Another degradation of QFi product?

[katiebell]

Until today I have been able to book a side trip to Europe as a common rated destination (i.e. at no extra cost other than taxes etc) when flying QF to LHR (effectively LHR is my stopover en route to the European destination). Today when I tried to book a J fare Aus-LHR with side trip to a European destination it was not possible: all European flights incurred a considerable extra cost, often more than it would have cost to book a separate short haul ticket with BA. (& I am not including the taxes etc etc in my calculations: I accept that these have been an extra cost for many years).

Is this another QF 'enhancement' that has been quietly enacted? When I last booked a few months ago it was no problem to get the common rated destination on the ticket.

If QF have removed the common rated destinations from QF1/2 & QF 9/10 then they have seriously degraded the product and the attractiveness of flying QFi.

Other 'enhancements' such as transit in DXB (rather than HKG or SIN) and degrading of food, wine and spirits are all making QF 1/2 & QF 9/10 less and less attractive (the EK code share is of no interest as I need to go via LHR and have EK on my airlines blacklist)

 

[exceladdict]

Until today I have been able to book a side trip to Europe as a common rated destination (i.e. at no extra cost other than taxes etc) when flying QF to LHR (effectively LHR is my stopover en route to the European destination). Today when I tried to book a J fare Aus-LHR with side trip to a European destination it was not possible: all European flights incurred a considerable extra cost, often more than it would have cost to book a separate short haul ticket with BA. (& I am not including the taxes etc etc in my calculations: I accept that these have been an extra cost for many years).

Is this another QF 'enhancement' that has been quietly enacted? When I last booked a few months ago it was no problem to get the common rated destination on the ticket.

If QF have removed the common rated destinations from QF1/2 & QF 9/10 then they have seriously degraded the product and the attractiveness of flying QFi.

Other 'enhancements' such as transit in DXB (rather than HKG or SIN) and degrading of food, wine and spirits are all making QF 1/2 & QF 9/10 less and less attractive (the EK code share is of no interest as I need to go via LHR and have EK on my airlines blacklist)

And now, you can't transfer your bags through if you book a side ticket either...

 

[CaviAck]

Until today I have been able to book a side trip to Europe as a common rated destination (i.e. at no extra cost other than taxes etc) when flying QF to LHR (effectively LHR is my stopover en route to the European destination). Today when I tried to book a J fare Aus-LHR with side trip to a European destination it was not possible: all European flights incurred a considerable extra cost, often more than it would have cost to book a separate short haul ticket with BA. (& I am not including the taxes etc etc in my calculations: I accept that these have been an extra cost for many years).

Is this another QF 'enhancement' that has been quietly enacted? When I last booked a few months ago it was no problem to get the common rated destination on the ticket.

If QF have removed the common rated destinations from QF1/2 & QF 9/10 then they have seriously degraded the product and the attractiveness of flying QFi.

Other 'enhancements' such as transit in DXB (rather than HKG or SIN) and degrading of food, wine and spirits are all making QF 1/2 & QF 9/10 less and less attractive (the EK code share is of no interest as I need to go via LHR and have EK on my airlines blacklist)

You'd have to look up the routing rules, there were only a select number of EU destinations that QF allowed routing through LHR for no or very little extra cost on the cheap tickets. Ever since the tie up with EK, cheap tickets to EU destinations that EK fly to have routing restrictions to be one stop from SYD via DXB.

 

[katiebell]

You'd have to look up the routing rules, there were only a select number of EU destinations that QF allowed routing through LHR for no or very little extra cost on the cheap tickets. Ever since the tie up with EK, cheap tickets to EU destinations that EK fly to have routing restrictions to be one stop from SYD via DXB.

