Why 7kg carry-on limit if correct size and checked is free?

[Austman]

I had a check-in experience at Emirates MEL the other day. I was flying on a QF flight number in Y but as a WP could check-in at the EK first class desk with up to 50 kgs free checked luggage.

I was travelling with one piece of carry-on luggage only. Not even a second item. It was within the allowed size. But it weighed more than 7 kg.

The EK first class check-in made me weigh the bag and then refused to allow it.

Ok, it was above their 7 kg published limit. But why refuse it? It was within the allowed size and way below the 18 kg (and sometimes no limit) that many airlines allow. I wasn't trying to save money - I still had 50 kgs of checked allowance. And there were are no real safety concerns - even JQ, until recently would have allowed it (10 kg).

But the check-in staff, after making a phone call, stuck to their rule and refused to give me a BP. I was about to walk away to remove a few personal items from the bag and then check it in when another staff member from the service desk came over with a stamped bag tag and said they'd allow it this time but only because Y class was not very full.

It was a nice gesture but the reason seemed wrong. Even if the bag had been only 7 kg - it would have stayed exactly the same size and have taken up the same space in the cabin and it would have been allowed on a 100% full in Y flight.

I can understand carry-on piece and dimension limits. I can understand that some airlines want to make money by forcing a passenger to pay for checked baggage. I can understand a safety related weight upper limit (generally 18 kgs internationally). But in my situation none of these applied.

If I had been on QFd in the same situation, I'd have just made my 1 carry-on into the allowed 2 carry-ons (each then below 7 kg). But this was not QFd and 2 carry-ons are not allowed on EK in Y class (or on QFi either it seems).

Sometimes I think check-in staff (especially first class) need to be a bit more flexible when it's obvious a passenger is not trying to avoid fees and wouldn't even be in the rejection situation on other airlines.

But rules are rules I guess.

But why the 7 kg limit? Everything I've read suggests it has pretty much nothing to do with safety.

Some links:

Information About Airlines

Rules for Carry-On Luggage Size | USA Today

 

[bismarck]

The two most common reasons I've seen given are:

1. Cabin crew need to be able to lift it into the overhead locker (i.e. in case you can't)
2. If you encounter turbulence and the bag falls out of the overhead locker, 7kg falling on someone's head won't break their neck but 18kg might.

I have some sympathy with the second one, but nil with the first. Rule should be that you have to be able to put your own luggage away and it must fit within size limitations (so everyone has sufficient space).

 

[RooFlyer]

One of my pet peeves. I hardly ever stick to the 7kg carry-on limit, certainly not in J. It is theoretically (and traditionally said to be) a safety issue - if its 20kg and falls out of the bin on someone, its the end of the world, whereas 7kg falling on some kid's head is OK. And hard to argue with that of course. BUT you can put your carry-on under the seat in front in which case it isn't a lifting or falling risk.

There may be a weight and balance issue - if they don't control the weight, then possibly there are unknown masses lurking about the plane .. and I think that is worth considering. But 7kg limit? Bit of a joke.

 

[blackcat20]

It seems like such an arbitrary number. I'm lucky mine has never been weighed. I do like the Easy Jet system where your bag can be as heavy as you like, as long as it's the correct size. And I've never asked a FA to lift it for me, I don't understand people who pack more than they can handle knowing it needs to be stored overhead.

 

[CMA222]

I sympathise because my standard carry-on is a Samsonite (non rigid) wheel along bag with standard extending handle and 3 compartments. It conforms with all carry-on size requirements. It weighs about 4 kilograms empty and can easily carry weight substantially in excess of the remaining 3 allowed kilograms and often does!! Add a computer and a few books and I easily go over 10 kilograms. It is safe and stable in any overhead locker. That said, on a recent AirNZ A320 flight ex SYD a single bottle of duty free liquor fell out of an overhead locker, when the locker was opened in flight, and it hit a passenger in the back of the head/neck. The flight was 1 hour out of SYD and returned because of the possible injury sustained by the passenger. The size and weight of the carry-on in that instance had no bearing on the danger yet there was no restriction on its carriage.

