Why do we have to pay extra to Qantas to secure the ordinary seats we want?

[FierceDinosaur]

Hello everyone. Why did my husband and I have to pay Qantas $20 per person each way to Hawaii recently, in order to secure the seats we wanted. I was very annoyed, as they were just ordinary cheap economy seats, one window and one next to it; nothing special such as extra leg room or exit aisle! No personal seatback TV either, which is just about standard nowadays. I've had it with Qantas - it was a really good airline and a great national icon, sadly being run down. Many of the people I know work there, or at Kingsford-Smith airport, which is near where I live, and they are very unhappy with the Qantas management.
Thank you very much, from a first-timer.

 

[mannej]

Hello everyone. Why did my husband and I have to pay Qantas $20 per person each way to Hawaii recently, in order to secure the seats we wanted. I was very annoyed, as they were just ordinary cheap economy seats, one window and one next to it; nothing special such as extra leg room or exit aisle! No personal seatback TV either, which is just about standard nowadays. I've had it with Qantas - it was a really good airline and a great national icon, sadly being run down. Many of the people I know work there, or at Kingsford-Smith airport, which is near where I live, and they are very unhappy with the Qantas management.
Thank you very much, from a first-timer.

Because that is what the charge is for this without status (for international flights). QF are not the only full service airline to do so.

The 767 product is not ideal, and a bit of foresight would probably not have gone astray.

As much as people say national icon bla bla bla, the reality is that QF is a private entity, and not the government backed roo that it used to be...

 

[Must...Fly!]

Welcome to AFF

The 767 provided to Honolulu and the lack of features it offers are often a source of gripe among members.

But having a gripe about the in-flight service and amenities is different to the seat selection fee, which is pretty standard across the industry, completely optional and free (of course) if you do online check-in 24 hours from departure. You only have yourself to blame for paying the $20 on that one.

 

[juddles]

Not sure how long you have been travelling, but there was a time I was just happy for a succesful landing. Securing preferred seats?? This is a modern phenomenon/expectation. I used to pay $2 USD in the early ´80s to rent the double plastic tube that used to pipe the music. At the end of the day airlines try to make a buck anywhere they can, as the industry as a whole is a mugs game with pax expectations + competing carriers govt subsidies making it a nightmare to run a cash positive business. Next time you are upset about a fare, calculate what aa rental car would cost you. (and BTW, I agree that that particular route to HNL is overpriced COMPARED ONLY to other more competitive sectors)

 

[harvyk]

Quite a few airlines charge for advanced seat selection, it's part of their aux revenue model, so it's not just QF which has this charge. To avoid it, you do need to have some sort of frequent flyer status.

Most people do think that the Hawaii offering by QF is a pretty poor one (they do like to send pax to JQ as well), however I also believe they have very little real competition on that route. I do also believe that they are planning on changing it to an A330 service which would have seat back IFE, however I can assure you that seat back IFE is not the standard these days, there are many major international carriers which are missing this little feature or don't have it installed across all their A/C, so again, not defending QF per say, but they are not alone in this regard.

All that said, if you stay around here (and not be a one post wonder) you'll find out all sorts of tricks of the trade which will make flying much better than if you simply accept the default offerings of the airlines.

 

[FierceDinosaur]

We did do the on-line check in; and I have NEVER paid a seat selection fee before, on any airline. I could see that it was optional, but I wanted a window seat, and I wanted to sit next to my husband. Baggage check-in staff told us that if we travel on the same booking, Qantas usually puts you together, but my husband didn't want to chance it, and we could have been put together in the middle seats, with no view out of the window, something that fills us both with horror.

 

[drewbles]

If there were two of you on the same booking, there was no real need to pay for seat selection. Simply checking in 24 hours in advance and/or getting to the airport early would have ensured you most likely got the window/aisle 2 seats on a 767.

The 767 on the SYD-HNL route is one of the oldest of the fleet for long haul, so you lucked out there.

As others have mentioned, it's not a national icon, it's an airline, and they're privately owned. They need to make cash, and they're far from being the only airline to charge for seat pre-selection for non-elite passengers.

A little research prior to a flight can lead to heartache (and dollars being spent) being avoided.

 

[drewbles]

We did do the on-line check in; and I have NEVER paid a seat selection fee before, on any airline. I could see that it was optional, but I wanted a window seat, and I wanted to sit next to my husband. Baggage check-in staff told us that if we travel on the same booking, Qantas usually puts you together, but my husband didn't want to chance it, and we could have been put together in the middle seats, with no view out of the window, something that fills us both with horror.

If you're on the same booking you *will* be allocated seats together, no need to chance that. I've frequently seen passengers moved to accommodate people travelling together. And at T-24, you should have zero problem getting one of the side seats.

You don't pay the seat selection at 24 hours prior to departure, only if you decide to allocate your seats prior to this time do you pay.

 

[moa999]

We did do the on-line check in; and I have NEVER paid a seat selection fee before, on any airline. I could see that it was optional, but I wanted a window seat, and I wanted to sit next to my husband. Baggage check-in staff told us that if we travel on the same booking, Qantas usually puts you together, but my husband didn't want to chance it, and we could have been put together in the middle seats, with no view out of the window, something that fills us both with horror.

So you paid $20 to stop getting filled with horror - sounds like pretty good value to me.

At the end of the day there are a large number of middle seats on a plane, a large number of aisle seats and a lower number of windows.
There are not many passengers who will be volunteering for the middle seats

So pay a little extra, and ensure you get what you want. Better than the middle seat.

