[Rumours] Qantas not Jetstar to get the 787-8

[Platinum A332]

There are persistent rumours that Qantas mainline and not Jetstar will get the new Boeing 787-8. What is the likelihood of this? My thoughts.

- It will allow a more consistent product on International flights with a slight expansion of frequencies (15 787-8 to replace 10x330 on International routes).
- Alternatively, it would provide a great advantage to take on Virgin domestically. Perhaps the 787-8 added to the domestic fleet, allowing a refurb of A330 internationally (fully flat Skybed and Premium Economy)? The A330-300 can be refurbished to have a configuration of 30J/21W/215Y, or 24J/21W/239Y

Perhaps with the Emirates announcement, Jetstar's international expansion will now be limited into Europe as previously planned, and Qantas will just leverage off the EK network into Europe?

Example link of rumour - Qantas fleet rumors, who is dreaming? | Plane Talking

I hope the 787-8 come into QF!

 

[samh004]

I thought the 787-8 was shorter range and the 787-9 longer, and Qantas wanted the longer ranged version that's coming later? I say this without doing my usual, looking a Wikipedia

Also, how about the premium carrier, Qantas, flying via the Middle East, while the LCC, Jetstar, flying via Asia. Both head to Europe, but just take different routes. You choose which you want.

 

[mannej]

I thought the 787-8 was shorter range and the 787-9 longer, and Qantas wanted the longer ranged version that's coming later? I say this without doing my usual, looking a Wikipedia

Also, how about the premium carrier, Qantas, flying via the Middle East, while the LCC, Jetstar, flying via Asia. Both head to Europe, but just take different routes. You choose which you want.

Would LCC work to Europe? I doubt it has the viability considering the fact that D7 has pulled their services to Europe.

I could see the 787 being quite a versatile aircraft, so it will be interesting to see if it does indeed get shifted to the Roo.

 

[Limewood]

Oh for better QA aircraft love to see the 787 to HNL, its really awful what they have currently, a joke really.

 

[harvyk]

From what I've heard it's pretty low likelihood. I suspect it's mainly hopeful QF pax which keep saying this (in the hope if they say it frequently enough it'll come true). That said I believe it's still a couple of years before QF group get the 787, so who knows, a lot can happen in a couple of years.

 

[harvyk]

Would LCC work to Europe?

I suspect yes, technically we already have options to Europe via LCC's, they just tend to be based out of hubs mid way along the route rather than at either end.

That said, over 20 odd hours I'd want to have eaten at least once, although that's not to say I couldn't have BYO'd from airports along the way.

 

[mannej]

I suspect yes, technically we already have options to Europe via LCC's, they just tend to be based out of hubs mid way along the route rather than at either end.

That said, over 20 odd hours I'd want to have eaten at least once, although that's not to say I couldn't have BYO'd from airports along the way.

The only LCC from AU to EU direct would have been D7. I am struggling to remember any others.

They have quite clearly stated that Long Haul and LCC don't really mix that well.

 

[harvyk]

The only LCC from AU to EU direct would have been D7. I am struggling to remember any others.

They have quite clearly stated that Long Haul and LCC don't really mix that well.

I did say hubs plural, and I did say LCC's plural. So the option does exist to get across there on the real cheap, which some time rich but money poor people may chose. I personally however would hate to do the trip on an LCC, let alone a collection of LCC's and hoping along multiple stops.

 

[anat0l]

I think this rumour won't come true. Either that or it'll be one of those "didn't see Qantas and Emirates getting into bed" type surprises (the kinds where you say it won't happen then you eat a hat).

 

[JessicaTam]

From what I've heard it's pretty low likelihood. I suspect it's mainly hopeful QF pax which keep saying this (in the hope if they say it frequently enough it'll come true). That said I believe it's still a couple of years before QF group get the 787, so who knows, a lot can happen in a couple of years.

It is going to be quite a while before any airline in the QF group see the 787. Perhaps we could open a book on who will eventually get it and what the first route will be. I think we would soon cover QFd, QFi, JQ and every route they fly. And probably still be wrong!
Time will tell.

 

[dajop]

I suspect yes, technically we already have options to Europe via LCC's,

Yes, they're more commonly known as Middle Eastern airlines, or Chinese airlines, both offering full service. It is difficult for the genuine LCCs to compete (on price) with these carriers, and impossible to compete on product. Certainly on a mile for mile basis, Jetstar flights between Australia and Asia (eg MEL-SIN) are often more expensive than full service carriers such as EK, QR from Asia to Europe. So maybe the future is more Jetstar services to Asia on 787's ...

