[Confirmed] QF removing [cheap] ASAs [from web booking engine Jun 26] was 10April

[fairbasa]

Re: [Confirmed] QF removing [cheap] ASAs [from web booking engine Jun 26] was 10Apri

you don't have your status listed but I'd be interested to know I'd this was via the platinum or regular line?

red roo... the phone agent attitude outlined above is not exclusive to the booking of mASAs.

as a former platinum I found reservations staff extremely helpful and knowledgeable. they worked with you to achieve outcomes.

as I dropped down the status ladder and became exposed to the general call centre, the knowledge and assumptions by some phone agents have changed accordingly.

gone, in many cases, is the predisposition to work with you. gone, in many cases, is the predisposition that I, the passenger, might actually know what I'm talking about.

it's not uncommon now to get a response 'you can't do that', or 'you have never been able to do that'. when clearly we can/could. even a request by the passenger to 'please try' can be met with an indignant 'I've already told you that it's not possible [and I am the expert working for qantas so I should know]'.

I think it was a former Lufthansa CEO who went on the record as saying that his airline recognises even their top premium passengers will sometimes fly economy. and so the economy experience still has to be as respectful and pleasant as possible.

it might be a good idea for this mantra to be shared by supervisors at call centre team meetings. this might include some sort of recognition that contact with the call centre is part of the overall experience with qantas. that a 'we know better' attitude by call staff may not cancel the immediate sale, but it might detract the passenger from further bookings with qantas. that sometimes a passenger might actually have a valid point which should be explored rather than dismissed out-of-hand.

on landing, several American airlines include a line stating 'we know you have a choice of carriers and appreciate you choosing to fly with us today'. it would be mighty nice if those not pulling their weight in the qantas call centre believed that as well.

I'm a WP and it was on the premium phone number.

I can't say the operator was at all rude, she just had no idea about the changes nor did she understand the difference between mASAs and ASAs and she was fairly insistent I must be mistaken. I had to ask her to consult with a supervisor to double check what I was saying. I tried telling her to look at my booking, I paid 60,000 points + $430 for a business one-way fare to Sinapore. The same fare is 360,000 points as a regular ASA on the website!!

I do however understand it's a bit tricky to comprehend the changes because Qantas have confused the issue further (Deliberately perhaps?) by still calling the fare online the ASA when really its basically points + pay under a different name with the ability to 0 the pay and just use points.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

Re: [Confirmed] QF removing [cheap] ASAs [from web booking engine Jun 26] was 10Apri

I'm a WP and it was on the premium phone number.

I can't say the operator was at all rude, she just had no idea about the changes nor did she understand the difference between mASAs and ASAs and she was fairly insistent I must be mistaken. I had to ask her to consult with a supervisor to double check what I was saying. I tried telling her to look at my booking, I paid 60,000 points + $430 for a business one-way fare to Sinapore. The same fare is 360,000 points as a regular ASA on the website!!

I do however understand it's a bit tricky to comprehend the changes because Qantas have confused the issue further (Deliberately perhaps?) by still calling the fare online the ASA when really its basically points + pay under a different name with the ability to 0 the pay and just use points.

wow! then I'm truly surprised!! as I said I could never once fault the platinum line in like the 9 or so years I was eligible to use it! (most agents actually recognised you... or did a really good job pretending to recognise you!!)

 

[eastwest101]

Re: [Confirmed] QF removing [cheap] ASAs [from web booking engine Jun 26] was 10Apri

I
I do however understand it's a bit tricky to comprehend the changes because Qantas have confused the issue further (Deliberately perhaps?) by still calling the fare online the ASA when really its basically points + pay under a different name with the ability to 0 the pay and just use points.

There is no perhaps about it, the phrases "obfuscation" and "deliberately muddying the waters" springs to mind. I sort of understand their business decision for making the changes but I don't know why they don't think we are adult enough to understand these reasons if they were articulated honestly in the first place.....

 

[TonyHancock]

Re: [Confirmed] QF removing [cheap] ASAs [from web booking engine Jun 26] was 10Apri

.....but I don't know why they don't think we are adult enough to understand these reasons if they were articulated honestly in the first place.....

Fundamentally I agree with you......however on a site like AFF I think QF is up against it with the open and honest approach I'd like to see. If poor Red Roo came out and told it like it was I doubt there would be enough "sensible" responses to justify that approach. How many pages have we had now? Can you imagine the tirade of argumentative posts?

Whether we like it or not QF is not really in a position to win and in turn neither are the members. QF probably sees the current approach as the one that causes them less grief. At least there is enough confusion in the posts between ASA and MASA to deflect attention away.

Whilst not ideal the MASA is at least available by telephone booking. My question of Red Roo is how can I help keep the MASA in place and make the booking process work for Qantas and me. (I am not in a position to speak for anyone else.)

It is straightforward business from my perspective, QF has it's reasons for removing the MASA from online availability and I have to maximise my travel dollars as best I can. There is no emotion...just business.

