Bonza Airline Discussion

[dajop]

Are there even 42 737 capable airports in Aus ?

Didn't take too long to think of 42 off the top of my head, excluding mining charter airports. Not that all would suitable for leisure LCC traffic!

NSW (6): SYD, ABX, TMW, NTL, CFS, BNK
Qld (15 ): WTB, OOL, MCY, HVB, BDB(?) GLT, ROK, MKY, HTI, PPP, TSV, CNS, ISA, GOV, LRE(?)
NT (4): DRW, ASP, AYQ, KTR
WA(9): KNX, BME, LEA, PHE, GET, KTA, KGI, BQB, ZNE(?)
SA(1): ADL
VIC(3); MEL, AVV, MQL
TAS(2): HBA, LST
ACT(1): CBR
Oth(1): XCH

 

[flyingfan]

How do you make a small fortune in the airline industry...

I wish them well but I fear it'll end in tears again, especially for the Australian employees.

 

[SeatBackForward]

How do you make a small fortune in the airline industry...

Ooh I know this one. Start with a big fortune.

 

[Mattg]

I could be proven wrong, but they seem well-backed and their founders are reasonably experienced. I actually rate their chances of survival higher than Rex.

 

[dajop]

I could be proven wrong, but they seem well-backed and their founders are reasonably experienced. I actually rate their chances of survival higher than Rex.

I think you’re right with respect to the Rex jet operations (ie. chance of survival greater than Rex 737 services). I think though Rex hasn’t invested that much in the jet product (yet) to bring down the whole company, so suspect it will be around even after it flies it’s last 737 flight.

 

[Chicken]

I actually rate their chances of survival higher than Rex.

Me too. It's been talk about on ABC radio, and they said that the airline is not interested in trying to get a piece of the existing pie, but they want to grow the pie, which QF and VA won't be interested in. This is a big difference.

 

[HS-TQE]

I could be proven wrong, but they seem well-backed and their founders are reasonably experienced. I actually rate their chances of survival higher than Rex.

Agreed.

The founders (ex-Virgin Blue and ex-Cebu Pacific) I would suspect would be studying the initial case of Tiger Airways Australia (then owned by Singapore Airlines via Tiger Airways Holdings Pte Ltd) attempting to take the same Allegiant p2p ULCC model approach before eventually entering the East Coast 'triangle' and establishing a 'hub' model in the Australian capital cities (minus the interline arrangements on Full Service and some LCCs) some 18 months later.

The question is whether the Australian population can support an Allegiant/ULCC p2p model between smaller towns and/or alternative airports in the big cities (e.g Wollongong, Bankstown, Avalon, etc).

 

[RooFlyer]

CEO of Bonza was on ABC Radio this morning. He was asked several times if the airline would fly into Tasmania. Avoided it each time.

He did say that just *yesterday* the airline wrote to 42 airports around Australia asking if they would like to come “partners" with Bonza. That is, if they would give them a discount on the landing fees etc as the CEO said airport costs were 25% of their total costs.

also said that they expect to have their schedule out by the end of the year.

we’ll see on both counts.

Something I forgot to mention. After the CEO said that they were going to run, B737-8s, the ABC radio host - in his 50's, been on the air for many years - said words to the effect that "he was getting lots of texts saying how the 737-8 is really the 737-MAX and people were freaking out. What's the thing about the MAX aircraft?".

Just goes to show how aviation un-aware even people who have jobs involving public/current affairs are.

 

[jakeseven7]

The question is whether the Australian population can support an Allegiant/ULCC p2p model between smaller towns and/or alternative airports in the big cities (e.g Wollongong, Bankstown, Avalon, etc).

They can’t. There simply isn’t the volume. They will end up on the big routes too in time for sure (if they have deep enough pockets).

But I agree, Rex (jet), Bonza and VA2 will not all survive this… there will be deaths or forced mergers and lots of burning cash.

 

[SeatBackForward]

They can’t. There simply isn’t the volume. They will end up on the big routes too in time for sure (if they have deep enough pockets).

