Complaint to Brent Godfrey

[mummy]

Can anyone help please? Does anyone know how to make sure theat Brent Godfrey receives a complaint?

In February this year I wrote a letter of complaint to Virgin Blue. It wasn't addressed to the CEO at that time. I received a reply in May!!! My complaint is (in a nutshell) that, having arranged flights to Bali for a family wedding (booked and paid for in January), I discovered by checking my itinerary that they had cancelled my return flight and rescheduled it for approx 15 hours earlier. So, we're losing almost a day's holiday, and having to travel in the middle of the night with 2 small children. I haven't officially been told of the change as yet (no email received).
I know their terms and conditions say that they can change schedules because of industrial action, unsuitable weather conditions, landing restrictions, technical problems, operational reasons, or any event beyond their control, but how can any of those things happen 5 MONTHS before the flight? What is the point of advertising a flight schedule on their website, only to change it when they feel like it?

They are only operating in their interests not the consumers' interests.

Sorry to go on but I hope that someone can help

 

[NM]

Such a complaint should not require to be read or actioned by the CEO of an airline. If the CEO was to be involved with all such complaints then he will not actually be able to do his job. I expect there are better ways to resolve the issue than to try to get your complaint in front of the CEO.

When you originally complained in February, what outcome did you seek?

What was the response you received in May?

What outcome would you like to see now?

Have you called Pacific Blue (Virgin Blue do not fly to international destinations) and asked them about the options available to you as a result of the schedule change?

 

[mummy]

I rang Virgin Blue at the outset. They deal with Pacific Blue. I was offered a flight for the next day. My family and I live in Townsville. I had already booked my domestic flights with Jetstar. I would have lost money reschedulling that flight.

I accept the terms and conditions of carriage and the reasons why there might be a cancellation/reschedulling of flights. However, I do not accept that those reasons can be applied to a flight scheduled 5 months in advance.

My point is this. I paid for the international tickets in January. I think that it's wrong that an airline can have my money (and anyone else's) and then do what they like.

The reply I received was conciliatory but, nevertheless, unhelpful. My complaint has been lodged with the Management Team whatever that means.

I realise that the airline are not going to change anything for one person and her family. However, as a consumer, I don't think that the airline industry should be permitted to treat their customers in such a cavalier fashion. They have my money and I haven't received anything for it as yet. I doubt very much if they would do this to Kevin Rudd. Why should they do it to me?

Thank you for replying.

 

[straitman]

mummy,

Welcome to AFF.

Unfortunately these things do occur and within reason we have to live with them.

The obvious question that must be asked here is do you have travel insurance?

 

[maninblack]

Sorry I understand that you are annoyed but I think you are being a little silly about this. I think that you have had plenty of time to accept the issue and deal with it. Last minute changes are far more annoying. How much are the Jetstar changes going to be? It is perfectly reasonable for an airline to do a schedule change 5 months before the departure date. It happens all the time.

And I really don't see what it has to do with Kevin Rudd. But I would remind you that even Mr Rudd sometimes does not get the meal he ordered!

 

[Dave Noble]

They did offer to put you on the next days flight and so extend by 9 hours

I don't see that there are any real grounds for complaint and it isn't their fault that you have booked separate tickets on another carrier

The other option is to cancel and rebook on another carrier

Dave

 

[NM]

So what is the outcome yo are seeking? You need to clearly communicate that to the airline.

When an airline makes a schedule change there are a few options that can generally be negotiated and often any fees that would normally be associated those options are waived. Such options generally include:

• Change to a different flight that meets your requirements (day before, day after etc). The only time you can expect to be accommodated on a different airline is if the booked airline ceases operating the route.
• A full refund of the fare paid and you can make alternate arrangements with an airline of your choice.

When calling the airline, you should be specific and realistic about the outcome you want.

Perhaps one outcome you could request would be that they carry you on a DJ flight back to TSV since your existing JQ booking cannot be changed. But of course there is no obligation for them to do so.

Do note that this is one reason that many members here avoid trips that involve combining different tickets as you are not protected under such circumstances. If you have purchased a single ticket that included both the DPS-BNE and BNE-TSV legs (or SYD or whatever the connecting point is), then they would have reaccommodated you on an appropriate connecting Virgin Blue flight to TSV. Often the money saved by purchasing two separate tickets ends up being false economy when things do not go as originally planned. What was the plan if the Pacific Blue flight was delayed and you missed the JetStar flight to Townsville?

You could also see if your travel insurance policy covers the cost of rebooking the TSV flight as a result of the schedule change.

