Ask The Pilot

[mikenz]

JB if you were delayed more than 6 minutes going into Dubai how long would you need to wait there until you can fly back to Aus? If it's more that a day or two would they pax you back?

Would a scenario like this have any affect on your flight? e.g. would you/the company ask for a quicker route to try to get you inside the limits so as not to disrupt operations?

Maybe a personal question so feel free to ignore. What would be your preference, flying to your original roster or having an extra day to rest in Dubai (i'm not suggesting a day at home isnt restful!)

Thanks

 

[jb747]

JB if you were delayed more than 6 minutes going into Dubai how long would you need to wait there until you can fly back to Aus? If it's more that a day or two would they pax you back?

The issue isn't with the flight out of Dubai. I've got plenty of time there. The problem will come up about a week later, when I'm supposed to fly the 93 to LA. If the planned flight time, plus taxi at each end, takes me past 100 hours, then I won't be able to depart Melbourne. Obviously, the company won't take that sort of risk, so I'd almost certainly be bumped off the flight. Because the limit is a rolling 100 hours in 30 days, the problem will have resolved itself by the next day.

Realistically, I'd say that the chances of the 6 minutes be used up in the next two sectors is 100%.

 

[mjt57]

JB, what happens if you're flying home, have no rostered flights for a week or two and you exceed that 6 mins. remaining in flight, due to say, strong headwinds or something?

Or would you not do the flight in case that happens?

 

[jb747]

JB, what happens if you're flying home, have no rostered flights for a week or two and you exceed that 6 mins. remaining in flight, due to say, strong headwinds or something?

Or would you not do the flight in case that happens?

At this stage, when I land in Sydney I'll have flown 87:24 in the preceding 30 days. Because of the way that flying was accrued, none of it will have fallen away by the time the next trip starts. The planned flight time for that next sector (minus a little that will fall away on the same day), would have me arriving in LA at 99:54. Whilst a very small margin, if the flight plans for the previous few 93s have been on, or under, the nominal plan, then it might be left alone. But, the schedulers are generally a cautious breed....

If I burn the 6 minutes somewhere in the next two sectors, then there will be no option but to displace me from the flight. In theory they could perhaps swap me from the 93 onto the 11 (and vice versa), but that's messy for other reasons. They're pretty good at fiddling things around though, in ways that aren't necessarily obvious.

If I do run out of time, which I'll know as soon as I get to Sydney (even perhaps Dubai if there is still extensive holding), then I think I'll propose taking two weeks of leave. That solves all of the issues.

 

[mikenz]

Do international air crew have a normal passport?

 

[smeacs]

With all the complexity of hours and flying does this then make taking/using leave difficult? ie are pilots often forced to take leave at times that doesn't suit them or is it the opposite problem where lots of leave is accrued and there isn't actually the ability to use it?

 

[docjames]

If you get no delays ( on the 2/2 combo - admittedly nearly 0% change of that) - if they were elect to have you fly the 93 as rostered, and the 93 is delayed on day of departure in MEL (presumably by more than 6 mins eg. pax failed to board, lookng for bag, weather change, maintenance issue, ie. an "at gate" delay of more than 6 mins..), do you go "out of hours" immediately the 6 mins comes up (hence delaying the flight further whilst a replacement is found etc??) or can you work as it was rostered? Or is the measure only on flight time (wheels up/down)?

 

[jb747]

Do international air crew have a normal passport?

Yep. We have a different visa for the USA...though most places don't require us to have visas at all. Normally our passports aren't stamped either, otherwise we'd run out of space in no time. There's some other paperwork behind the scenes to ensure that we are part of an operating crew.

 

[jb747]

If you get no delays ( on the 2/2 combo - admittedly nearly 0% change of that) - if they were elect to have you fly the 93 as rostered, and the 93 is delayed on day of departure in MEL (presumably by more than 6 mins eg. pax failed to board, lookng for bag, weather change, maintenance issue, ie. an "at gate" delay of more than 6 mins..), do you go "out of hours" immediately the 6 mins comes up (hence delaying the flight further whilst a replacement is found etc??) or can you work as it was rostered? Or is the measure only on flight time (wheels up/down)?

This particular limitation is one of flight time, so a delay at the gate waiting for a passenger would not be an issue. All I need is for the planned time to be within the limits. Exceeding them once we start, with unforeseeable issues, won't cause a stop. A mid sector diversion would be a bit messy though, and would require an exemption to allow me to continue.

Winner so far. One sector down, and we now have 9 minutes. Looking at the flight time for recent 2s, they've also been a bit better than the rostered time, so not looking too bad right now. It's not unreasonable to think I might have up to 30 minutes spare by the time I get to Sydney....as long as Murphy doesn't get involved.

 

[jb747]

With all the complexity of hours and flying does this then make taking/using leave difficult? ie are pilots often forced to take leave at times that doesn't suit them or is it the opposite problem where lots of leave is accrued and there isn't actually the ability to use it?

Leave is used by the company as a way of smoothing the available number of people, relative to the amount of work, so additional leave is often assigned by the company, at both inconvenient times, and perhaps in undesirable amounts. It's also controlled across the year to ensure appropriate pilot availability. The upshot is that you can have very little control of when you go on leave.

