The Pinot Noir & Grenache Thread

Something that I omitted to mention in the wrap-up of the 2010 Pinots was that several bottles had on the back label words to the effect of: 'Cellar for up to 5-7 years'. The winemakers saw no reason to age them excessively.

I have subscribed to Main Ridge Estate, the pioneer of the Mornington Peninsula GI, for many years. I recall being at the winery one day some years ago talking with Nat White, the founder, and I made some comment about aging the wines. Nat is a deep thinker of very quiet demeanour. His reaction was essentially a very understated: 'why?'.

It reminded me of being a callow student and standing in front of the Esteemed Prof and being asked - far less gently - to justify my question or comment.

Err, err - 'Because that's what everyone says is what ought to be done.' This was not going to cut the mustard with Nat (or the Prof for that matter. This was the days well before Snowflakes, I might add...).

Err, err - 'Nat, isn't the weather great today' (something remarkable for the Mornington - that bit's a joke peeps!:oops:) was probably my erudite response as I cringed into my hole. He was the most subtle and incisive 'Prof' I think I've encountered. I simply had no answer for his (seemingly) very simple question. But it was the wry smile and gentle tone that sent JohnM into his (familiar:rolleyes::D) C-student territory.

Sure, Pinot with its high acidity will last a long time. But is longevity the point? The wines will still be good, but do you want the vibrancy gone:confused:? I don't. Nor, I think, do the winemakers when they suggest up to 5-7 year drinking windows.

All those 2010s were still absolutely sound because of their (noticeably) high acidity - but, as I said, they had lost distinctiveness. A blind tasting would have found a very flat field. Broadly speaking, while pleasure remained, any real excitement had gone. OK, maybe they had gone into the supposed 'dumb' stage and maybe 2010 was not considered a particularly good vintage (I haven't checked that) - but vintage variation in Aus/NZ is generally nothing like dodgy Europe.

Now, varieties with high phenolics (Cab Sauv, Shiraz), are a different matter. They take more time to soften and settle. However, modern winemaking techniques mean that you don't have to wait a substantial proportion of your lifetime to get them to a drinkable state.

Ducking for cover...:):D
 
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Now I fully realise the gravity of the next statement but truth must out.

“Sorry JohnM, your statement about aged Pinot is wanting.”:)

This is brilliant. Drinking superbly, still lovely fruit, spiced strong tannins, acid, has many more years in it yet .(Well, this bottle only has 65 minutes.)

332C9C00-4E68-4B6A-BBD9-416C6DCE81AC.jpeg

Correct: spelling.
 
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Different Drop have a 2015 Kooyong Single Vineyard Pinot Masterclass 3pk for $51.33/bt using a $25 voucher (pm me for code)


Two Tonnes Dog & Wolf Pinot Noir 2016 has just been rated 96+ by Mike Bennie on Winefront - equal to but cheaper than 2015 Hoddles Creek 1er :)
($42 PWS, $44 Moreish, $45 direct)
Due to the Young Gun of Wine, PWS has the 2017 for $45, as well as their new 2017 Wolf at $68, plus 2016 Sailor Seeks Horse $48 (CM(WF)95, MB94) and 2017 Dappled Appellation $29 (Barrique tasting notes)

Mike Bennie has again given the Dog & Wolf a score of 96+ for the 2017 vintage ($44.10 @ Melbourne Wine House), whilst Campbell Mattinson rated the Dappled at 93+


Because there seems to be a general view that aging wines is important.

I thought this article was informative: Is It Worth It to Age Wines Anymore? | Drinking Out Loud | News & Features | Wine Spectator

Wine doesn't necessarily have to (be able to) age well to be good - and it's better to drink too soon rather than too late - but as taste preferences are subjective, over time they change and become different, not necessarily better or worse, though hopefully more interesting and complex due to the development of secondary and tertiary characters

If you're a Winefront subscriber, then the discussion here might be of interest, including comments by Bindi's Michael Dhillon
 
Now I fully realise the gravity of the next statement but truth must out.

“Sorry JohnM, your statement about aged Pinot is wanting.”:)

This is brilliant. Drinking superbly, still lovely fruit, spiced strong tannins, acid, has many more years in it yet .(Well, this bottle only has 65 minutes.)

View attachment 130028

Correct: spelling.

But that’s Shiraz...
 
Besides Curly Flat Vertical Tasting in Melbourne,

Burgundy Bonanza @ Randalls

Cellardoor.co after $25 welcome credit:

Coldstream Hills The Esplanade 2015 (JH96/CM(WF)95) $30.33 after $25 credit
 
Dr Edge are the other Tasmanian pinot noirs to have recently received rave reviews, rating 93-96pts on Winefront by Gary Walsh and 96-97pts by James Halliday in The Weekend Australian Magazine

Direct is the best and cheapest way to buy them, where a mixed six pack of all is $300 delivered :)

Gary Walsh has just scored the 2017 range 94+-96+pts on Winefront, with winemaker Peter Dredge commenting that the vintage is one of the best of the 25 he's seen and not likely to again for a while, ageing the wines for almost a couple of decades - winery direct is still best with prices the same as last year :)


For last minute shoppers, Cellar One's $10 Waipara Hills offer ($6.67 after $20 referral credit) ends in just ten minutes :)

2015 $6.65 delivered @ My Wine Guy using $30 voucher :)
 
Gary Walsh has just scored the 2017 range 94+-96+pts on Winefront, with winemaker Peter Dredge commenting that the vintage is one of the best of the 25 he's seen and not likely to again for a while, ageing the wines for almost a couple of decades - winery direct is still best with prices the same as last year :)

The mailing list email received yesterday


Hi Mailing List,


I’ll keep it brief.