As for the 767 - decrepit yes, but then AA still runs MD80s from HNL-LAX, and United still has some IFE-less 747s last I checked.
Qantas on the whole has a decent not outstanding Intl service - unfortunately HNL is the last one left with the dated 767 product.

 

[FierceDinosaur]

Well, I thought it was odd, but it was my husband who did it. I didn't even know you could do it. And to answer all those sarky persons out there: I have been travelling as a hobby since I was 14 (nearly 40 years), on all forms of transport you can imagine, including a lot of funny little airlines in very remote places: I just don't travel often enough to have any "status", and I pay for it all myself in good hard-earned after-tax dollars, hence the economy seats. Depends on your meaning of "Frequent", I suppose......

 

[FierceDinosaur]

Er, yes; I seem to have annoyed a lot of people here with this comment. Will bear in mind all the advice received. Thing is, I expect to be charged extra on budget airlines like Jetstar for baggage, seats in exit rows, etc. I just wasn't expecting to be told by a quality airline like Qantas that unless I paid $20 I could not ensure my Seat choice. I didn't know about it, so they must have sent us some scary notice which my husband saw and paid up for. Both of us have always regarded plane travel as a magical privilege, and more than half of the pleasure is to experience the view from the window of the land below, follow where we are on a map and spot things like cloud formations, tropical atolls, whales, ships and other aircraft zooming past, etc. Not being business travellers and not taking it all for granted keeps the magic alive for us. I just cry when I think how a once great airline like Qantas has been milked of all its prestige. My husband, of course blames bad management and carpet-baggers.

 

[SeatBackForward]

I think the OP's grievance is about paying $20 for something they didn't have to pay before? is that right? What did you do before? ask for a window seat? or show up early to check in?

 

[harvyk]

Well, I thought it was odd, but it was my husband who did it. I didn't even know you could do it. And to answer all those sarky persons out there: I have been travelling as a hobby since I was 14 (nearly 40 years), on all forms of transport you can imagine, including a lot of funny little airlines in very remote places:

We've seen a lot of one post wonders who come on here, fire off a complaint and are never seen again. Your first post did have the feeling of that, (larger font and comic sans didn't help) although you have done better than half those people by actually keeping tabs on the thread you've started. So for that I would like to be the first to welcome you to AFF.

I just don't travel often enough to have any "status", and I pay for it all myself in good hard-earned after-tax dollars, hence the economy seats. Depends on your meaning of "Frequent", I suppose......

Actually status is not as hard to achieve as you would think, all it requires is some thought into how you go about flying and you can easily reach the lower levels even as an infrequent self funded flyer. At PS (QF Silver) you start to get things like free seat selection for international and business class check in even in eccon. Have a read over these forums and you'll very quickly learn the do's and don'ts of flying frequently and how to avoid the horror flights (or at least how to be prepared for them if you do have to take one).

Edit: I know what you mean about wanting to keep the magical feeling in air-travel.

 

[Must...Fly!]

We did do the on-line check in; and I have NEVER paid a seat selection fee before, on any airline. I could see that it was optional, but I wanted a window seat, and I wanted to sit next to my husband. Baggage check-in staff told us that if we travel on the same booking, Qantas usually puts you together, but my husband didn't want to chance it, and we could have been put together in the middle seats, with no view out of the window, something that fills us both with horror.

So you pay for that privilege of convenience, knowing you will sit next to your husband and have a window seat...

 

[yohy?!]

Probably useful to compare the charge to what competitors are doing...

Emirates, no charge
Cathay, no charge (*although cannot choose seats on cheapest sale tickets)
Singapore, no charge

Qantas are revenue raising here because they think they can get away with it essentially (and with the AU market normally can, just look at how much more they charge than competitors and still achieve full planes!)

 

[mannej]

Off the top of my head I am aware MH charges for the privilege.

They have one more Skytrax star compared to QF

Unfortunately as others have stated, the magic is not like it used to be, and airlines are looking to find any extra revenue that they can.

 

[mannej]

Probably useful to compare the charge to what competitors are doing...

Emirates, no charge
Cathay, no charge (*although cannot choose seats on cheapest sale tickets)
Singapore, no charge

Qantas are revenue raising here because they think they can get away with it essentially (and with the AU market normally can, just look at how much more they charge than competitors and still achieve full planes!)

With all due respect, a sample size of three is not very large at all.

It is funny as one of the examples you have given has restrictions on the seat selection.

 

[SeatBackForward]

Of course the irony is that, its probably a lot cheaper than $20 for the software to allow seat selection, than compared to having to ring up a telephonee operator and for them to spend the 2~3 mins in seat selection - so not only is QF's operation cost cheaper, they now charge us for the privilege

(Now i know the smarty pants will say there's a lot of money spent in developing the software, but theres probably an equivalency in training and developing staff to do such changes in 2~3 mins too)

 

[FierceDinosaur]

What's an OP? Yes, paying $20 for something I never paid for before, didn't even know about it except for exit row, which is understandable - if you are tall the economy seating would be torture. Before, I just picked the seat when I booked, always. I usually book months in advance, so that might be why I never knew about this. I just thought that Qantas had suddenly changed the rules to gouge more money out of people for no real reason, I suppose. Anyway, I have read all the comments, and I suppose I am just not as diligent as I used to be when booking airfares; things have changed a lot recently..... it is probably the beginning of the end of the era of mass air-travel, another 20 years and there will be a lot of unused mega-airports around the world I expect.

 

[FierceDinosaur]

I am now thinking it should be in the price as an optional extra? I will re-iterate here, I have never paid this before, I always book the seat I want when I book the ticket, or as soon as it is possible to do so. I just didn't know about it before.