Qantas treats Perth like dirt

[wandering_fred]

OTOH I wonder what the reduction in PER flights would be if Port Hedland and Broome had flights to Singapore?

I suspect there are some primary producers that would welcome the shorter flights for their freight...

Happy wandering

Fred

 

[Daver6]

OTOH I wonder what the reduction in PER flights would be if Port Hedland and Broome had flights to Singapore?

I suspect there are some primary producers that would welcome the shorter flights for their freight...

Happy wandering

Fred

They'd need something bigger than a 737 for the live cattle export though...

 

[cosi]

but airlines like SQ would probably downgrade equipment or schedule to match lower demand. Would you see 2 or 3 EK flight a day? doubt it 1 like ADL probably.

as an isolated market PER is pretty small for VFR or tourism traffic in the main. At least I'd imagine it to be.

FYI

Per-Sin has 8 direct flights/day

SQ flys 3 times per day (2x333 and 1 x777)

EK operates 2 A380 every day

EY (787) and QR (777) both have daily flights to Perth

Visiting friends and relatives is a huge market for WA, because of the very large ex UK residents living in the west because the 10 pound pom got off the boat at Freo.

QF is very much on the nose with locals who are regular international travellers.

QF lounge at the Perth International would be the worst in Australia - its in needs an urgent upgrade and at 6:30am on the weekends, hard to get a seat.

 

[wandering_fred]

They'd need something bigger than a 737 for the live cattle export though...

Rock lobsters have a much higher per kilo value...
As do a lot of fresh fruit.

Happy wandering

Fred

 

[dajop]

SQ flys 3 times per day (2x333 and 1 x777)

Actually it's 4 times per day. 2x333 + 2 x 777

It's not use UK residents, lot of student and VFR traffic between SIN & PER, for example (I've encountered a good number of SIN taxi drivers with links to PER). It's also a very popular tourist destination for those in SE Asia - after it is the closest "Western" city of decent size (i.e. excluding DRW) to SE Asia. So it's remote and it's not.

 

[davidj]

FYI


QF is very much on the nose with locals who are regular international travellers.

This is the problem. No point allocating more seats if no bums on them.

 

[codash1099]

This is the problem. No point allocating more seats if no bums on them.

Horses, carts
Swings, roundabouts
Chicken, egg

 

[davidj]

Horses, carts
Swings, roundabouts
Chicken, egg

Didn't Qantas learn from that after burning through millions in cash? After chopping routes on the nose now making some money.

As I said No point allocating more seats if no bums on them.

 

[wandering_fred]

No available planes --> no available seats for bums.

QF have in effect given up on the SIN and HKG markets. I suspect from MEL/SYD the HKG market could be competitive if QF had 747/380 to compete with CX frequency... For the SIN market, continuing connections would be needed. Where are the joint fares other than EK and 3K?

For PER I just want something larger than a 737/320 arriving outside of 1800-0600 arrival times. And not going through DXB unless QF metal (though even that would be seriously subject to alternative route selection)

Back to my normal wandering

Fred

 

[Conrad_S]

No available planes --> no available seats for bums.

QF have in effect given up on the SIN and HKG markets. I suspect from MEL/SYD the HKG market could be competitive if QF had 747/380 to compete with CX frequency... For the SIN market, continuing connections would be needed. Where are the joint fares other than EK and 3K?

For PER I just want something larger than a 737/320 arriving outside of 1800-0600 arrival times. And not going through DXB unless QF metal (though even that would be seriously subject to alternative route selection)

Back to my normal wandering

Fred

I understand the "want" bit is a pretty normal emotion. In the face of existing competition though, why would any business, including the one you work or worked for take one potential loss maker. Good luck, but I reckon you'd be better off going with one of the other carriers if the product, service or timing was better.
Incidentally I'd prefer it if Qantas improved the consistency and quality of their product (code for invest in their staff) rather than added lots of new routes.

 

[Franky]

This is the problem. No point allocating more seats if no bums on them.

While the only choice of a QF seat is on a 737 to SIN, I will be sitting my bum on Scoot's Dreamliner thanks.

 

[cove]

I must say that we were very impressed with Frank at the Qantas call centre. We had planned a Melbourne footy weekend but had to go thru Sydney to get there. Then we decided that we may as well just stay in Sydney so it required unwinding bookings to remove Melbourne. If you are a no show the rest of your ticket is invalidated. Frank fixed it all so we are smiling.
Thank you upgrade fairy for Mrscove's trip back to Perth from Melbourne. We booked her late and I know she enjoys the Suite on the refurbed A330.