The 2017 Dr. Edge Pinot Noir offering and related info is available on the website.



Same philosophy as last year but a different clone and a different vintage…… No cough.



Super low yields so super low production this year. Ouch.



www.dr-edge.com



Things to note.

  • Its been available on the website for a few weeks.
  • It is currently available to Tasmanian Trade.
  • It will be available to the Mainland Trade from 1st August after a quick trip to Oregon Pinot Country.

That means it will most likely be gone by September so be quick. Lucky me…..




  • Keep an eye on "The Wine Front," for latest reviews if you’re into that stuff.
  • Keep an eye on Retailers at the bottom of the website who will have it available in single bottle format from August…. maybe.
  • Sorry I’m only in 6’s.



I’ll let you know about 2017 Dr. Edge Pinot Noir from Oregon USA and its developments later in the year.


Thanks all,

Peter Dredge
Dr. Edge Winemaking
www.dr-edge.com
@pjdredge
 
Prince Wine Store have on tasting today new releases from By Farr and Pooley (note that if buying the former, then ask them to price-match Randall's :))


I've never had 35-year-old Beaujolais but I have had 10-15 year-old Morgon, and some of them have been sensational. Allegedly this village produces some of the more age-worthy expressions of Gamay.

Ever had Jean Foillard Morgon Cote Du Py of which the past few vintages (2014-2016) have been rated 95pts by Gary Walsh on Winefront? Now wish I had bought some from Rathdowne Cellars during their EOFY 20% off sale :(
 
Prince Wine Store have on tasting today new releases from By Farr and Pooley (note that if buying the former, then ask them to price-match Randall's :))




Ever had Jean Foillard Morgon Cote Du Py of which the past few vintages (2014-2016) have been rated 95pts by Gary Walsh on Winefront? Now wish I had bought some from Rathdowne Cellars during their EOFY 20% off sale :(

Not from memory, but my memory is fuzzy - especially with French names. I'm very keen to try more of this style of wine though. My palate runs young, but I still love that feeling when you find an age-worthy bottle of light red for sub $50; more so when it's such a traditionally unconventional wine to age.
 
Tastings for those in Melbourne:

2016 Burn Cottage $79 @ Dan Murphy's


Mike Bennie has again given the Dog & Wolf a score of 96+ for the 2017 vintage ($44.10 @ Melbourne Wine House), whilst Campbell Mattinson rated the Dappled at 93+

At Fine Wine Merchant until next Tuesday (or more likely while limited stocks last):
  • 2017 Two Tonnes Tasmania Dog and Wolf $43
  • 2016 Sailor Seeks Horse $45
 
Serrat pre-release has begun; I've jumped on the Pinot (amongst others) as it is a firm favourite.
 
I went into DM yesterday to get some top up bottles and not wanting to spend a lot. In our DM the Pinot Noir are in the specialised area and not the general aisles. I asked why this was the case and the guy said it was because it was not a popular drink and an acquired taste. I just said that I really disliked our Australian Shiraz and preferred European reds. There was another guy there looking over all the bottles available. When the assistant left he commented that Pinot Noir was the wine that the growers all loved.
 
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2016 By Farr Farrside $47.94 singles delivered @ My Wine Guy after $30 voucher and price-matching Wine Baron's $67.99 :)

2016 Tapanappa Foggy Hill Vineyard (CM(WF)93+) $29.53 @ Cellarmasters after $100 Groupon for $10 (referrals) and 5% off WISH (excluding $1.20/$1.40 handling and 8% Cashrewards)

2014 Dry River $98.91 @ JD Cellars

Main Ridge, Moorooduc, Polperro & Ocean Eight @ Prince Wine Store


Serrat pre-release has begun; I've jumped on the Pinot (amongst others) as it is a firm favourite.

2017 pinot noir - as well as shiraz viognier and chardonnay - available at City Wine Shop for $47 (5%/10% off for half/dozens) and Blackhearts $50 (10% off half-dozens) - Halliday reviews


Gary Walsh has just scored the 2017 range 94+-96+pts on Winefront, with winemaker Peter Dredge commenting that the vintage is one of the best of the 25 he's seen and not likely to again for a while, ageing the wines for almost a couple of decades - winery direct is still best with prices the same as last year :)

Spokenwine has the full range of Dr.Edge at $50 delivered in six-packs


Besides the events posted in the Melbourne (e.g. Macedon Ranges Expo) and Sydney meet-up threads:

Pinot Palooza (National)
August (Adelaide/Perth), October (Sydney/Melbourne/Brisbane)
$60 General Admission / $50 Early Bird / $95 VIP
~150/250 wines
For those of you yet to buy tickets, participating wineries seem to be offering 20% off using their name with the suffix PP as the promo code eg. chattoPP :)

This year's promo code suffix is 18 - e.g. chatto18 :)


This pinot noir's time to shine has come - A toast to Whisson Lake: Pinot noir that's up there with Australia's finest
 
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