 

[Supersonic Swinger]

Re: [Confirmed] QF removing [cheap] ASAs [from web booking engine Jun 26] was 10Apri

It is straightforward business from my perspective, QF has it's reasons for removing the MASA from online availability and I have to maximise my travel dollars as best I can. There is no emotion...just business.

There are ways of doing business, and there are ways of doing business.

The QF approach in relation to the removal of online MASA bookings, and the recent removal of the ability to book First Class awards on Swiss by anyone other than top tier Miles & More members - Miles & More - Flight awards on SWISS First flights

The different approaches speak volumes about the underlying business and their willingness to communicate negative changes to their customers.

 

[TonyHancock]

Re: [Confirmed] QF removing [cheap] ASAs [from web booking engine Jun 26] was 10Apri

The QF approach in relation to the removal of online ASA bookings,.....

ASA bookings have not been removed from the website. (MASA bookings, or ASA bookings booked at classic rates, have.)

 

[Supersonic Swinger]

Re: [Confirmed] QF removing [cheap] ASAs [from web booking engine Jun 26] was 10Apri

ASA bookings have not been removed from the website. (MASA bookings, or ASA bookings booked at classic rates have.)

Corrected, but my main point stands. QFF has shown they want to make sneaky, obfuscated, unclear stealth devaluations a la what Delta Skymiles is known for. Not the sort of business I like to interact with.

 

[legalistic]

Re: [Confirmed] QF removing [cheap] ASAs [from web booking engine Jun 26] was 10Apri

Hi All,

Just trying to book a domestic Y class MASA, I found a classic fare online asking for 25,000 points and $70 of fees/taxes.

Does anyone know the multiplier in fees/taxes when booking a Y MASA?

I know that J will likely make it 4 times additional fees/taxes, but makes sense, given the extra SC and points.

But if Y MASA multiplier is the same as J MASA, I think i'll just book the classic award and forgo SC and points to avoid getting lost in the phone booking gauntlet (even though I badly need them for reqal!)

 

[Fruitcake]

Re: [Confirmed] QF removing [cheap] ASAs [from web booking engine Jun 26] was 10Apri

Fundamentally I agree with you......however on a site like AFF I think QF is up against it with the open and honest approach I'd like to see. If poor Red Roo came out and told it like it was I doubt there would be enough "sensible" responses to justify that approach. How many pages have we had now? Can you imagine the tirade of argumentative posts?

I guess this: http://www.australianfrequentflyer....tions-changes-points-38027-10.html#post584637 is an interesting case study. Velocity increased their points burn rates exponentially overnight, but at least the rep had the decency to post and effectively say, 'the prices were too cheap, we raised them, and we're not dropping them again'.

Pushing MASAs to phone only isn't the result of an IT difficulty. It's simply about making a low-margin product harder to access.

 

[ketsuzei]

Re: [Confirmed] QF removing [cheap] ASAs [from web booking engine Jun 26] was 10Apri

Pushing MASAs to phone only isn't the result of an IT difficulty. It's simply about making a low-margin product harder to access.

That's one school of thought. But it's by no means that clear-cut.

 

[ketsuzei]

Re: [Confirmed] QF removing [cheap] ASAs [from web booking engine Jun 26-was]10April

the issue was that YASA/JASA/FASA's weren't meant to be booked, it was just a failing of the old system that they couldn't fix.

Any evidence for that claim? Seems to me a lot of conscious thought went into the planning...

 

[puppysparkes]

Re: [Confirmed] QF removing [cheap] ASAs [from web booking engine Jun 26] was 10Apri

Any evidence for that claim? Seems to me a lot of conscious thought went into the planning...

[As I posted in another thread:

Originally Posted by serfty

Qantas decided to have the one online integrated award booking engine - with that, the choice was made to do away with that of the existing "Any Seat Award" functionality and not include it in the new engine.



They were simply going to start referring to the existing "Points Plus Pay" as "Any Seat Award" as well.



Apparently, it was only outcry (on Social Media etc.) that resulted in a decision to retain the ability to book based on the previous Any Seat Award booking engine with a call.

As answered by serfty in the previous page.

 

[ketsuzei]

Re: [Confirmed] QF removing [cheap] ASAs [from web booking engine Jun 26] was 10Apri

I've spent quite a lot of time talking to (two) people who were involved in the original planning, but nobody who wants to be quoted. So please feel free to treat this with the proverbial grain of salt.

I find the claim that the well-priced xASAs were nothing more than a mistake to be quite ludicrous. The more time you spend thinking about the way they were designed, the more elegant it seems. There was plenty of room to tweak things if they decided for some reason, that (say) great-circle-based pricing wasn't a good idea. But from what I've heard, there was actually an awareness that non-great-circle-based pricing was a bad (well, maybe not for QFF) idea. (And the fact that they can still get away with it for Classics? Bonus!)

