, safety or security reason, you should have a reasonable expectation of receiving your chosen seat.

Seat selection conditions, exit row | Qantas AU
 

MEL_Traveller

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‘Not guaranteed’ because of a specific reason (operational, safety or security). If it doesn’t fall within those exceptions, your seat selection should hold. That is, there’s no other reason QF can take it off you, as per their own terms and conditions.

You’re reading ‘not guaranteed’ without the qualification.

‘Operational’ does not include ‘commercial’ reasons, otherwise the terms and conditions would have said so (or even ‘for any other reason Qf determines’). So deciding, for good commercial reasons, to keep a CL ‘happy’ isn’t covered.

if it truly was ‘on request’ and nothing more, QF would have words similar to international upgrade requests.

However, if the airline breaches their own terms and conditions... what’s the penalty? None it seems. Other than a refund if you have paid for the specific seat.
 

Quickstatus

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I agree.
But all decisions re seat allocations by the airline will be deemed by it to be under the “operational safety or security” umbrella. That a passenger says it’s “commercial” is really a moot point

Practically, “operational, safety and security” = “any”.:( (Also because the airline is also the Judge and Jury
 
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Matt_01

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As a P1, do you find your 4B shadow to be a durable creature? I've had mixed experiences with mine recently. Definitely fickle.
Earlier this year there seemed to be a period when my shadow seemed to be on a pretty tight leash and stuck most of the time including the peak hour flights between MEL-SYD, SYD-MEL and SDY-ADL. I do not have recent experience has I have been flying VA since late May but will be back to QF next month when the new year starts.
Some passengers assume that an empty seat next to them is a shadow allocated by the airline rather than just a random occurrence and by extension validating their importance in the Status Totem pole - until the next time when they dont get a shadow.
Durning that period I mentioned above I was a bit surprised that shadows were sticking with regularity. Out of curiosity I checked EF and noticed that all the seats next to mine were displaying as blocked. I went back into a few bookings and moved seating from 4C to 4D, R8, R23 or 24 (a332) and then went back and checked in EF and surprisingly each newly selected seat had a blocked set next to them that was not there before and the original blocked seat had also gone.

Curiosity satisfied changed all the seating back to my original seats, before some other 'bloody P1' pinched them, sure enough the blocked seat moved with me. I will find out from August if this was just an anomaly.
 

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