"... we'll shortly announce a major investment to improve our Frequent Flyer program"

[I love to travel]

Perhaps focus on earning other point currencies.

If Kris flyer execs were watching this thread they should very quickly partner with a bank. Yes there are transfer options available now but having a more lucrative transfer rate would push some people towards SIA.

 

[bjm76]

If Kris flyer execs were watching this thread they should very quickly partner with a bank. Yes there are transfer options available now but having a more lucrative transfer rate would push some people towards SIA.

Agree on this - if this product was launched I would sign up immediately. I know the HSBC card together with Amex sort of gets there...

 

[logicallysynced]

Casually paranoid when this goes live all the remaining open seats in J will get taken by points whales so my 1 year prior platinum upgrade request from Y+ to J chances will vanish

With my flight in first week of May, expecting it to be affected by CR+

 

[RichardMEL]

Casually paranoid when this goes live all the remaining open seats in J will get taken by points whales so my 1 year prior platinum upgrade request from Y+ to J chances will vanish

With my flight in first week of May, expecting it to be affected by CR+

The leak says this goes live from July - so no probably you will not be affected.

 

[logicallysynced]

The leak says this goes live from July - so no probably you will not be affected.

 

[elanshin]

The key question for me (and probably Qantas/the banks) is: how do you convince people to spend on their Qantas-earning cards when there is a credit card surcharge?

Most credit card surcharges are at least 1-1.5% these days and most Qantas-earning cards earn, at most, 1c/pt. (Amex's top tier of cards notwithstanding.)

That means, whenever you pay a surcharge, you are buying points for 1-1.5c/pt (or more).

And under this new scheme those points are worth 1-1.5c/pt (at most).

No one in their right mind would exchange $100 of cash — which is infinitely flexible — for $100 of Qantas points — where you're locked into Qantas' system with all the restrictions that entails. And you could very well be exchanging $100 of cash for $75 of Qantas points — even worse!

I'm guessing the answer is Qantas/the banks are assuming that:
- Consumers don't do the math
- Consumers are lazy and still pay with their card even where there is a surcharge
- Consumers continue to believe they'll be able to redeem their points at classic award rates

I really wonder if those assumptions are sustainable over the long term, especially as surcharges spread and spread, prompting customers to do the sums.

Merchants "eat" the fee and it's "no surcharge".

 

[chrispy3276]

Confirmed: Changes are being announced on Monday morning. Strap yourselves in folks!

Qantas to launch Classic Plus points rewards on Monday

The new scheme will let frequent flyers book more flights with fewer points compared to the Points Plus Pay option.

www.executivetraveller.com

 

[RealtimeY]

I'm guessing the answer is Qantas/the banks are assuming that:
- Consumers don't do the math
- Consumers are lazy and still pay with their card even where there is a surcharge

Looking at card payment proliferation here despite surcharges, I think this is probably correct. Personally, I don't mind paying to not have to handle cash. (Not that cash is really "free" either)

 

[Mickey Mouse]

I think this hits the nail on the head.

Again, my belief is eventually, C+ will be the only award seats available. And based on simple maths - it just isn't worth it.

I'd also like to add that QF J/F flights are more expensive than most. Etihad and QR have a better J product, often at a better price. So purely by the maths, you should keep the cash and forego the QF redemptions. Perhaps focus on earning other point currencies.

Even if its just a token number, I believe they'll keep a few CRs ... otherwise the current advertising for CCs wouldn't be able to keep claiming "With our churning signup bonus you can fly to all of these beautiful locations!*"
*Flights shown are subject to availability & the terms & conditions of QFF
They'd have to change the ads to "With our churning signup bonus you can fly from Sydney to Melbourne ... wow - amazing!*"
*Flights shown are subject to our famous kick-you-out-if-we've-screwed-up-yet-again and need to deadhead tech crew

 

[aikman]

Looking at card payment proliferation here despite surcharges, I think this is probably correct. Personally, I don't mind paying to not have to handle cash. (Not that cash is really "free" either)

Yeah I agree. You just need to go out to the shops and observe. Almost everyone pays with their phones (and sometimes by card) these days, regardless of surcharge.

It will only be the savvy and avid points collectors that will worry about the surcharge vs points earn.

 

[ChrisMars]

Will the taxes be payable on top of CR+? Can t remember what was leaked. What's people opinion? Considering a fixed point transfer rate as is done for p+p, I sort of hope the taxes are included. Otherwise people will struggle to validate the 1c or 1.5c per poins

 

[roby]

This is designed to trick less savvy travellers into burning more points without the need to release more Classic Reward seats, an approach Air NZ has been using to deceive Kiwis for ages. This will no doubt reduce the liability the QFF carries and thus making it even more profitable.

 

[Daver6]

How long until regular CR is completely removed leaving only CR+ and points + pay? I give it 18 months. This is just devaluation by stealth IMHO.

 

[RooFlyer]

How long until regular CR is completely removed leaving only CR+ and points + pay? I give it 18 months. This is just devaluation by stealth IMHO.

Well, the point at which its removed will be hard to tell. I mean, there is never a consistent stream, with lots of long gaps when you search. One day we'll wake up and realise no-one has seen a CR for a while. Qantas will say "Classic+ was very popular, and the uptake of CR dwindled, so we've listened to out customers and converted all CR to Classic+"

 

[Doctore1003]

I don’t understand what this means: “Classic Plus reward seats will generally be made available 353 days in advance … That’ll be your first and best chance to snap these up“.

So there will be a limited number of seats? ie. You can’t just wait until the cash fare is on sale and then book at 1/1.5 cents per point?

 

[levelnine]

I don’t understand what this means: “Classic Plus reward seats will generally be made available 353 days in advance … That’ll be your first and best chance to snap these up“.

So there will be a limited number of seats? ie. You can’t just wait until the cash fare is on sale and then book at 1/1.5 cents per point?

I think it's sloppy reporting. Given that the value of points is fixed under this scheme, there's no reason to expect that there will be many, if any, limits to their capacity.

The only possible reason I can think for their being capacity limits is that Qantas is still making a loss at these redemption rates and, therefore, they don't want the whole plane filled with CR+ redemptions.

 

[Daver6]

I think it's sloppy reporting. Given that the value of points is fixed under this scheme, there's no reason to expect that there will be many, if any, limits to their capacity.

The only possible reason I can think for their being capacity limits is that Qantas is still making a loss at these redemption rates and, therefore, they don't want the whole plane filled with CR+ redemptions.

I would have thought they'd be limited, otherwise who would use points plus pay?

 

[Doctore1003]

I would have thought they'd be limited, otherwise who would use points plus pay?

I figured p+p would be for people who don’t have enough points for a CR+ seat, but want to use points to reduce the cost of their fare.

 

[Daver6]

I figured p+p would be for people who don’t have enough points for a CR+ seat, but want to use points to reduce the cost of their fare.

Except one requires way more point for points plus pay. Who knows. We'll find out soon though.

 

[harryhv]

Why would anyone mourn the disappearance of Qantas Classic Rewards? They're terrible. For example, SYD-PER business class:
a) American Airlines 20,000 miles plus USD27 (for the same Qantas seat)
b) Qantas Classic Reward, some massive amount, more than double both points and fees

And now the announcement of some new devalued award at Qantas with an even worse burn-rate? Whyever would they publicise this, it only draws attention to the already-miserable value of Qantas Frequent Flyer points