Air Canada; Melbourne but 'not yet'

[Melburnian1]

Air Canada (AC) is a low profile airline to and from Oz but on 3 June 2016 it commenced nonstop Vancouver - Brisbane flights to add to its daily flight to Sydney.

'The Australian' is often worth purchasing on Fridays for its aviation articles (admittedly sometimes these can be 'puff pieces') with a contribution on Friday 9 June asserting that AC also wanted to fly to Melbourne, but it gave no date.

How would the declining yields that are discussed sometimes in the media as allegedly occurring on quite a few international routes into and out of Oz be affecting such lower profile carriers?

Canada Tourism says that there is quite a bit of 'leakage' with Canadians and foreigners using US or Australian airlines (DL, QF, UA or VA) to (in Australia's case) LAX or SFO and then either flying to YVR or elsewhere in Canada, driving or catching Amtrak. Then there are those using NZ via AKL to LAX.

However provided there is the point-to-point demand, AC may have an advantage as its nonstops are a lot quicker, and some may perceive that the US airports suffer from delays in security (recent media about 70000 AA travellers missing flights would not help).

 

[RooFlyer]

Thanks for pointing it out, I missed that article. Here's a bit from it on-line:

Air Canada is setting its sights on adding a direct Vancouver-to- Melbourne route soon as the airline continues to expand its presence in the Australian market.


The Canadian flag-carrier last week started flying direct from Vancouver to Brisbane, making the Queensland capital its second Australian port after Sydney.

Air Canada’s vice-president of global sales, Duncan Bureau, said the decision to add the Brisbane leg to the airline’s trans-­Pacific destinations was made on the back of a positive outlook for travel demand to and from Australia.

“We’ve had a long history here in Australia and we’ve been very bullish on adding more capacity here,” he told The Australian.

“We really want the team here to deliver on Brisbane and get it to the point where we feel strongly enough that we could add another market. Obviously Melbourne is a market that we are keenly interested in and Melbourne Airport is keenly interested in working with us and would love to have us operate there.”

But before Air Canada can get to Melbourne, Mr Bureau said the airline would need to free up some of its aircraft that were committed to other routes or wait until new orders for planes were delivered.
The airline currently has $12 billion worth of new aircraft on order as part of a wide-ranging fleet refresh. That includes 35 confirmed Boeing 787 Dreamliners and 15 options that would take its Dreamliner fleet to more than 50.

The airline also has an order of 100 737 MAX aircraft. Delivery of those start next year to replace Air Canada’s Airbus 319 and 320s.

I've said it before: I think it extraordinary that between them, AC and ANZ can have 3 daily services (with no Australian Star Alliance feeder service) and are wanting a fourth (or so they say) while QF has only a seasonal service. Yes, QF is aircraft constrained but they apparently didn't plan for an Australia/Canada route even during the mining boom 5+ years ago.

I alternate my Canada flights between QF via LAX and AC straight to Vancouver then both onto Calgary. When flying via LAX, I recognise most of the occupants of the AC J cabin on the flight up to Calgary as having come off the QF flight. Aircraft constraints aside, I can't believe that QF couldn't economically sustain a daily SYD-YVR service year round, given it would capture all the OneWorld traffic and allow QF loyalists to avoid the hassle of going via the US.

 

[Melburnian1]

RooFlyer, sensible points as we arguably have the most in common with Canada (apart from NZ and the UK) of any nation on earth: similar parliamentary and legal systems (albeit funding is differently arranged), constitutional monarchies not republics, reasonably similar exports (mining and resources are big features of both nations) and even a comparable, laconic sense of humour that is (or should be) different from the USA style - mind you, read 'The Australian' this weekend for an insightful piece from Bill Leak (master cartoonist) as to how in Oz that is declining thanks to political correctness.

Provinces are similar to our states, and Alberta may be Canada's Western Australia, although I will take your advice on the last point.

There is not much permanent migration between the two countries, but there is a reasonably similar flow in tourism visitors (which includes businessmen): about 230,000 per annum at present in each direction. This is about 600 a day from each nation, or 1200 a day in total: not huge, but not unimpressive.

The currencies at present are fairly closely aligned. How long that continues is anyone's guess with at least one supposedly know-all analyst claiming that the A$ will drop to 40 cents against the US$, with some negative effect for the Aussie against other currencies like the C$. Lunacy or loonie?

RooFlyer, is it true that AC including its staff leaves something to be desired - I appreciate you may always be in J though, not Y.