 

[Jleno]

Fly Virgin and you're more likely to be weighed (that's my experience anyway). I don't mind if they weighed everyone's bags but it's annoying you're being pulled up at the gate as you watch every second passenger with a heavier and bigger bag go through.

I think you just lucked out. They do need to set some limit for safety reasons (whether it be 7, 10 or 18 kgs) but they can certainty do with more consistency in applying the rule to all passengers.

 

[juddles]

The loading design for the bins themselves is not designed for high-mass small ítems.

 

[Austman]

Yes, perhaps a bit of check-in discretion? My carry-on was an upper size limit roll-aboard. I just remeasured it and it's OK. It fits in most lockers well and is stable.

When I've seem things fall out of lockers they are mostly smaller items - that really can move around in flight. And I've read reports that even in crash situations carry-ons in lockers contributed very little to injuries.

And if the US airlines can allow over 7 kg, it seems to me that the safety argument is at best a weak one.

 

[RooFlyer]

The loading design for the bins themselves is not designed for high-mass small ítems.

True. But when you have 2 items on domestic, they ask that the larger (usually heavier) one go into the overhead bin, and the smaller item go under the seat in front. You'd think it would be the other way round if they are limiting the load on over-head lockers.

Under the current enforcement, 10 people could each put their 7kg bowling ball (in 10 small hat boxes, so contents opaque to FAs) stacked neatly into the overhead locker ... for 70kg. But 3 normal carry-ons @ 12kg each is not allowed.

I'm all for safety, but the current regime is all over the place.

 

[drron]

Next month I have a Rex flight out of MEL.Always weigh my carry on.But I will have my Rex Jacket on.lots of pockets inside and out.All of which goes back in the bag at security.The bag fits between my feet on board so not going to hurt anyone.
As an aside I have just got a new carryon.Weighs only 1.6kg so a lot more can go in before it weighs too much.

 

[NM]

As noted by others, its all about safety inside the cabin and nothing to do with the cost to uplift the additional weight.

However, I think its a carry-over from out-of-date thinking and a reluctance to change policy. BA, for example, changed their policy such that they no longer have a weight restriction for carry-on (just size and number of pieces) so long as the passenger can lift it themselves safely into the overhead bins. So BA do not see it as a safety issue, but most other airlines do.

Personally, I don't want to have to deal with heavy bags as carry-on and happily check anything the exceeds the 7kg limit. I am not fanatical about HLO travels. I am happy to weight a few mins for the checked bag dlivery if it means I don't need to deal with a largish or heavy bag during the flight. But I understand that some people see this differently and will do whatever they can to travel HLO.

 

[blackcat20]

As noted by others, its all about safety inside the cabin and nothing to do with the cost to uplift the additional weight.

However, I think its a carry-over from out-of-date thinking and a reluctance to change policy. BA, for example, changed their policy such that they no longer have a weight restriction for carry-on (just size and number of pieces) so long as the passenger can lift it themselves safely into the overhead bins. So BA do not see it as a safety issue, but most other airlines do.

Personally, I don't want to have to deal with heavy bags as carry-on and happily check anything the exceeds the 7kg limit. I am not fanatical about HLO travels. I am happy to weight a few mins for the checked bag dlivery if it means I don't need to deal with a largish or heavy bag during the flight. But I understand that some people see this differently and will do whatever they can to travel HLO.

Sometimes its about having something fragile in your bag that you dont trust the baggage handlers with...

 

[drron]

Sometimes its about having something fragile in your bag that you dont trust the baggage handlers with...

Like a bottle or 2 of vintage port when I fly to cooler climes.

 

[RooFlyer]

Like a bottle or 2 of vintage port when I fly to cooler climes.

Oh! And which cooler clime is coming up?

 

[drron]

Oh! And which cooler clime is coming up?

Just guess!

 

[Austman]

As noted by others, its all about safety inside the cabin and nothing to do with the cost to uplift the additional weight.

However, I think its a carry-over from out-of-date thinking and a reluctance to change policy. BA, for example, changed their policy such that they no longer have a weight restriction for carry-on (just size and number of pieces) so long as the passenger can lift it themselves safely into the overhead bins. So BA do not see it as a safety issue, but most other airlines do.