 

[Andyzx]

There was some talk in recent weeks of QF flying 787-? out of Canberra, but that was pretty much talk...

 

[smit0847]

I did say hubs plural, and I did say LCC's plural. So the option does exist to get across there on the real cheap, which some time rich but money poor people may chose. I personally however would hate to do the trip on an LCC, let alone a collection of LCC's and hoping along multiple stops.

I dont think LCCs to Europe will work from Aus unless there is a good stopover system set up in an Asian hub. I did JQ OOL-KIX and while it was fine for a LCC flight there is no way I could have turned around and then done KIX-LHR LCC 3 hours later - you feel pretty wrecked after a LCC flight.

SIN wont work as a LCC stopover because it's probably the most expensive city in SEA to stay in. KL works will for Air Asia because it's cheap, easy and interesting. If JQ hubbed out of BKK I think that would be perfect - allow people a 1 - 7 day stopover in BKK on their way to and from Europe - I think this would be really popular with backpackers. JQ A330s could fly into BKK from PER, MEL, ADL, SYD and BNE each early evening then continue on to each of AMS, LGW, FCO, BCN, ORY etc.

 

[Andyzx]

According to the same blog Air NZ get there 787-9 (the 250+ seat version but almost double the range 15,000km+) in July 2014

But i dont think that would push QF into getting them and it seems weird that they are refitting the 767's unless they have found a problem doing that.:shock:

 

[Fruitcake]

According to the same blog Air NZ get there 787-9 (the 250+ seat version but almost double the range 15,000km+) in July 2014

The step-up in range isn't quite that ​good - the 787-8 is quoted as 7,650-8,200 nm (14,200-15,200km), whilst the 787-9 is expected to offer 8,000-8,500 nm (14,800-15,750 km).

For reference SYD-DFW is 7,454nm, SYD-LAX is 6,507nm and SYD-DXB is 6,500nm. (SYD-LHR is 9188 nm).

 

[mannej]

According to the same blog Air NZ get there 787-9 (the 250+ seat version but almost double the range 15,000km+) in July 2014

But i dont think that would push QF into getting them and it seems weird that they are refitting the 767's unless they have found a problem doing that.:shock:

I was going to say, I don't think the difference in range is that great...

 

[harvyk]

The step-up in range isn't quite that ​good - the 787-8 is quoted as 7,650-8,200 nm (14,200-15,200km), whilst the 787-9 is expected to offer 8,000-8,500 nm (14,800-15,750 km).

For reference SYD-DFW is 7,454nm, SYD-LAX is 6,507nm and SYD-DXB is 6,500nm. (SYD-LHR is 9188 nm).

So in theory LHR-PER direct at 7828nm would be possible with a 787-9. Of course you then have certain gov't requirements which need to be sorted, plus of course like DFW-BNE, all it would take is an unfavorable wind to slow you down to require a stop.

I wonder if anyone would like to be in the air for 20 odd hours direct. It would certainly be a killer in Y.

 

[Fruitcake]

So in theory LHR-PER direct at 7828nm would be possible with a 787-9. Of course you then have certain gov't requirements which need to be sorted, plus of course like DFW-BNE, all it would take is an unfavorable wind to slow you down to require a stop.

Yes, it would theoretically be possible to do LHR-PER. Of the course the deciding variable is with what sort of load. If loads have to be limited to allow enough fuel to be carried then that's going to cut back cargo capacity and raise the breakeven yield level. Additionally you're then taking an aircraft with significantly few seats than the A380 into LHR - no point giving up a slot for an A380 from DXB to LHR to allow a less profitable PER-LHR flight direct access - so the yield hurdle for the PER-LHR flight goes up again. (Remember that QF finds it more profitable to lease out its slots at LHR than use them itself). So it would only work on a route with significant premium cabin traffic.

But at the other end, no-one in Australia would want to fly SYD/MEL/BNE-PER-LHR: if you're going to have a stop anyway, you certainly don't want a 20-hour flight as part of the mix if you don't have to, not to mention the difficulties of an interterminal transfer. So you'd be relying on ex-WA traffic alone. Could be tough ask anyway, but especially with mining investment cooling, it looks even tougher now.

 

[The Rok]

I'd much rather see PER-LAX than PER-LHR.

 

[drron]

Of course DRW-LHR is only 7490nm.Lets give the Territorians the status they think they deserve!:shock: