For all the important moments in your life - don't trust Qantas

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Sojourner

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I know of people who have as a result of Alan Joyce and the board of Qantas's decision to ground all flights:

  • Missed a family wedding - a friend of mine missed his sister's wedding in Brisbane (he was flying from Perth, and by the time he realised what was going on, flights on Jetstar and Virgin were gone, and driving for four to six days across the Nullabor was going to take too long - and yes he did seriously consider that)
  • Will miss the Melbourne cup - they were not able to check into their accommodation and so lost their reservation, deposit and no longer can afford to rebook their flight and accommodation
  • Missed an interstate job interview (though fortunately, the prospective employers were able to reschedule)
All of them have said that so long as Alan Joyce and the Chairman (and probably the rest of the board too), remains at the helm of Qantas, they will "never ever fly Qantas again", because they don't trust that Qantas will make every effort to help them get them to where they need to be.

The unions look after their members, the Qantas employees. The Qantas Board is supposed to look after their shareholders by making money. A key part of making money is making sure you look after your customers, and Alan Joyce playing the industrial action hand just as the unions have has shown that customers only matter when it's convenient for him. We aren't surprised when unions use customers in their game, but I am surprised then the company does this.

The mate that missed his sisters wedding summed it up when he said, “What Alan Joyce did, was reaffirm to me that for all the trips you need to make for the important moments in your life – don’t trust Qantas.” He said Tiger Airways cancelled once on him on a leisure trip at the last minute and were not able to accommodate him on any other flights (too bad, so sad was basically what they said). He said he never flew with them again because he just didn't trust them to get him to where he needed to be.

It seems the trust factor played an important part of his selection of airlines. When you buy a ticket, you want to be able to trust that they can, and will do everything they can to make sure you get there. What Qantas just did to him was show him that when they're in a fight with the unions, they will knowlingly treat their customers like pawns in the negotiations and subsequently disrupt their plans. You don't win trust by using your customers as pawns in your negotiations.

It reminded me of the ad's MasterCard used to do "For everything else there's MasterCard." An appropriate catchphrase Qantas might use could go something like, "For the important moments in your life, too bad so sad."

I wonder how Alan Joyce would feel if he missed his brother/sister's wedding, missed out on a christening, missed out on a childs birth, missed a funeral for someone close, missed anything important, not because there was an accident, incident, crazy weather pattern that was unforseen - but because the CEO of some airline knowingly chose to cancel his flight and thereby put at risk the chance for him to attend these important events.

Feel free to share your stories of how the disruptions affected you, maybe someone from Qantas will listen and see what they've done to some people's lives.
 
Short term pain - Long term gain.

Yes people were inconvenienced, and that must be frustrating. But the decision that was made was to help protect the future of Qantas, and prevent further disruption to the network leading up to Christmas.

A better term to use could be "For all the important moments in your life .... Don't trust anyone and have contingency plans.". Shutdowns occur for numerous reasons - not just because a CEO is fighting with unions.
 
Let us not forget that if the unions had continued with their disruptive actions many more people would have been inconvenienced.
People could have missed important moments for many reasons, not just the actions of Qantas management and the board.
As Mal said have contingency plans.
 
While I feel for your personal impact, it is a very short-term, selfish view.

My last 2 flights in SEP were cancelled and delayed due to union industrial action.

AJ's actions will likely be the stimulus to resolve this long-term problem.
 
There are so many terrible stories out of this. Absolutely true that the board and maybe even the unions don't give a stuff about customers. However, Don't get sucked in by the extreme rethetic on this, they didn't do this to save the future of qantas. If they wanted to save the future of qantas they would never have let it get to this. Instead they should have shown leadership, leadership to lead the staff through the change process. Overall this is a fundamental failure of Joyce as a leader and I agree, don't trust him while he is at the top.
 
Short term pain - Long term gain.

Yes people were inconvenienced, and that must be frustrating. But the decision that was made was to help protect the future of Qantas, and prevent further disruption to the network leading up to Christmas.

A better term to use could be "For all the important moments in your life .... Don't trust anyone and have contingency plans.". Shutdowns occur for numerous reasons - not just because a CEO is fighting with unions.

The big thing for me, was not just having your plans disrupted. The big thing is that Qantas still had other options to pursue, before cancelling flights over the weekend barely any notice which while an option, should have been an option of last resort which I do not believe Qantas had reached.

All the PM did was a result of the grounding of Qantas was refer it to Fair Work Australia. Given that the PM was in session with the other 17 Heads of Government, I think all the Qantas paying customers would've liked for Joyce to have paid the PM and the other 17 Commonwealth Heads of Government the courtesy of waiting a little longer to speak to the PM. In which case he should've been more frank and said "Intervene now, or the airline gets shut down". In which case I am sure the PM would've acted.

Don't do the opposite and shut down the airline then sit and wait - who does that? My four year old knows better than that.

I think some of the spin doctors at Qantas have tried to spin this the other way around, saying that Joyce had warned that the prolonged industrial dispute would lead to a shutdown of Qantas, but really, what kind of person gives a broad warning like that, then gives the PM 3 HOURS notice?

