Does flying on Business/first entitle you to be entitled?

[esseeeayeenn]

Well @Forg I will jump into the lions den by saying that some Tasmanian and Victorian wines are the equal of some French champagne. And that is not just my opinion. First the Chandon winery in Victoria who say that their product is at least the equal of some French champagne

Exceptional Australian Sparkling Wine | CHANDON Australia

Discover CHANDON Australia: exceptional méthode traditionnelle sparkling wine crafted in the Yarra Valley since 1986. Shop, visit and join Club CHANDON.

www.chandon.com

Then there are Tasmanian wineries that specialise in sparkling wine. Jansz in the north which started in 1986 in collaboration with Louis Roderer.
Lake Barrington wines produce great sparkling wines both red and white.
Even Moorilla who also got some input from Chandon.

If I ever flew QF F again I would be happy with those sparkling wines and proud that Qantas showcased them
All my F flying on QF F was on awards or upgrades. Not once did I feel entitled or be rude to staff.

We flew 12 F sectors on AA NRT- USA. 2 were awards one of which was a J award upgraded to F. 10 were uprades on DONE5 sing AAs SWU. They were good for 4 sectors so after 2 domestic sector upgrades then another international upgrade to Europe in F.. On 8 of those sectors we hade the same crew and we got on very well. On one trip the purser Dano from Hawaii was absent. The rest of the crw warned us about his replacement -"she's a cough." Within a couple of hours she was sitting down with Mrsdrron learning knitting. The crew were gobsmacked.
So I respectfully submit that we award and upgraders in F did not act entitled..

This is actually a very complex topic.
The terroir - the regional characteristics of a wine growing region - include the soil.
The soil in Champagne is largely chalk, limestone and marl.
Arguably, this imbues the wines with a quality called minerality.
I say "arguably" because the existence of "minerality" as a quality of wine is very controversial.
Many wine critics claim it does not exist, I am convinced it does.
What is not controversial is that the soil in Champagne is different to the soil in California or Margaret River or Tasmania.
So while other elements of the terroir might be similar - latitude, climate, growing on sun-facing slopes - the soil is not.
This means the wines taste different.
Whether you call it minerality or not, there is a subtle taste to champagne which is missing from other sparkling wines.
To compensate, other sparkling wines are often very acidic.
This is definitely the case with Australian sparkling wine.
I don't care which you prefer, but please, don't try to tell me that any other sparkling wine can taste like champagne.

 

[drron]

Though several years ago I attended a conference and one of the features was a tasting of French champagne given by a French wine maker. We tasted 6 champagne s and the challenge was to identify the non champagne from Tasmania. Very few got it right. The winemaker said it is a very good sparkling wine and the closest to a French champagne she had ever tasted.

 

[SOPOOR]

I think thats the crux of of my problem here. From the outset of the poll the word, "entitled" is setup with both of its meanins.

The neutral meaning which is you should receive (or expect to) a service but also entitled as in the negative connotation (entitled brat version).

It's then hard to follow which meaning is being referred to.

I actually subconsciously had to rethink, the subtle differences in their meanings

#3 depends what’s advertised. If the airline offers unlimited caviar I’d expect at least two serves to be loaded per passenger. If it’s just an me u item, i’d expect one serve per passenger. And any leftovers would be a bonus.

I've actually never seen the word "unlimited" used for caviar on any of the carriers, (eg menus, reviews, ads etc)

I have a hospitality background in some pretty fancy restaurants and hotels etc.
Basically the higher end you get the more "entitlement" we allowed,

Personally im too self-conscious to act entitled when im entitled to something.

So my example of not giving up my double suite did bother me a bit......

That being said, I would assume for people who dont travel in premium often would be on better behaviour as compared to seasoned travellers

I

 

[n7of9]

On an SQ J flight some years ago, my BTC meal wasn't loaded (I didn't care even a little bit). The FA was so absolutely mortified she gave me a duty free perfume. My next flight was on F and as I totally hated the smell of the perfume, I gave it to the lounge angle in the TPR, who then tried to drown me in fancy champers. Don't sweat the small stuff, be nice to people...be a person you would like to hang out with.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

I've actually never seen the word "unlimited" used for caviar on any of the carriers, (eg menus, reviews, ads etc)

Maybe not on menus, but heavily advertised and promoted: https://www.emirates.com/media-cent...tes-unveils-more-enhancements-to-first-class/

‘First Class customers may indulge in unlimited caviar served with seven accompaniments…’​

 

[esseeeayeenn]

Yeah I refer to this:

Maybe not on menus, but heavily advertised and promoted: https://www.emirates.com/media-cent...tes-unveils-more-enhancements-to-first-class/

‘First Class customers may indulge in unlimited caviar served with seven accompaniments…’​

So PAX are buying an entitlement to a bundle of rights, a bundle of caviar and a bundle of accompaniments.

 

[SOPOOR]

Maybe not on menus, but heavily advertised and promoted: https://www.emirates.com/media-cent...tes-unveils-more-enhancements-to-first-class/

‘First Class customers may indulge in unlimited caviar served with seven accompaniments…’​

That surprises me big time.... surprised the reviews/youtube reviews rarely mention it....

 

[MEL_Traveller]

That surprises me big time.... surprised the reviews/youtube reviews rarely mention it....

