Ata

[lampardcl]

American Trans Air

I really wanted to take my four children to disneyland but with the airfares increasing i decided it would be clever to book a jetstar SYD to HNL then ATA HNL to LAX. So i bought 6 return airfares for a total of $5500.00 in november 2007. Anyway we leave in 4 weeks time , and yesterday morning i woke to an email from ATA they have declared bankrupt. I am devasted . I have spoken to my cc company and they say they will lodge a dispute for unreceived goods. What are our chances ? has anyone had any experince with somthing like this? i just feel stupid

 

[ANstar]

I'm pretty sure you will get a full refund from your credit card company.

It may take quite a while to process, so I would suggest booking the HNL-LAX flights with another carrier ASAP.

 

[v8Statesman]

I really wanted to take my four children to disneyland but with the airfares increasing i decided it would be clever to book a jetstar SYD to HNL then ATA HNL to LAX. So i bought 6 return airfares for a total of $5500.00 in november 2007. Anyway we leave in 4 weeks time , and yesterday morning i woke to an email from ATA they have declared bankrupt. I am devasted . I have spoken to my cc company and they say they will lodge a dispute for unreceived goods. What are our chances ? has anyone had any experince with somthing like this? i just feel stupid

You _maybe_ ok.

Quote united.com

[FONT=Arial, Helvetica]If you have a flight number that is shown as Aloha 1100 - Aloha 1299 these flights are operated by United and will continue to operate.[/FONT]

 

[lampardcl]

Ahola Airlines is different to ATA . ATA was the second airline to collapse in the us this week.So the credit card option is my only hope. I have re booked with Alaska airlines at a higher price.

 

[Arthur Hodgson]

You _maybe_ ok.

Quote united.com

[FONT=Arial, Helvetica]If you have a flight number that is shown as Aloha 1100 - Aloha 1299 these flights are operated by United and will continue to operate.[/FONT]

It may have escaped your notice, but this is a different airline we are talking about here, it is "American Trans Air", AKA ATA.

I'd suggest you check your facts in future before responding to a distraught passenger like this.

 

[Arthur Hodgson]

Ahola Airlines is different to ATA . ATA was the second airline to collapse in the us this week.So the credit card option is my only hope. I have re booked with Alaska airlines at a higher price.

Don't worry, your fares will be refunded by your credit card company.

Alaska is a fine airline, but I would have also looked at Hawaiian Airlines (HA), who do tend to be the price leader on this route. I am myself flying HA HNL-LAX in August, $220 one-way.

Hope it all works out for you.

 

[v8Statesman]

It may have escaped your notice, but this is a different airline we are talking about here, it is "American Trans Air", AKA ATA.

I'd suggest you check your facts in future before responding to a distraught passenger like this.

Arthur,

Forgive me for thinking it is inconceivable to 2 airlines to fail in a week in the LOFAP.

No I didn’t check to see if it was the same airline. I made an assumption base on the flights being from Hawaii to the mainland. I also stipulated that it _maybe_ a solution. Not some snake oil cure-all.


While I can appreciate your “jump to the fore”. I think your attack on me was rather unnecessary

 

[lampardcl]

Don't worry, your fares will be refunded by your credit card company.

Alaska is a fine airline, but I would have also looked at Hawaiian Airlines (HA), who do tend to be the price leader on this route. I am myself fling HA HNL-LAX in August, $220 one-way.

Hope it all works out for you.

Thankyou for your kind words , Im feeling more postive now knowing we should receive $2000.00 AUD refund, which will give us plenty of disney dollars to spend

 

[trooper]

...and Skybus makes three......

Interesting that those holding Aloha tickets have more options than those booked with ATA... (DL - at least, possibly others as well - are offering $100 standby tickets to stranded ATA pax which is a decent offer...)

Is that just the result of interline agreements (which I think ATA avoided)or was ATA just universally disliked in the industry?

P.S. Congrats to the OP for quickly getting some other decent fares!!!

 

[oz_mark]

airlines are dropping like flies at the moment. Just be thankful Geoff didn't get his way a yearago, or QF could be in amongst them now.

 

[Travel Guru]

I actually would have to disagree with Arthur, I don't see your chances of receiving a reimbursement from your credit card as all that likely.

For a credit card company to reimburse you, they have to first do a charge back against whoever charged your card in the first place, which if its the airline who are now in the hands of the liquidators, you could be waiting for a very long time before you'll see any money if ever.

If it was charged by a TA, you've got a very good chance; when Ansett went belly up, millions of dollars was charged back to agents like Flight Centre, but i'm not so sure about those who booked direct with the airline, as I certainly can't see Visa/MC/Amex etc wearing the costs, and even if they did, im sure given that experience they've since reworded their T&C's to cover themselves from such liability.

