It's Time to Refuse

[futaris]

Right now Qantas is asking you to choose to have choice taken away, by locking all your current and future credit card points in with the Qantas Frequent Flyer program. They've even given you a 'deadline'.
Remember when Qantas Frequent Flyer was the only Australian frequent flyer program? Because they were unchallenged, they were able to increase the number of points required to get a seat - and that was if you could get one.

• You don't actually have to do anything
• You won't lose your points if you decide not to transfer them to Qantas' Frequent Flyer program or change to a Qantas Frequent Flyer program direct-earn credit card
• You can continue to fly across the globe through your existing rewards program*, or through Velocity Rewards. Almost all credit card rewards programs offer multiple airline options

We've been stopping the big boys from having it all their way from day one, and we believe you should always have a real choice. At Virgin Blue, we continue to keep the air fair.

Find Out More

Saw this in the paper yesterday, and an e-mail came today.

There are far better options than Velocity, particularly from Amex MR. Consider Cathay Pacific Asia Miles (particularly for Oneworld RTW) or Singapore Airlines Krisflyer for long haul redemptions, as well as Virgin Atlantic.

If 100% of your points come from credit cards it is actually cheaper to redeem for a Business Class RTW on Cathay Pacific (at 4 MR:3 CX), than it is to redeem on QANTAS.

 

[lovetravellingoz]

Saw this in the paper yesterday, and an e-mail came today.

There are far better options than Velocity, particularly from Amex MR. Consider Cathay Pacific Asia Miles (particularly for Oneworld RTW) or Singapore Airlines Krisflyer for long haul redemptions, as well as Virgin Atlantic.

Plus with Krisflyer one can get access to good value Partner Awards with other *A carriers. Some are great value in themselves...and some are good when you cannot geta SQ Saver redemption to where you want to fly. "reportedly" also the ++taxes are lower on the Partners as opposed to SQ and so that can offset to some extent the slihtly higher point cost (but still mainly cheaper than QF Award Costs. ).

 

[JohnK]

There are far better options than Velocity, particularly from Amex MR. Consider Cathay Pacific Asia Miles (particularly for Oneworld RTW) or Singapore Airlines Krisflyer for long haul redemptions, as well as Virgin Atlantic.

If 100% of your points come from credit cards it is actually cheaper to redeem for a Business Class RTW on Cathay Pacific (at 4 MR:3 CX), than it is to redeem on QANTAS.
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Not too keen on Velocity but certainly Cathay Pacific Oneworld award in WHY looks like very good value and can also have lounge access and priority seating as opposed to using a *Alliance carrier. Definitely one to think about in the future. Thanks for the tip....

 

[futaris]

Yep, it's not too bad to use MR points for a Cathay Award, to get a Oneworld Economy RTW:

CX 20-25k Y RTW | 110k CX | 147k MR
CX 25-35k Y RTW | 130k CX | 174k MR
CX 35-50k Y RTW | 150k CX | 200k MR

Compares well to the QANTAS Oneworld Economy RTW:

QF 19.2-35k Y RTW | 142.5k QF | 142.5k MR (If transferred by 31 Mar 09)

Plus you get the added benefit that you can fly further if you have the time & points.

 

[Warks]

Saw this ad from Virgin yesterday too and was going to post it. Good spin from DJ if a little late in the piece. Still they have a point.

I ended up converting my points to Barbeques Galore vouchers!:shock:

(well I do need a new barbie!)

 

[jakeseven7]

Saw this ad from Virgin yesterday too and was going to post it. Good spin from DJ if a little late in the piece. Still they have a point.

there is so much spin out there from everyone it is hilarious.

yes virgin have left it too late and had a real scatter gun approach to this - their program is still a big work in progress and still unclear (especially international connections). they are claiming they are great!

amex commissioned research (to be done by this site) and suprise suprise it said MR was the best in most cases

qantas are promoting that you get the world and some by joining their program... hilarious

i think all parties have many options to improve their CC base later - all it will take is a great card with benefits! (i mean look how many people jumped at the citibank gold card FF when it came out)

 

[anat0l]

A bold move, if there ever was one, but then again fits the Virgin brand personality, so I'm not too surprised.