And they've already demonstrated quite recently, with a hike of cash co-payments, that they can vary the pricing as necessary.

So I personally think these "it was costing them too much, so they want to get rid of them" arguments to be wrong.

I think it was purely an IT-driven thing, and that they underestimated the potential backlash, probably because it wasn't a very heavily used feature. All this talk of "too many people in lounges, too many people getting status this way" is mostly just people extrapolating from their own thoughts, intentions, and/or devious desires.

Happy to be contradicted if anyone has heard something different more recently, though.

 

[sumthinfornuthin]

Re: [Confirmed] QF removing [cheap] ASAs [from web booking engine Jun 26] was 10Apri

IMHO the more people in the lounges the better for Qantas. Why would they want to thin the numbers. TMWOT people with status remain loyal. People without status shop on price
Qantas want loyalty because it makes profit.
What does it cost to provide a couple of free drinks and a feed for someone, ???? the lounge is open anyway.

 

[ozkid]

Re: [Confirmed] QF removing [cheap] ASAs [from web booking engine Jun 26] was 10Apri

Tried my first MASA tonight. Domestic return business. Here's my experience:
- attempted ASA in classic award line: "you can do it on the website, shouldn't need to call"
- well, I can't book as a marginal ASA through website. Everything is funnelled through this telephone system: "ok yes but all the points are available on the website already"
- No, I specifically want to book it into a U fare bucket: "oh ok, you're doing this for the SC's aren't you?"
- Yes, you got that right. These are the flights I want: "Please note I will have to charge a booking fee"
- No you don't! "Let me check with supervisor" (less than 3 seconds later) "ok I'll waive the fee but just this once"
- I've been told that booking these through the phone, you don't incur a fee: "We do this on a call by call basis, there's no rule"
- Oh, sounds like you've had lots of people ring up then? (innocently): "Oh, yes,....it sounds like you know your way around the system"

The whole process took 1 phone call, less than 5minutes to book, and my bookings page was updated with new flights straightaway. I got the clear and distinct impression with this fellow, he did all he could to steer me away from booking it as a MASA, and folded when I knew the answers. He definitely did not have to consult his supervisor.

 

[coles525]

Re: [Confirmed] QF removing [cheap] ASAs [from web booking engine Jun 26] was 10Apri

Rememner his name?

 

[ozkid]

Re: [Confirmed] QF removing [cheap] ASAs [from web booking engine Jun 26] was 10Apri

I do, kept it off the post as I didn't know if that info was helpful?
He was courteous and efficient but I had to stand my ground several times.

The sticky thread on booking MASA is pure gold. Was a case of using specific phrases in my conversation

 

[Anna]

Re: [Confirmed] QF removing [cheap] ASAs [from web booking engine Jun 26] was 10Apri

Come to think of it, both times I have successfully booked a mASA by phone since it went offline, I was asked if I wouldn't rather just have a classic award. I didn't think anything of it at the time and they didn't push it when I said no.

 

[Limewood]

Re: [Confirmed] QF removing [cheap] ASAs [from web booking engine Jun 26] was 10Apri

I do, kept it off the post as I didn't know if that info was helpful?
He was courteous and efficient but I had to stand my ground several times.

The sticky thread on booking MASA is pure gold. Was a case of using specific phrases in my conversation

Problem is most don't know what to do or about the AFF sticky, the whole process is ridiculous to say the least, wake up Qantas your annoying your loyal customers. Whoever came up with this half baked idea to remove ASA's on line and inconvenience so many QFF members should be sent to his room or worse!.

 

[puppysparkes]

Re: [Confirmed] QF removing [cheap] ASAs [from web booking engine Jun 26] was 10Apri

I've spent quite a lot of time talking to (two) people who were involved in the original planning, but nobody who wants to be quoted. So please feel free to treat this with the proverbial grain of salt.

I find the claim that the well-priced xASAs were nothing more than a mistake to be quite ludicrous. The more time you spend thinking about the way they were designed, the more elegant it seems. There was plenty of room to tweak things if they decided for some reason, that (say) great-circle-based pricing wasn't a good idea. But from what I've heard, there was actually an awareness that non-great-circle-based pricing was a bad (well, maybe not for QFF) idea. (And the fact that they can still get away with it for Classics? Bonus!)

And they've already demonstrated quite recently, with a hike of cash co-payments, that they can vary the pricing as necessary.

So I personally think these "it was costing them too much, so they want to get rid of them" arguments to be wrong.

I think it was purely an IT-driven thing, and that they underestimated the potential backlash, probably because it wasn't a very heavily used feature. All this talk of "too many people in lounges, too many people getting status this way" is mostly just people extrapolating from their own thoughts, intentions, and/or devious desires.

Happy to be contradicted if anyone has heard something different more recently, though.

Fantastic source. I'm pretty sure they mentioned off the record that the IT department didn't consult another business unit which resulted in this mess. Everything else put forward by QF has been spin.