I hope i'm wrong, but I certainly wouldn't be getting my hopes up of seeing your money again.

TG

 

[ANstar]

Credit Card companies actually guarantee you to receive the services... it si some sort of proteciton by using their card.

Wehn Skybus went bust, they basically told everyone to get refunded by their card issuer

 

[bambbbam2]

Obv. we aren't the credit card company, but I would put money on you getting your money back.

This has happened several times before and credit card paying people are ok.

 

[Dave Noble]

I actually would have to disagree with Arthur, I don't see your chances of receiving a reimbursement from your credit card as all that likely.

For a credit card company to reimburse you, they have to first do a charge back against whoever charged your card in the first place, which if its the airline who are now in the hands of the liquidators, you could be waiting for a very long time before you'll see any money if ever.

If it was charged by a TA, you've got a very good chance; when Ansett went belly up, millions of dollars was charged back to agents like Flight Centre, but i'm not so sure about those who booked direct with the airline, as I certainly can't see Visa/MC/Amex etc wearing the costs, and even if they did, im sure given that experience they've since reworded their T&C's to cover themselves from such liability.

I hope i'm wrong, but I certainly wouldn't be getting my hopes up of seeing your money again.

TG

Not at all. When purchasing with a credit card there is protection against these events

When paying by cash, the agreement is between you and the supplier and if the supplier goes out of business, you would just join the list of creditors

Paying by credit card, then there are 2 agreements; one between the credit card company and the card holder and another between the card company and the supplier.

if the supplier goes out of business and has not provided the services, then you can claim back from the card company and the card company joins the list of creditors to the supplier

Dave

 

[oz_mark]

So, is this little thing in Flight Centre's terms enforceable or not? (Note, I have only used Flight Centre once, and I am pretty sure the payment was actually made to Qantas Holidays rather than FC)

Credit Card Transactions:
Credit card surcharges may apply when paying by credit card. If for any reason any travel service provider is unable to provide the services for which you have contracted, your remedy lies against that provider, and not against Flight Centre Limited. In the event that payment has been made to Flight Centre Limited by credit card, you agree that you will not seek to charge back your payment to Flight Centre Limited.

 

[DTM1]

I think that that is outrageous.

That clause simply seeks to contractually reverse your entitlement to recover against the agent, which would be the starting position (as discussed above).

I would be surprised if that provision was enforceable in any event (unconscionable, unfair provisions etc), but would not be surprised to see Flight Centre try it on against people who might not know any better.

It never ceases to amaze me as to what some people will try to do to make money but take no responsibility....:evil:

 

[Travel Guru]

I think that that is outrageous.

That clause simply seeks to contractually reverse your entitlement to recover against the agent, which would be the starting position (as discussed above).

I would be surprised if that provision was enforceable in any event (unconscionable, unfair provisions etc), but would not be surprised to see Flight Centre try it on against people who might not know any better.

It never ceases to amaze me as to what some people will try to do to make money but take no responsibility....:evil:

Given how seriously and professionally their in house legal team take anything that's put in writing, i'd say it would be completely water tight legally.

I actually can't blame them for inserting such a provision into their T&C given the millions and millions of dollars in chargebacks they incurred when Ansett went belly up.

I don't see why they should have to take responsibility for another companies failure especially given that when I last checked, FC played no part in their demise and were given no forewarning of any impending doom.

I think its quite ridiculous actually that you as a consumer would expect Flight Centre to wear the burden of a companies failure to deliver especially given that chances are that it was you, and not the agent who chose the airline you wanted to fly on, and that to claim a chargeback from your card providor for non delivery of services has nothing to do with Flight Centre and everything to do with the airline who just went bust.

TG

 

[v8Statesman]

"In the event that payment has been made to Flight Centre Limited by credit card, you agree that you will not seek to charge back your payment to Flight Centre Limited. "

I have had issue with a quote similar to this from another company. When the goods never arrived. I did a charge back. They jumped up and down and pointed to this term in the T&C.

I wrote back to them and said that I followed the procedure of my bank and for them to take it up with them. They never ever got back to me. (I got my money back)

 

[NM]

Perhaps FC should have paid their bill from Ansett via a credit card and then they would have been protected themselves . And could have earned lots of FF points at the same time.

 

[DTM1]

Given how seriously and professionally their in house legal team take anything that's put in writing, i'd say it would be completely water tight legally.

TG

I think you've swallowed their spin - I'm aware of a number instances where they have done things that they should not have or which have been incorrect.

I personally think that clause has more holes than a sieve.