Australian Customs Officials Will Search Your Laptop For cough

[meloz]

Customs have handed the hard drive back to the Gent in question.

Customs hands back confiscated coughography | The Daily Telegraph

Meloz

 

[Alanslegal]

I'm sure some isolated non-sexual photos would not be an issue, but it's got me thinking, as on my blackberry last weekend I took a couple of really cute photos of my nieces making funny faces in the bath (which is very similar to a photo I have in an album of my brother in the same bath when we were at the same age), but can't see in any way how it could be construed as CP ... so where is the line drawn? I suspect it would be different for me (and for you) if we had hundreds of such photos of lots of different children on our laptops.

You're right, where is the line drawn? and just because it may be one photo out of a thousand, I would think a Customs Officer would be within their right to confiscate the said item for a full forensic examination.

Sadly some here - I won't mention names - believe that if it saves one person (or one photo) even though tens, hundreds and thousands of innocent travellers could get caught up in this net, then it's all worth it. (As you would know I disagree to this belief).

 

[JohnK]

Sadly some here - I won't mention names - believe that if it saves one person (or one photo) even though tens, hundreds and thousands of innocent travellers could get caught up in this net, then it's all worth it. (As you would know I disagree to this belief).

Unfortunately "do-gooder left wing liberals" have caused more damage to our society than they will ever understand.

Waiting patiently for the day our freedom is restored....

 

[blueflamenco]

I'm sure some isolated non-sexual photos would not be an issue, but it's got me thinking, as on my blackberry last weekend I took a couple of really cute photos of my nieces making funny faces in the bath (which is very similar to a photo I have in an album of my brother in the same bath when we were at the same age), but can't see in any way how it could be construed as CP ... so where is the line drawn? I suspect it would be different for me (and for you) if we had hundreds of such photos of lots of different children on our laptops.

Child nudity does not equal child coughography. I would not be concerned about family photo's causing you trouble.

If I were a parent though, I would not feel comfortable with relatives or friends photographing my children in the bath simply because I wouldn't know where that image could wind up.

 

[dajop]

Child nudity does not equal child coughography. I would not be concerned about family photo's causing you trouble.

If I were a parent though, I would not feel comfortable with relatives or friends photographing my children in the bath simply because I wouldn't know where that image could wind up.

On 1 - it doesn't but it would be cause for concern if there were lots of images of lots of different children in such a state on someones laptop., I'd imagine. On point 2 - my brother in law was there at the time, and knows that that photo is not going anywhere.

 

[blueflamenco]

On 1 - it doesn't but it would be cause for concern if there were lots of images of lots of different children in such a state on someones laptop., I'd imagine. On point 2 - my brother in law was there at the time, and knows that that photo is not going anywhere.

And if someone had lots of images of different children in the tub then this should be cause for concern, I should think.

I'm sure that is the case with your photo. I would still say if I was a parent, this would not happen. I have seen kids bathtub images splashed across facebook by people's friends and family. Even parents themselves uploading said pictures for anyone to view. Even those with the best of intentions might misplace a disk or SD card.

 

[blueflamenco]

You're right, where is the line drawn? and just because it may be one photo out of a thousand, I would think a Customs Officer would be within their right to confiscate the said item for a full forensic examination.

Sadly some here - I won't mention names - believe that if it saves one person (or one photo) even though tens, hundreds and thousands of innocent travellers could get caught up in this net, then it's all worth it. (As you would know I disagree to this belief).

By this you mean, travelers could potentially be inconvenienced?

With child coughography I don't believe there is ever just one victim involved. One picture doesn't equal one victim. One child predator does not have just one victim.

Despite the fact I acknowledge these current procedures may not produce the greatest results I still believe netting one of these criminals would be worth the inconvenience of some innocent travelers.

 

[samh004]

I'm sure some isolated non-sexual photos would not be an issue, but it's got me thinking, as on my blackberry last weekend I took a couple of really cute photos of my nieces making funny faces in the bath (which is very similar to a photo I have in an album of my brother and I in the same bath when we were at the same age), but can't see in any way how it could be construed as CP ... so where is the line drawn? I suspect it would be different for me (and for you) if we had hundreds of such photos of lots of different children on our laptops.

I would assume the law is drawn at: "if it’s nude, it’s bad". Nothing is art, nothing is innocent in this world.

 

[harvyk]

Child nudity does not equal child coughography. I would not be concerned about family photo's causing you trouble.

But by who's measure? One persons art \ snapshot is another persons cough...

All it would take is for a more religious customs officer, whos religion considers nudity as bad, to see the photos and come to the wrong conclusions. Even if you are later cleared it can cause major headaches for you at the time.

There have been many people arrested over the years because a chemist (back in the days where film need to be processed) misunderstood the intent of photos.

 

[blueflamenco]

But by who's measure? One persons art \ snapshot is another persons cough...

All it would take is for a more religious customs officer, whos religion considers nudity as bad, to see the photos and come to the wrong conclusions. Even if you are later cleared it can cause major headaches for you at the time.