Airlines do make schedule changes regularly. They do so for many reasons, including aircraft utilisation/efficiency, knock-on affects from other changes, operational efficiency. With the current downturn in travel demand, some flights are being removed from schedules, others re-timed etc. Such changes are not unique to Pacific Blue or Virgin Blue but are happening through most airlines at the moment.

 

[harvyk]

I’d be looking at getting a refund and then seeing what JQ can do for you… They may be more accommodating with flight changes if it means your increasing the amount of spend with their airline.

The other choice is to stay the extra 9 hours and simply re-book the JQ flights (or DJ \ QF depending on what is best at the time) for a later time and absorb the cancellation costs.

I think those you have just learnt a valuable lesson about booking two different sectors on two different tickets. If both sectors where on the same ticket it’d have been not a problem, and yes even competing airlines will work together from time to time.


As others have said, try having your flight cancelled at the last minute and have as the last flight out of the night forcing you to spend the night away from home. 5 months notice is more than generous.

 

[N860CR]

then seeing what JQ can do for you… They may be more accommodating with flight changes if it means your increasing the amount of spend with their airline.

Without sounding rude... thats a little naieve. The option would be to refund the entire booking (which Virgin will happily do) then investigate options on another carrier if Virgin are no longer suitable.

All airlines frequently make changes (and generally leave it up to you to find out about it). I've booked probably 50 tickets with Qantas this year and 45 of them have had schedule changes (as well as a SYD-PEK becoming a SYD-HKG-PEK which has changed again and will need even further changing!)

It happens... an unfortunatley there is little we can do about it

 

[Alanslegal]

Such a complaint should not require to be read or actioned by the CEO of an airline. If the CEO was to be involved with all such complaints then he will not actually be able to do his job. I expect there are better ways to resolve the issue than to try to get your complaint in front of the CEO.

I like this comment. I say something quite often in my workplace esp. at angy clients LOL

 

[harvyk]

danielribo, I think you mis-understood me. I'm suggesting that "mummy" get's a refund from DJ, as she would be entitled to do, and then contacting JQ and booking the int flights through them as well. They may be more accomodating with changes because of this.

Of course I would only suggest doing this if she can both do it ecconmonically, and flights line up somewhat ok.

In regard to refunding the entire booking, I think that's half the problem, from what I can gather there are two bookings, which means that a cancellation or change on one will have no effect on the other.

When ever I fly using multiple carriers (QF + AirNZ seems to be a popular choice for me right now) I make sure that the flights from both carriers are still under the one booking. It's meant that should I need to change one which ever airline it is can be accomodating.

 

[Alanslegal]

Flight time changes all the time and I guess you are lucky to have figured it out by yourself five months before the actual trip. I am very certain the airline would eventually try to contact you via telephone in the first instance to advise of the flight cancellation and what they could do to accommodate you due to the changes eg. put you on an earlier or later flight depending on your needs.

Also in the event of a non-phone call the eventual email would arrive but don't expect some airlines to advise you immediately when changes are made esp. when it comes to budget-type carriers.


But least of not all, its still 5 months to your flights and there is a slight chance the airline may reinstate your flight

 

[mummy]

Many thanks to all of you for your replies.

When I booked my flight with PB, I decided to go with them because they were the cheapest on offer (I cannot be blamed for doing that). The orignal flight landed at 11.30pm in BNE so I obviously had to arrange for overnight accommodation. My domestic flight leaves at around 9.30am the next day with Jetstar. There is not a problem (even with the flight changes) for me to get a connection with my domestic flight. I will be travelling with my 2 grandchildren (3 and 2 years). So I chose PB as their original flight times enabled us to get the children settled on the plane to sleep. Now we're leaving in the middle of the night.

In a nutshell my complaint is that I do not understand how an airline can change its schedule 5 months in advance and they STILL haven't notified me officially. I found out by going onto my itinerary which is not something I usually do. The reply I received from VB didn't explain why they'd made a change. They have my money, I think that I'm entitled to an explanation.

I'm not entitled to a refund. They will only give me a credit to use later. That's not an option for most of my party with whom I'm travelling. We're only going to Bali for a family wedding. It's not a place we've been to before and we're not likely to go again.

Why should anyone have to accept a change so far in advance.

ALANSLEGAL: I found this out in February this year. I booked my flights in January, and we leave 19th July. I complained straight away and it took VB 3 months to reply.

NM: The point I made to VB is that they have my money and they can do what they like with it. I have paid for something that I haven't received. I do not think that it's right to treat people in this way.

I can handle a flight being changed at the last minute because of sick pilots/cabin crew, a war in the destination airport, plane delayed, plane out of service BUT there is NO REASON why a flight should be rescheduled and no reason given. Why are airlines doing this all of the time and why is everyone accepting it? I expect that the answer to that is that there's no other choice.