I've said it once and I'll say it again:

PEOPLE ARE DUMB

I'm not sure who in their right mind actually thought that if they didn't do something about their current situation (re: Qantas) that they would actually lose all of their points. Anyone who even thought for one second that would be the case should go jump in the lake.

It's also funny (and in some cases true) that Velocity really push that QF points are a backwards currency, i.e. to put it almost nicely, you'd have to be stupid to actually think your QF points can get you rewards (especially Award seats) that you want.

I never thought about Asia Miles, although it becomes mildly attractive after QF stops indirect sweeping.

Does anyone think that the Airpoints rate is worth it? Economy seems alright, but premium NZ or *A awards seem rather costly. KrisFlyer will probably trump it, especially if you are travelling soon in light of the multitude of specials (KrisFlyer's 10th birthday).

I'm not a big fan of the Velocity program. I don't really enjoy burning points on domestic - except if I'm in a real pinch or for upgrades - but why redeem points on DJ when in almost 95% of cases it's just as worthwhile to purchase the fare in cash or - gasp - consider JQ or QF? Also, the costs for partner awards - especially in premium classes - are ridiculous.

 

[JohnK]

Plus you get the added benefit that you can fly further if you have the time & points.

Would be a nice benefit for many people.

Personally, as mentioned earlier, I would prefer to fly Oneworld, and most likely RTW rather than point to point, and as Qantas no longer give me the option to transfer MR points to QFF I will be looking around for the best value WHY RTW award and at the same time make use of my Oneworld Emerald status....

 

[misstam]

There are far better options than Velocity, particularly from Amex MR. Consider Cathay Pacific Asia Miles (particularly for Oneworld RTW) or Singapore Airlines Krisflyer for long haul redemptions, as well as Virgin Atlantic.

If 100% of your points come from credit cards it is actually cheaper to redeem for a Business Class RTW on Cathay Pacific (at 4 MR:3 CX), than it is to redeem on QANTAS.
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Which of the Amex credit cards are linked to the My Rewards program? I have looked on their site but it doesn't seem clear to me.

 

[futaris]

MR = Membership Rewards in the above context. Ascent is the program that you need to be in to transfer to Cathay Pacific, etc.

 

[simongr]

I'm not a big fan of the Velocity program. I don't really enjoy burning points on domestic - except if I'm in a real pinch or for upgrades - but why redeem points on DJ when in almost 95% of cases it's just as worthwhile to purchase the fare in cash or - gasp - consider JQ or QF? Also, the costs for partner awards - especially in premium classes - are ridiculous.

I am of teh same view in relation to flight awards but in relation to points for vouchers it is better than MR. I only found this out today

 

[futaris]

I am of teh same view in relation to flight awards but in relation to points for vouchers it is better than MR. I only found this out today

Only till 14 April 2009. On 15 April 2009, the 25% bonus ends.

 

[NM]

MR = Membership Rewards in the above context. Ascent is the program that you need to be in to transfer to Cathay Pacific, etc.

just to add more clarity, Membership Rewards is the overall program for rewards from American Express. Within MR, there are several sub-programs that offer different benefits for different costs and cards. These include Ascent, Choices, Spirit and Blue Sky. With some cards you get to choose which program you want, other can only be in one program.

 

[misstam]

just to add more clarity, Membership Rewards is the overall program for rewards from American Express. Within MR, there are several sub-programs that offer different benefits for different costs and cards. These include Ascent, Choices, Spirit and Blue Sky. With some cards you get to choose which program you want, other can only be in one program.

Thanks NM/Futaris... I'm a bit of a virgin in the world of Amex...
Slowly getting my head around the Amex cards/reward programs with a view to getting a card that allows transfers to SPG (which i see now would be one linked to the Ascent program), then on to my AAdvantage account.

I'm wondering what the chances are of seeing some enticing credit card joining offers, post-'time to decide/refuse' day?

 

[Alanslegal]

Qantas FFP wants to lock you in. I'm REFUSING to be locked in.