Personally, I don't want to have to deal with heavy bags as carry-on and happily check anything the exceeds the 7kg limit. I am not fanatical about HLO travels. I am happy to weight a few mins for the checked bag dlivery if it means I don't need to deal with a largish or heavy bag during the flight. But I understand that some people see this differently and will do whatever they can to travel HLO.

How can it be all about safety when some airlines allow 7kg, some 10kg, some 18kg and some don't weight limit at all on exactly the same type of aircraft? I mean these are BIG variations. And on so many other safety related matters the same airlines agree (or closely agree).

I suspect it's much more to do with revenue. I doubt JQ's safety has improved by their carry-on reduction from 10kg to 7kg.

For me it's not just about HLO, it's also that I like to travel with one bag only. So it's also more convenient to have that bag as HLO.

 

[medhead]

When I read this 7kg is safe line, I had my usual thought that getting hit by 7kg is just as likely to cause serious injury as not. So I did some numbers:

There has been one reported death by a coconut hitting someone on the head. It is reported as having fallen 12m. Wikipedia says a full sized coconut weighs 1.4 kg. Some kinematics later that gives a kinetic energy of 140J when the coconut hit the guys head. A 7kg bag falling 1m would have kinetic energy of 70J and a 10kg bag - 100J.

what does that mean? Not sure. But i found a paper titled
"Head injury—abuse or accident?"


in the journal Archives of diseases in childhood. That paper reports one study that found a fall less than 1.2m is never fatal. Another study found that falls of 1.5m to 2m can cause severe injury but never at less than 1.5m. Noting that the paper is looking at falls as a potential cause of injury. the authors calculate kinetic energy at impact for a 1.5kg sphere (equivalent to a 12 kg child's head) of 21J for a 1.5 m fall.

Even with the different mechanism of damage, person falling versus object falling on them. That at least gives an idea of the minimum energy required to cause a head injury. A 7kg bag should exceed that minimum energy.

 

[NM]

Sometimes its about having something fragile in your bag that you dont trust the baggage handlers with...

So long as its under 7kg, there is no problem. Over 7kg and you need to be flying BA ... oh yeah, that really does not help if you are trying to get from Brisbane to Melbourne.

I have found that a carry-on size backpack is rarely weighed, either at check-in or at the boarding gate (or at entrance to BNE international security screening), while roll-aboard bags are more likely to incur closer scrutiny. So hopefully you can carry your fragile cargo in a backpack rather than a wheelie bag. Just don't show any signs of struggle with it on your back.

 

[blackcat20]

So long as its under 7kg, there is no problem. Over 7kg and you need to be flying BA ... oh yeah, that really does not help if you are trying to get from Brisbane to Melbourne.

I have found that a carry-on size backpack is rarely weighed, either at check-in or at the boarding gate (or at entrance to BNE international security screening), while roll-aboard bags are more likely to incur closer scrutiny. So hopefully you can carry your fragile cargo in a backpack rather than a wheelie bag. Just don't show any signs of struggle with it on your back.

I use a backpack internationally. As you say, look like its light and no one ever asks.

 

[NM]

How can it be all about safety when some airlines allow 7kg, some 10kg, some 18kg and some don't weight limit at all on exactly the same type of aircraft? I mean these are BIG variations. And on so many other safety related matters the same airlines agree (or closely agree).

See my comment "I think its a carry-over from out-of-date thinking and a reluctance to change policy".

I suspect it's much more to do with revenue. I doubt JQ's safety has improved by their carry-on reduction from 10kg to 7kg.

Its not about revenue when they offer to carry it in thje hold for free, per most QF operations. It costs them more to carry it in the hold as it needs to be handled by several people to get it to your destination.

For me it's not just about HLO, it's also that I like to travel with one bag only. So it's also more convenient to have that bag as HLO.

Fair enough. Personally, I generally have a backpack with me when I travel anyway, as I will use that each day while away, so 2 bags works for me. But I do understand your preference. And as I said, I think its historic and there is reluctance to change rather than any real though and review gone into the policy. Then again, I would not like to be seated under a 15kg bag that falls from the locker as someone tries to unsuccessfully sling it above their head.