 

[davidj]

Interesting development with Virgin deciding to open up PER-AUH, and cancel the SYD-AUH service. Apparently the market out west is better than SYD?!

Interesting to see what happens with this..

 

[BAM1748]

Interesting development with Virgin deciding to open up PER-AUH, and cancel the SYD-AUH service. Apparently the market out west is better than SYD?!

Interesting to see what happens with this..

What, Syd is being treated like dirt. I'd better start a thread.....

 

[RichardMEL]

Agree VA's move is a smart one and puts a little pressure on QF - both on MEL-LAX and PER-ME (though those EK 380's and the QR flight kind of cover it too).

A general comment now:

many of the posters here who are in/from WA comment on their wants and wishes - be it JNB, SIN or HKG.. and that's absolutely *fine* - as someone else said we all have our pet routes, places we need or want to go, and schedules we'd like. In the world where money isn't an issue we'd all have private jets to take us where and when we wanted with the comfort and service to boot. In the real world, each of us is just one point of demand vs a world of competition and supply - to the QF's, VA's and all the rest of this world it's simply a big economic cost/benefit analysis coupled with availability of aircraft, fitting into maintenance schedules, crew schedules, costs (and remember, the Asian and ME3 carriers have lower ones, which is why the SQ's and Scoots of this world can send widebodies down) and all the rest.

Yes, I loathe the 737's on all these routes, but QF has 75 of the buggers and bar the 332's and small fleet of 717's that's it on domestic and short haul international (eg: PER-SIN, some DPS routes, east coast-NZ etc). Why? they are profit machines - lower cost per passenger with relatively high density in Y, yet not too big to be able to allow for schedule and to compete on price. Would I rather be on a 737 PER-SIN or a 787? a 787 for sure! No brainer. Where does QF see a route to make money or at least break even? with a 737 rather than 330.

I suspect come a few years time as 787's come on line, this will have to push some 333's onto other routes, and you may yet see PER-SIN, PER-HKG or PER-BKK arrive in a wide (even if some of the dreamliners are replacing 744's). Agree QF has ceeded a lot of Asia to a certain degree, but things like opening up MEL-NRT and HND routes show that QF is clearly always running the numbers and working to a plan. It may not suit everyone, and never will, but they're in it to make money and keep afloat, not provide free F seats to everyone from ADL to Dubbo

 

[davidj]

but they're in it to make money and keep afloat, not provide free F seats to everyone from ADL to Dubbo

Now lets start a 'Qantas treats Dubbo like dirt' thread

Agreed with your comments. Most pax won't give two patooties what aircraft they fly, as long as it gets them from A to B safely, which is 737 certainly does. While sure I may want to fly a certain aircraft, the way some people react to the humble 737 and some other aircraft, we might as well start a thread 'Qantas treats Melbourne like dirt'.. how dare they fly a A330 to SIN, where other carriers fly A380s and B777s. Yes they need to make money and chopping routes and seats are some reasons they are making some coin now.

Why would Qantas add more capacity to reduce their profitability per seat is beyond me and surely their exec.

 

[cove]

Had a lovely ride home this afternoon from Melbourne after a week away. I had a refurbed A330 in business class and it was really good. Well done Qantas.

 

[SpudOz]

The Spudster and I are flying QF71 (per-sin) mid January 2017. The aircraft is an A330. Great! I didn't relish the thought of a 737..

 

[Moopere]

Why? they are profit machines - lower cost per passenger with relatively high density in Y, yet not too big to be able to allow for schedule and to compete on price. Would I rather be on a 737 PER-SIN or a 787? a 787 for sure! No brainer. Where does QF see a route to make money or at least break even? with a 737 rather than 330.

Agree pretty much with your analysis. However, the above snippet only really works in a monopoly. You use your highest-profit-available infrastructure and the PAX simply have to eat their dog food. In a competitive environment, where even some LCC's are flying wide bodies then you end with your potential 'profit' machines under booked or not booked. Then, usually, the reaction is to cancel routes because of 'not enough interest' - in actual fact there is plenty of interest, just not on the product being offered.

Also understand the angle of having a large fleet of unloved platforms too - but this is surely the inevitable result of poor planning? I mean surely the guys at the back-end crunching the numbers and writing the contracts have decades and decades of combined business intelligence which would rightly tell them that certain platforms are simply not going to be easily or happily accepted by PAX on certain types of route (ie; long ones). One can sell almost anything if the price is low enough of course, but QF has never played that particular game. Which means that they can't afford to make mistakes. Top shelf pricing means, for the most part, you need to provide top shelf product - particularly on highly competitive international routes, but also on domestic unless you don't have any competition.