Well at least some do… that’s how I found out about it in the first place

 

[SeatBackForward]

Yeah I refer to this:

So PAX are buying an entitlement to a bundle of rights, a bundle of caviar and a bundle of accompaniments.

The conditions of carriage for Emirates:

 

[esseeeayeenn]

The conditions of carriage for Emirates:

View attachment 528848

That may rule out any claim for breach of contract but it doesn't necessarily preclude a claim for misleading or deceptive conduct under consumer law.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

The conditions of carriage for Emirates:

View attachment 528848

Which is great from airline lawyer perspective, but can’t overrule consumer laws.

And it’s also true that while they may make no guarantees - it doesn’t exclude compensation in the event you don’t receive any of those.

(c) is an odd one… and leaves it open that special meals and other types of meal *will* be available when the catering is done by EK itself! Odd.

 

[Cruiser Elite]

I feel I am entitled to KRUG in SQ R/F coz it’s been there for yonks - now you book R or F and cop CRISTAL - jeez it pisses me off

 

[SOPOOR]

The conditions of carriage for Emirates:

View attachment 528848

That means that if your seat is broken, all food has run out, tv broken, and you have to sit in economy, , then no compensation is legally guaranteed!

 

[SeatBackForward]

That may rule out any claim for breach of contract but it doesn't necessarily preclude a claim for misleading or deceptive conduct under consumer law.

Surely pulling consumer law for not receiving an unlimited amount of caviar is a bit like:

 

[MEL_Traveller]

Surely pulling consumer law for not receiving an unlimited amount of caviar is a bit like:

Presumably the airline would settle before it got to that… either with points or some other form of compensation.

 

[esseeeayeenn]

Surely pulling consumer law for not receiving an unlimited amount of caviar is a bit like:

I don't care about caviar, I don't eat seafood, I only like the mother of pearl spoons, which I try to keep.
I was making a more general comment, that if an enterprise makes big representations, they can't walk away from them in the fine print.
Australian consumer law no longer allows that.

 

[Forg]

I’m surprised bubble-tea shops don’t sell it in a salty fish flavour as a Premium Product, cos that’s what caviar is.

 

[sudoer]

That surprises me big time.... surprised the reviews/youtube reviews rarely mention it....

It got a decent amount of air time when it was announced in 2022, but I feel like the number of EK F reviews dropped substantially after they jacked up carrier charges and restricted F awards to status pax with a couple of FF programs.

On the topic of premium cabin entitlement, I recently flew QF F with Mrs and Miss sudoer (2yo). Miss sudoer needs her own seat, but QF allows 2 year olds to sit with their parent for takeoff & landing using an infant belt. The Aesop amenity kits were handed out during pushback, we assumed our daughter's was left at her seat, but it wasn't. When we realised later in the flight we asked an FA who went off to look for it.

A few minutes later the CSM came to say he thought it was a spare kit and had already given it to another pax (presumably in J). Barely an apology, let alone any service recovery offered.

As an F pax, do I feel entitled to receive three kits for these seats? You bet I do, those kits are part of the QF F service that I paid for, and contain some decent products Mrs sudoer wanted to keep and use. Do I feel there should have been service recovery offered then and there? Yes, as a P1 and WP in F, the complete lack of service recovery was a disappointment. For comparison, a couple of months ago, CX gave 10k Asia Miles completely unprompted when the charging port at my seat didn't work.. and that was in Y+!

I lodged a complaint with Qantas and requested some compensation in points, but as of 8 days later haven't heard anything back which again is disappointing. This entitled git will be chasing them when I get back to Australia.

 

[esseeeayeenn]

It got a decent amount of air time when it was announced in 2022, but I feel like the number of EK F reviews dropped substantially after they jacked up carrier charges and restricted F awards to status pax with a couple of FF programs.

On the topic of premium cabin entitlement, I recently flew QF F with Mrs and Miss sudoer (2yo). Miss sudoer needs her own seat, but QF allows 2 year olds to sit with their parent for takeoff & landing using an infant belt. The Aesop amenity kits were handed out during pushback, we assumed our daughter's was left at her seat, but it wasn't. When we realised later in the flight we asked an FA who went off to look for it.

A few minutes later the CSM came to say he thought it was a spare kit and had already given it to another pax (presumably in J). Barely an apology, let alone any service recovery offered.

As an F pax, do I feel entitled to receive three kits for these seats? You bet I do, those kits are part of the QF F service that I paid for, and contain some decent products Mrs sudoer wanted to keep and use. Do I feel there should have been service recovery offered then and there? Yes, as a P1 and WP in F, the complete lack of service recovery was a disappointment. For comparison, a couple of months ago, CX gave 10k Asia Miles completely unprompted when the charging port at my seat didn't work.. and that was in Y+!

I lodged a complaint with Qantas and requested some compensation in points, but as of 8 days later haven't heard anything back which again is disappointing. This entitled git will be chasing them when I get back to Australia.

You'd think you could put a 2yo into the ottoman at your seat!
This was why I flew to Europe a few days before my first child's second birthday.
Managed to get cheap seats in F on Thai. At that stage, they assigned a dedicated FA to look after our two infants!
And I felt entitled to it!