We operate with two cycles of leave, and you can choose on a 3 year rotation which one you want to be one. One group takes leave in (more frequent) 28 day lots, and the other in a longer cycle using 42 days of leave. Any long service leave is bid for as a separate issue. I'm on the longer cycle.

 

[jb747]

New roster time again....

Carry out from the old roster:
8/03 94 LAX-MEL

New:
19/03 9 MEL-DXB
22/03 9 DXB-LHR
24/03 2 LHR-DXB
27/03 10 DXB-MEL

14/04 93 MEL-LAX
15/04 94 LAX-MEL

20/04 93 MEL-LAX
21/04 94 LAX-MEL

01/05 93 MEL-LAX
02/05 94 LAX-MEL

This roster is a good example of how things can be difficult for the system to work out. The two decent breaks are not a case of it being kind to me, but are forced by hitting two of the flying limits. The first break ensures that I don't exceed either 100 hours in 30 days, AND also the 30 within 7 for the two man sectors between Dubai and London.

The next longer break is forced by the fact that I'm approaching the annual maximum hours, so the system is looking back to ensure it remains below 900 hours in 365 days. Consequently, it ends up crunching some trips together towards the end of the roster, and again pushing up towards 100/30. At the start of the following roster, there will be about a week before I go on leave, in which it will be almost impossible to give any flying, and in the week following the leave, a simulator, and probably an LA will have to be planned (and we're now talking about the end of June). Most likely when the next roster run is done, I'll tick the option that allows leave to be slid to give a better flying outcome.

One more issue is that after working within all of these limitations, the total amount of work that it has generated is 7 hours below the target. It is allowed a margin, but it has exceeded that, with the result that I start the roster 'owing' the company 5 hours of work (for which I'll be paid, as it's not my fault it couldn't generate it). That means I'll either have to be available on what would otherwise be some days off, drop the 5 hours unpaid, or, most likely, do a standby....with the attendant risk that has of laying waste to the entire roster.

Two days (most likely in the middle of the long break) will also be grabbed by the sim schedulers.

I'm just one person. Multiply this by a couple of thousand, and you can see how difficult the entire scheduling exercise can be.

 

[Quickstatus]

Two days (most likely in the middle of the long break) will also be grabbed by the sim schedulers.

Is sim time counted toward working hours?

 

[jb747]

Is sim time counted toward working hours?

No, it does not affect the flying hour limitations, though it is recorded in the same way as normal flying. It's obviously a day at work though, so it does have to be counted when assessing the rest periods.

 

[bryanjones]

I'm just one person. Multiply this by a couple of thousand, and you can see how difficult the entire scheduling exercise can be.

A common computer science assignment that is given. But then throw in sick leave, stand downs, aircraft maintenance issues, etc and you can quickly imagine how it becomes a moving target with a team behind it to manage.

 

[Princess Fiona]

Hi jb747 I'm on QF 9 DXB-LHR on 22nd March
Fingers crossed your schedule stays the same.

 

[Boris spatsky]

It's also controlled across the year to ensure appropriate pilot availability. The upshot is that you can have very little control of when you go on leave
.

It's similar but not quite so restrictive in our short haul world. Only a certain number of pilots can be on leave at any one time, which frequently means missing out on leave when you want it. School holidays are particularly problematic (if you have kids).

I just put in leave up to Mar 16. One year lead time is the only way i can really guarantee i can get what i want (i missed Easter and July this year due to a number of factors - the downside is that i will get a week of random leave in June that i don't really want or need).

Sim and other recurrent training also blocks out some periods which precludes taking leave during those times. We can't ask for sim slots to be moved so that we can take leave.

 

[RooFlyer]

Are there any restrictions put in by either an airline or the 'authorities' on what a commercial pilot can do during their breaks - short or long?

Not talking about alcohol & similar, but rather things like potentially high stress hobbies such as high-performance car racing, or maybe lengthy personal flying? I'm thinking restrictions in the direction of helping to ensure rest and recovery rather than a measurable impairment. How about in the US? Of course I'm happy to rely on common sense, but regulators, maybe not so much?

 

[por930]

Are there any restrictions put in by either an airline or the 'authorities' on what a commercial pilot can do during their breaks - short or long?

Not talking about alcohol & similar, but rather things like potentially high stress hobbies such as high-performance car racing, or maybe lengthy personal flying? I'm thinking restrictions in the direction of helping to ensure rest and recovery rather than a measurable impairment. How about in the US? Of course I'm happy to rely on common sense, but regulators, maybe not so much?

JB, carrying this thought a bit further..do airline pilots flying hours in their own aircraft, eg, you have a old war bird or what ever and you fly for say 15 hours while on a months leave. Does this count into your max hours per month as well?

 

[mjt57]

It's similar but not quite so restrictive in our short haul world. Only a certain number of pilots can be on leave at any one time, which frequently means missing out on leave when you want it. School holidays are particularly problematic (if you have kids).

Have you guys ever considered some sort of leave preference roster? Where I work it is used to manage or to balance out who gets first dibs at getting Christmas/New Year off, for example.

Could something like that work within your ranks?

 

[clazman]

A common computer science assignment that is given. But then throw in sick leave, stand downs, aircraft maintenance issues, etc and you can quickly imagine how it becomes a moving target with a team behind it to manage.

Sure certain AFF's could doing in with a spreadsheet