I have tried all the destination I have used in the past (incl those also served by EK) and more and none are available. The routing rules suggest that side trips are still available but this is not hte case when tryting to book the flights

 

[CaviAck]

I have tried all the destination I have used in the past (incl those also served by EK) and more and none are available. The routing rules suggest that side trips are still available but this is not hte case when tryting to book the flights

May be a problem with the QF website, some users have reported issues with searching flights on the QF website, including myself just now.

 

[katiebell]

May be a problem with the QF website, some users have reported issues with searching flights on the QF website, including myself just now.

TA couldn't do it either

 

[amaroo]

And now, you can't transfer your bags through if you book a side ticket either...

I know it's an early call, but .... Bingo!

 

[madrooster]

I have tried all the destination I have used in the past (incl those also served by EK) and more and none are available. The routing rules suggest that side trips are still available but this is not hte case when tryting to book the flights

Do you have a range of example ports and dates?

 

[katiebell]

Do you have a range of example ports and dates?

ABZ, GLA, EDI, MLA, TXL, RIK, HEL, BSL, VNO, AAL, AAR, VIE, LCA, HAM, NUE, OSL, BGO, IOM, and several more all for September

 

[trippin_the_rift]

I don't see how this is a QFi product degradation.... more like revenue management doing their job by waking up each morning and thinking 'how can we make more money today?'.

 

[katiebell]

I don't see how this is a QFi product degradation.... more like revenue management doing their job by waking up each morning and thinking 'how can we make more money today?'.

from a pax perspective it is a degradation: it is a loss of a previously-offered service. Revenue Mx need to remember that a product needs to be attractive if it is to be sold: the loss of common rating destinations makes QFi less attractive than those that offer this or are cheaper, have better routing, timimg etc etc

 

[JohnK]

from a pax perspective it is a degradation: it is a loss of a previously-offered service.

I am not saying it is the same but Qantas removed the ex-Brazil airfares.

Also airfares ex-SIN back to Australia were extremely cheap and allowed me to stopover in SYD on the way to BNE and vice-versa. Now airfares ex-SIN are more expensive than airfares originating in Australia.

Qantas is always reviewing airfares and making adjustments where necessary.

 

[trippin_the_rift]

from a pax perspective it is a degradation: it is a loss of a previously-offered service. Revenue Mx need to remember that a product needs to be attractive if it is to be sold: the loss of common rating destinations makes QFi less attractive than those that offer this or are cheaper, have better routing, timimg etc etc

Let's explore alternate paths....

- You've said it's been at low/no cost for the extra leg for some time. Maybe this is tightening a flaw which has existed rather than removing what you perceived to be a benefit.

- The volume of searches and bookings made like you've been doing it may be too low to warrant maintaining pricing intelligence tools, analysts and human capital to maintain these pricing products. Similar to ex brazil and sin like JohnK mentions.

- Between EK and a growing Oneworld footprint, it's making point to point bookings easier and thus this may be where QF now focus efforts to grow existing routes rather than support every tiny city via LHR on their own marked#.

We need to remember most people don't want to travel SYD-DXB-LHR-xx_ and would rather a SYD-DXB-xx_.
So while it may be less attractive to you - it likely has virtually zero negative impact on QF. Will you stop flying Qantas because of this? If anything - they now generate higher margins from your flights since theres no need to fund the extra segments.

 

[Mattg]

If I want to fly to TXL and book with QF, the only option is to go via LHR as EK don't fly there. If that's now costing a lot more money, then I would consider that a degradation.

 

[katiebell]

If I want to fly to TXL and book with QF, the only option is to go via LHR as EK don't fly there. If that's now costing a lot more money, then I would consider that a degradation.

Correct: TXL seems to be no longer a common rated destination. It makes AY much more attractive as a means of getting to TXL.

 

[katiebell]

Let's explore alternate paths....

- You've said it's been at low/no cost for the extra leg for some time. Maybe this is tightening a flaw which has existed rather than removing what you perceived to be a benefit.