 

[Viridianne]

I always flew on AC to Montreal. The long haul flights were excruciating on AC, I understand why people would rather get a QF or similar via the US for the long haul. Additionally, other airlines tend to cost less than AC and provided better service. i.e. my trans-border flight did not include check in baggage

 

[Melburnian1]

I always flew on AC to Montreal. The long haul flights were excruciating on AC

Was it a relative lack of seat pitch, poor 'service' from on board staff or another reason that made these 'excruciating'?

 

[RooFlyer]

Flew from where to Montreal, and what class of service?

AC has many similarities with QF in being a 'legacy' airline and true, AC domestic in economy is pretty ordinary (but no worse than QF I think) - and they have 'Rouged' many of their routes, as QF has Death-starred theirs. Like QF, AC service and crew attitudes can be hit-and miss. The AC FF program is abominable; it's split between an outsourced points program 'Aeroplan' (redemptions) and an in-house component 'Altitude' (upgrades etc).

But the TPAC service by Air Canada on their B777 isn't bad, and in J its pretty good.

Melburnian1, the Loony and AUD have been very closely aligned for ages, and I think they'll continue to be so. And yes, Alberta pretty well exactly equates to WA - even down to the resentment of 'easterners' ripping their resources incomes off them! Toronto = Melbourne; Montreal = Sydney; Newfoundland = Tasmania; Nunavut = NT Competition from US = competition from Asia and so on.

A 1 C$ coin is called a loony. A C$2 coin is a 'two-ney' . Cute, eh?

 

[lobby]

I booked an AC flight a few months ago for July using Krisflyer points and was really surprised with the taxes as they have taken away the fuel surcharge between Canada and Australia/Japan and included it in the actual ticket prices.

If this stays this way then will not hesitate to use them alot more instead as the service I have had in J has always been great with them.

 

[clazman]

We have our meat pies and they have their poutine

 

[Cruiser Elite]

Rooey I love that post - but seriously mate - Newfoundland couldn't really be that bad could it? J/K mate J/K - what does Vancouver = ?

 

[FrankC]

Melburnian1, the Loony and AUD have been very closely aligned for ages, and I think they'll continue to be so. And yes, Alberta pretty well exactly equates to WA - even down to the resentment of 'easterners' ripping their resources incomes off them! Toronto = Melbourne; Montreal = Sydney; Newfoundland = Tasmania; Nunavut = NT Competition from US = competition from Asia and so on.

What is Vancouver?

 

[RooFlyer]

We have our meat pies and they have their poutine

Taber-nac! <GAG!> The Quebeckers have their poutine; and everyone else says they can keep it!

Rooey I love that post - but seriously mate - Newfoundland couldn't really be that bad could it? J/K mate J/K - what does Vancouver = ?

By my analogy, Vancouver = Rotto . (But in actuality its called Hong-couver ). Don't understand the J/K bit, sorry ....

 

[Quickstatus]

I would have said Toronto = Sydney and Montreal = Menbourne.

Vancouver, well nothing happens there so I would say Perth

 

[Himeno]

I've said it before: I think it extraordinary that between them, AC and ANZ can have 3 daily services (with no Australian Star Alliance feeder service) and are wanting a fourth (or so they say) while QF has only a seasonal service. Yes, QF is aircraft constrained but they apparently didn't plan for an Australia/Canada route even during the mining boom 5+ years ago.

QF used to have daily flights to YVR, via the allowed 5th freedom ports of NAN, PPT, HNL or SFO. They had been cut back to a seasonal tag via SFO before the SFO flight was cut in 2011.
Until last October, AU and CA carriers were limited to 3000 seats/week and flights to 2 ports (Sydney +1 and Vancouver +1). With the AC announcement of BNE last year, they took the remaining balance of the Canadian 3000 seats/week and moved to have the current AU +1 (MEL) moved to BNE. Last Oct, during the process of moving the MEL flight allowance to BNE, the air service agreement changed, dropping the 2 port limit and increasing the amount of seats.

I would expect that once QF has enough 787-9s, they'd look at giving YVR more frequency with the 787.

 

[Cruiser Elite]

J/K = just kidding.

 

[RooFlyer]

Ah, thanks. I understood J was business class, and was thinking K must be some class on SQ above R

 

[Viridianne]

I would have said Toronto = Sydney and Montreal = Menbourne.

Vancouver, well nothing happens there so I would say Perth

This is more accurate When I went to Toronto I thought I went back to Sydne

 

[TomVexille]

I would certainly not say no to more options to North America

 

[Melburnian1]

Thanks to AFF member Quickstatus, I have made a few comments about QF's shortly recommencing SYD - YVR - SYD B744 flights in the QF delays/ cancellations thread.