I haven't exactly done my research but on face vaule, KrisFlyer redemptions look quite beneficial to me, and I can transfer MR and Citibank Points there.

I do have an ANZ FF Platinum card that's pre-locked into the QF sweep but ANZ is the only card that can be used for online gaming!

 

[thegurio]

Ok.... Like Alanslegal, i havent done a heap of research as well but what i would like to know is is there an indirect way to get to QF if i dont go now? Is there no other choice than now to transfer them i.e. 9 months down the track can i change to the program (spirit i think?) and then transfer to QF if i deem appropriate?

My problem is i would much rather credit to dj(VS/VX/VA) mostly because they are who i travel with domestically and it's a double edged sword, as i have more of a reason to travel higher up the plane! But unfortunately most of the places we go to are in Rome, Paris (most of the good cruises leave from there) and they dont "properly" fly there. Yes you can get there but it's not on one ticket.

The other side of the coin is that the people we travel with are in the "general public" section of the community who have already chosen direct sweep against my reccomendations so they will be travelling oneworld so that is another reason to go with them.

T-3 days and im still undecided!

 

[Keith009]

Qantas FFP wants to lock you in. I'm REFUSING to be locked in.

Same here, considering I don't earn any QFF points at all. The wider choice available was what prompted me to get AMEX rather than one of the QFF co-branded VI or MC even though there's wider acceptance of these cards.

Looking at the list of programs available I reckon Virgin flyingclub does it for me - and in many instances it's also cheaper than NZ's redemption levels on NZ flights. Tis also a chance to fly VS which I otherwise wouldn't do due to their non-membership of OW or *A. Krisflyer might be good for instances where there's Saver availability but too expensive otherwise. Or SPG to get more hotel nights, in many instances I spend more on hotels than flights anyway - transfer rate seems poor though; or launder over to AA in 20k lots.

Also has anyone dealt with MH Enrich before? MH would be a nice option to redeem with, but I can't find much info about the earn/burn on the website.

 

[StevePER]

Also has anyone dealt with MH Enrich before? MH would be a nice option to redeem with, but I can't find much info about the earn/burn on the website.

You need to get an Enrich account before you can access the mileage calculator.

Example burn rates:

MEL-KUL      32,000  45,000  54,000
MEL-KUL-MEL  45,000  75,000  90,000
MEL-LON      70,000  87,000 120,000
MEL-LON-MEL 100,000 145,000 200,000
KUL-LON      42,000 6 6,000  84,000
KUL-LON-KUL  60,000 110,000 140,000

Earn rates on MH appear to be:

L/V/S    40%
B/H/Q    70%
W/Y/K/M 100%
D       125%
C/J/A   150%
F/P     200%

On DJ it only lists Y as earning.

 

[Keith009]

Thanks StevePER. At 87 000 miles LON-Oz in business, that's cheaper than VS at 90 000. But that's offset by the better transfer ratio AMEX:VS, and I get the VSCH at LHR. Plus I've heard Enrich is extremely difficult to deal with?

I'd be mainly using these miles for repositioning flights, either to/from UK or North America so ideally will want a program with decent value to those places. Or perhaps use MR points as a supplement for my AAdvantage account as the miles I get from flying will still be 100% from OW. I like the idea of redeeming on airlines I'd otherwise never fly though. Hmm.

 

[anat0l]

MH rates even with the 4/3 conversion factor to Amex is still better than QF, but for me since I have QF status I prefer using QF/OW for my travel.

In order to redeem on MH, I think you need to visit an MH office (or equivalent as delegated by MH). There is no online awards booking system that I'm aware of. MH are a nice airline in some respects but when things go wrong they are either very good or very bad - it's two poles with no grey in between.

I'm not sure if you need to pay taxes/charges on a MH award, but if you do, they are rather high. Then again, so is VS (at least ex-LHR they are ).

Having said that, I'm not switching my Amex to QF direct since there are so many more options on the non-direct side. Compare this to my CBA Std Awards, which only has partners DJ and QF. Here I switched my CBA card to QF direct.