- The volume of searches and bookings made like you've been doing it may be too low to warrant maintaining pricing intelligence tools, analysts and human capital to maintain these pricing products. Similar to ex brazil and sin like JohnK mentions.

- Between EK and a growing Oneworld footprint, it's making point to point bookings easier and thus this may be where QF now focus efforts to grow existing routes rather than support every tiny city via LHR on their own marked#.

We need to remember most people don't want to travel SYD-DXB-LHR-xx_ and would rather a SYD-DXB-xx_.
So while it may be less attractive to you - it likely has virtually zero negative impact on QF. Will you stop flying Qantas because of this? If anything - they now generate higher margins from your flights since theres no need to fund the extra segments.

For a long time (longer than I have been travelling) QF marketted the short haul flight to Europe as a bonus (in reality it matched what many other airlines offered at the end of the long haul sector(s) and was not a flaw but a deliberate marketting tool). Most people I know do not want to fly EK and, interestingly, the DXB-LHR sectors are getting fuller suggesting more pax want to stay on QF. There are still destinations that EK do not serve but BA do and it seems that pax are now shoved onto EK and then another non-OW carrier so all the benefits of FF status are of no use (& I find them particularly useful in long haul/multisector travel).

And yes, I have instructed my TA to look at other carriers when i need to travel to Europe rather than just LHR.

Is this another step towards leaving OW?

 

[trippin_the_rift]

For a long time (longer than I have been travelling) QF marketted the short haul flight to Europe as a bonus (in reality it matched what many other airlines offered at the end of the long haul sector(s) and was not a flaw but a deliberate marketting tool). Most people I know do not want to fly EK and, interestingly, the DXB-LHR sectors are getting fuller suggesting more pax want to stay on QF. There are still destinations that EK do not serve but BA do and it seems that pax are now shoved onto EK and then another non-OW carrier so all the benefits of FF status are of no use (& I find them particularly useful in long haul/multisector travel).

And yes, I have instructed my TA to look at other carriers when i need to travel to Europe rather than just LHR.

Is this another step towards leaving OW?

If QF no longer meets your needs then looking at other carriers makes sense.
The extra leg as a marketing tool? Would have cost QF a fair chunk and perhaps the cost to benefit ratio simply isn't there anymore? I like the idea of the bonus leg as an option but as QF no doubt are dissecting ports by inbound/outbound and potential future traffic (there's a host of analytical tools airlines use to predict traffic flow) they may be looking at this from a purely financial point of view. This would be in alignment with some other good and poor decisions that have come from the QF machine over the years.

I can't see QF leaving Oneworld, it would mean the death of a large chunk of revenue generate from multiple sources.

 

[junbugging]

For a long time (longer than I have been travelling) QF marketted the short haul flight to Europe as a bonus (in reality it matched what many other airlines offered at the end of the long haul sector(s) and was not a flaw but a deliberate marketting tool). Most people I know do not want to fly EK and, interestingly, the DXB-LHR sectors are getting fuller suggesting more pax want to stay on QF.

A few claims here without substantiating data.

And some of my best friends fly EK.

 

[medhead]

A lot of this discussion is ignoring the OPs desire to have a LHR stopover. I would guess that is still a fairly popular option for many of Qantas' customers. EK DXB into Europe does not address that requirement/desire.

To the OP, have you checked the cost of getting to your final destination, then checking if the fare rules have the usual Stopover option for an extra payment (e.g. $100)

 

[medhead]

A few claims here without substantiating data.

And some of my best friends fly EK.

This is like an unsubstantiated 3 word slogan. Do you really want the data analytics on the claim that most people katiebell knows do not want to fly EK? I'm pretty happy to accept that at face value without needing substantiating data. I'm not sure how the habits of your best friends impacts on the habits of katiebell's friends. I'd be prepared to claim that your best friends are not among the OPs friends. But then you might want substatiating data, so I better not make that claim.

As for loads on QF between DXB and LHR that data is published. I'm sure you can look it up.