There have been many people arrested over the years because a chemist (back in the days where film need to be processed) misunderstood the intent of photos.

You are correct, but I would like to think that there are guidelines that customs officials adhere to and common sense is also employed.

 

[JohnK]

Sorry almost choked as I laughed so loud.

Somehow I do not think the words "customs officials" and "common sense" go in the same sentence....

 

[Danger]

Could these ex-Virgin Blue employees be taking up positions with Customs?

Virgin sacks staff over cough

 

[Mal]

Interesting newspaper article. Does seem "set up" by someone... perhaps a certain lobby group

There are a few interesting points:
- Firstly current Customs regulations would allow the seizure of the device pending classification of the material found. This legislation has been around for ages.
- I wonder if he ticked or didn't tick the "cough" box.
- Anyone here could face exactly the same issue.

 

[harvyk]

You are correct, but I would like to think that there are guidelines that customs officials adhere to and common sense is also employed.

But that is the problem... It shouldn't be up to the common sense of the customs officer.

There should be clear guidelines of what is and isn't allowed, it should not be up to the customs officer's discretion.

Take drugs for example...

If I bring in cocaine, that is a drug which is not allowed,
If I bring in panadol, that is a drug which is allowed,

At no point in time does the customs officer guess which is which. If they are unsure of a drug they have tests they can run which will tell them conclusively what it is, and they then have very clear guidelines on what do to.

cough on the other hand is a very subjective thing. The guidelines on what constitutes cough and what constitutes art are very subjective.

 

[blueflamenco]

But that is the problem... It shouldn't be up to the common sense of the customs officer.

There should be clear guidelines of what is and isn't allowed, it should not be up to the customs officer's discretion.

Take drugs for example...

If I bring in cocaine, that is a drug which is not allowed,
If I bring in panadol, that is a drug which is allowed,

At no point in time does the customs officer guess which is which. If they are unsure of a drug they have tests they can run which will tell them conclusively what it is, and they then have very clear guidelines on what do to.

cough on the other hand is a very subjective thing. The guidelines on what constitutes cough and what constitutes art are very subjective.

Correct - there should be guidelines that are adhered to as I mentioned in my last post.

Why would customs not have clear guidelines on cough as they do food or drugs?

I believe the difference between child coughography and art are quite obvious. There is not much room for subjectivity.

 

[JeniSkunk]

Correct - there should be guidelines that are adhered to as I mentioned in my last post.
Why would customs not have clear guidelines on cough as they do food or drugs?
I believe the difference between child coughography and art are quite obvious. There is not much room for subjectivity.

Considering the furore over a photographic art exhibition a couple of years ago, I disagree with your claim as to the clarity as to what is and what is not CP.
With that case being a matter of public historical record, I am of the opinion that the line is not as clear and obvious as you seem to think it is.

But for travelers, what is of more import, is that there are no definitions of, what is and what is not, considered to be cough, on the form.

Jenifur Charne

 

[blueflamenco]

Considering the furore over a photographic art exhibition a couple of years ago, I disagree with your claim as to the clarity as to what is and what is not CP.
With that case being a matter of public historical record, I am of the opinion that the line is not as clear and obvious as you seem to think it is.

But for travelers, what is of more import, is that there are no definitions of, what is and what is not, considered to be cough, on the form.

Jenifur Charne

If a file was questionable then I am sure that it would be dealt with appropriately. Perhaps there is no real clear cut definition of what is or isn't considered child coughography in general. But, in this case I believe it is not difficult to distinguish what customs will be looking for.

If an individual was carrying artworks that they believed could pose a risk then they should look into the matter prior to entering Australia with the questionable item. As you would with food, medications etc.

 

[blueflamenco]

Considering the furore over a photographic art exhibition a couple of years ago, I disagree with your claim as to the clarity as to what is and what is not CP.
With that case being a matter of public historical record, I am of the opinion that the line is not as clear and obvious as you seem to think it is.

But for travelers, what is of more import, is that there are no definitions of, what is and what is not, considered to be cough, on the form.

Jenifur Charne

If in doubt, tick yes?

 

[Alanslegal]

Perhaps there is no real clear cut definition of what is or isn't considered child coughography in general. But, in this case I believe it is not difficult to distinguish what customs will be looking for.

I find some teen magazines quite offensive, in fact, I would even call that near child coughography. Then I consider adult cough magazines, legal coughography. So my point is what may be clear cut to some, will be very unclear to others.

 

[Alanslegal]

Also we have to remember that not 'dirty' old adults will be caught up in this coughography inspection. Imagine your teenage child sending around (semi or) naked photos of themselves and receiving them from their friends or their friend's friends via MMS.... now that could also be called child coughography IMO and be criminally prosecuted for .... even though we know for all intent and purposes, that was just teenagers growing up.

So search away, lots of (potentially innocent) people will be caught, inconvenienced, shamed and the end result; that real illegal coughography won't even be impacted.