I have travelled internationally several times (but not with Qantas, PB or Virgin) and have never come across this before.

Once again. Thanks for your comments. You haven't changed the way I feel. I feel that the consumer is being taken for a ride (sorry for the unintended pun!!).

 

[Dave Noble]

Changes to schedules happen to all airlines. When they happen you need to work with it to get the best that you can. Either go earlier or go later

If you have travel insurance , then that may help cover cost of changes to other flights but not something that Virgin is there to fix, no more than any other special requirement that people are taking flights for ( e.g. cruises )

The airline is not likely to go into why they have changed their schedules; it is something that happens from time to time and not an uncommon occurence

Dave

 

[N860CR]

danielribo, I think you mis-understood me. I'm suggesting that "mummy" get's a refund from DJ, as she would be entitled to do, and then contacting JQ and booking the int flights through them as well. They may be more accomodating with changes because of this.

Unforunatley calling Jetstar and going "hey if I booked another flight with you, will you let me change this one without any of the usual hassles" is not going to result in anything. Yes, she is more than entitled to refund her DJ ticket, and yes she can rebook on JQ if she wants - but JQ aren't going to go do her any favours because of it.

 

[albatross710]

I like this comment. I say something quite often in my workplace esp. at angy clients LOL

ditto : shouldn't one of these many other people on my payroll be able to resolve this - they have the authority!

 

[moa999]

mummy,

In the current environment airlines are cancelling and rescheduling flights all over the place due to low yields (number of people on the plane).
- eg. rather than flying two planes half full, airlines are cancelling one flight so they fly a full plane. This is purely ensuring the airlines are making money and thus surviving.

Frankly if you have booked flights more than about two weeks out you are at risk of flight changes.
(even Qantas recently changed Brisbane to Los Angeles from 7 days a week to 6. On Mondays passengers now have to travel via Sydney).

You have also unfortunately chosen to book your itinerary on separate airlines and separate tickets - this generally means you bear the risk of any flight changes.

Most of the frequent flyers on this board will book one itinerary tickets, or have sufficient travel insurance, to protect against these events.

 

[mummy]

BILL: Thanks for your reply. Yes, I do have travel insurance.

DAVE: Thanks for your reply. I cannot go earlier or later. We are going for a family wedding. I booked so far in advance to make sure I had seats and because the airline was offering such a good deal in price. That, it now seems, was a big mistake but it would have been foolhardy to have waited until 2 weeks before I wanted to go to book the flights. How could I have been sure that I would get seats?

The overwhelming impression I have from all of your replies is that you all seem to be happy with the fact that airlines can change their schedules when they feel like it. Why are you happy to accept it? I know that there is a problem with getting bums on seats for some routes. I think that in my case Pacific Blue thought they would "try" a particular schedule to see if they had any takers. When they found that they didn't have many, they scrapped the flight that I had booked to go on and changed it to another. Again, I go back to my original points. Why should the consumer allow airlines to take his/her money and do what they like? It would be much better to say what they're doing and only take a deposit for a flight with the remainder payable nearer the time of departure. (I can hear the sharp intake of breath.)

Thank you again for writing to me.

 

[N860CR]

Mummy, I think you'll find most people are accepting it for the simple fact that we have to. While you're situation is unfortunate, it is not unique (nor is it unique to Pacific Blue). I agree, it is very frustrating, however it is unfortunatley a risk we have to take when booking air travel.

As I mentioned before, 90% of the flights I've taken this year have been rescheduled anywhere from 24 hours to 6 months prior to travel. These are generally on Qantas, and their assistance has been no better than that of Pacific Blue. Infact, in my experience, Virgin is more reliable in keeping to their schedules than any member of the Qantas group.

Yes its annoying, yes it causes inconvienience and yes it costs us money - but there is nothing than we can do

 

[Alanslegal]

The overwhelming impression I have from all of your replies is that you all seem to be happy with the fact that airlines can change their schedules when they feel like it. Why are you happy to accept it?

Yes it can be a huge inconvenience when flight times change etc but flying in principle is the same as catching a bus, train, tram, monorail et al. They all have a timetable and sometimes they do need to change for whatever reason - maybe the football finals was on something and they needed more trams to take people there meaning other services are cut - but the same idea applies, even for flights.

I know it stinks when you find out that your flight time have changed (for the worse) but best practice would indicate you jump on the telephone and call the airline immediately. Tell them you are inconvenienced due to the changes and ask them what they can do to make it less inconvenient. I'm sure they would have at least tried to assist you there.

Sending of a complaint letter in and hoping for a resolution often 1) is ignored 2) takes way too long 3) is indirect and 4) unlikely to solve your problem.