My niece waits until the last two minutes before she needs to pee before telling her parents. She is two and a half years old. How old is Alan Joyce?
 
5 out of my last 12 flights (was 5 in 8 at one point) were cancelled or delayed.
I would rather be inconvenienced in the short term than be subjected to another 12 months of a 50/50 chance of getting home or getting to a meeting on time.
I 100% support the decision of the Board.
 
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The unions look after their members, the Qantas employees.

Are they really?

Or are they acting like prats to big note themselves and set themselves up for future positions in the ALP?

Surely coming to the table with reasonable demands and actually negotiating would be looking after their members. If they had kept going the way they were, there's a good chance that their members would have all been looking for new jobs (let's not forget the "I don't recommend that you fly Qantas leading up to Christmas" comment, great way to look after your member!)
 
TIn which case he should've been more frank and said "Intervene now, or the airline gets shut down". In which case I am sure the PM would've acted.

If she had, the FWA would have done SFA. Read the report from the FWA website. They made the decision they made due to the huge impact on the Australian economy of having the airline shut down due to the lockout. This would not have been a factor if AJ had simply asked the PM to refer the matter to FWA whilst the airline was still operational.
 
Unions looking after their members? That's a new one.

Had a slight issue with an employer that should have been easy pickings for the union to look after, still waiting for a response.

As for spin, the head of the unions give Olivia Wirth a run for her money on who can produce the most spin.

I feel for you that you were not able to attend those functions, but I am sure there have been a fair few people out there who have been equally inconvenienced by the unions actions. They have used the passengers as cannon fodder as much as AJ did, and they did promise things would get worse...
 
That is sensational news - Unions looking after their employees. I worked for the same company for 28 years and was third in the state pecking order with the only way to go up was the two above me to retire or die. I couldnt move interstate as I have a sick parent that I look after'. No problems, I was very happy where I was and doing a good job as I have met all my KPI's for past 1o years. Won the national best employee award last two years. A restructure came up and I was made redundant with a very good severence package. Nearly two years pay on a 150k salary plus get to jeep my car, laptop, iphone, benefits etc. Problem was I didnt want to leave. Loved my work, company and my people. Went to the union and all they could say over and over was think of the money, why wouldn't you go, this is like winning lotto etc etc. To them it was all about the money, no thought at all about my feelings toward my job. This is the exact same with the Q issue. All the union leaders are doing is positioning themselves for their next move within the ALP. They couldn't care about their employee or the customers unless there is something in it for them. I once heard a union leader say to me that they would ensure their members didn't repair our equipment which would in all probability cause a serious safety issue with someone getting killed and it would be on my head. Is that a statement of caring for the employees. I just pray that safety issues dont occur because the union have not got their way so far.
 
I too missed flights this week, only short domestics trips though, thank goodness. I also have a major overseas trip to the UK coming up at Christmas. This is more important to me, and I was truly starting to be concerned that the actions of unions would compromise this trip. So, I am glad that Qantas took this course, and now I can breathe a sigh of relief that my Christmas holidays will likely proceed without industrial sabotage. Just my opinion.
 
?
Surely coming to the table with reasonable demands and actually negotiating would be looking after their members.

Point of order: Both sides accuse the other of not negotiating. Unless you have been sitting in the meetings you have no way of know what is true. Blindly accepting company spin is not useful. It's certainly no basis for making statements like this as if they are true.


Sent from my iPhone using Aust Freq Fly app so please excuse the lack of links.
 
Point of order: Both sides accuse the other of not negotiating. Unless you have been sitting in the meetings you have no way of know what is true. Blindly accepting company spin is not useful. It's certainly no basis for making statements like this as if they are true.<BR><BR><BR>Sent from my iPhone using Aust Freq Fly app so please excuse the lack of links.
Good point except that in today's SMH Anthony Albanese states that he had 3 face to face meetings with AJ and Tony Sheldon in the last week.Negotiation proven.
 
Can I suggest people have very short memories?

Yes I agree what Qantas did was cough, especially stranding people overseas. I just got back from around the world with QF,BA,AA,QF and would have been devastated if stranded!

However what about Virgin ticketing fiasco by 2
Jetstar LA flights delayed 48 hours.
Ansett imploding thanks to Air NZ ( does anyone still trust Air NZ??? People were praising them for flying under the volcanic ash), and dont talk about tiger!!!!

Apart from this how many times has QF let you down?

In my flying days (some 15 years) I have had 1 flight turn around and 1 hour delay maximum!

Jetstar is quite often 2 hours late!

Even though this has made many angry QF will still be the most reliable domestic service. Virgin a close second.

I agree, I will think differently about long haul going forward maybe CX or SQ
 
Good point except that in today's SMH Anthony Albanese states that he had 3 face to face meetings with AJ and Tony Sheldon in the last week.Negotiation proven.

Well having a meeting does not prove negotiation. I had plenty of meetings in my former role as a regulator to discuss issues. But on the point you raise, the TWU called off their action as a result of those meetings - negotiation proven indeed.


Sent from my iPhone using Aust Freq Fly app so please excuse the lack of links.
 
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