But I agree, Rex (jet), Bonza and VA2 will not all survive this… there will be deaths or forced mergers and lots of burning cash.

There's probably quite a bit of pent up travel demand over the past 18months, and there may be more people interested in travelling to these regional destinations by Bonkers airlines than previously.

If Bankers airline can tee their flights up with travel/tour/accommodation providers in these destinations, there may just be some hope they can keep their offerings sustainable for longer. But if Bogan airlines intends to just fly people to Tamworth and let them fend for themselves upon arrival, then yeh, we might see them forced into flying the triangle and to start offering Bazza's airline lounges etc.

 

[Chicken]

Something I forgot to mention. After the CEO said that they were going to run, B737-8s, the ABC radio host - in his 50's, been on the air for many years - said words to the effect that "he was getting lots of texts saying how the 737-8 is really the 737-MAX and people were freaking out. What's the thing about the MAX aircraft?".

Just goes to show how aviation un-aware even people who have jobs involving public/current affairs are.

Surely that person could remember the whole 'everyone was going to die' story of maxx 8?

 

[jakeseven7]

There's probably quite a bit of pent up travel demand over the past 18months, and there may be more people interested in travelling to these regional destinations by Bonkers airlines than previously.

If Bankers airline can tee their flights up with travel/tour/accommodation providers in these destinations, there may just be some hope they can keep their offerings sustainable for longer. But if Bogan airlines intends to just fly people to Tamworth and let them fend for themselves upon arrival, then yeh, we might see them forced into flying the triangle and to start offering Bazza's airline lounges etc.

We desperately need our AFF insider consultant back

 

[dajop]

They can’t. There simply isn’t the volume. They will end up on the big routes too in time for sure (if they have deep enough pockets).

If you look at US, Allegiant, for example services a range of cities which have urban populations in the 100,000-200,000 range (and some in the Dakotas even smaller) with non-stop leisure services (for example to Phoenix and Las Vegas, obviously primarily serving the leisure market, probably not a lot of traffic in the other direction). I am guessing there are lot more of these smaller cities than in Australia though, so you get economies of scale of popping into a couple of dozen cities a couple of times a week (or whatever frequency).

What population could expand the market and sustain leisure based LCC jet services (eg from the regional city to SYD, MEL, OOL, CNS or MCY, for example)? Could Toowoomba or Albury, (with catchments of 180,000+), for example support such services? Could AVV(Geelong) support anything more? Quite a few cities/regions with reasonable (150,000+) catchments but too close to MEL or SYD, and no jet capable airport (Wollongong, Central Coast, Ballarat, Bendigo)

 

[DC3]

Compass Mk III?

 

[Guvner]

Compass Mk III?

Compass lacked direction and was always going South..

 

[Saab34]

Don’t forget Tiger tried Avalon to Hobart, Canberra (announced but never eventuates), Perth, Alice Springs, Coolangatta. Didn’t last overly long. They never went back either.

 

[dajop]

Don’t forget Tiger tried Avalon to Hobart, Canberra (announced but never eventuates), Perth, Alice Springs, Coolangatta. Didn’t last overly long. They never went back either.

Yes. But it doesn’t help the brand or peoples willingness to fly if you manage to be grounded by the regulator for 6 weeks. Those routes never stood a chance once that happened.

 

[Chicken]

Don’t forget Tiger tried Avalon to Hobart, Canberra (announced but never eventuates), Perth, Alice Springs, Coolangatta. Didn’t last overly long. They never went back either.

What would people do in Avalon or Alice? Nothing?

However, if say, this new airline takes people to Griffith, and Griffith City Council (note the word City in council name? That means it has achieved a population number of something I can't remember) push tourism, to vineyards and fancy restaurants, then it could become a viable route?

 

[N860CR]

What would people do in Avalon or Alice? Nothing?

However, if say, this new airline takes people to Griffith, and Griffith City Council (note the word City in council name? That means it has achieved a population number of something I can't remember) push tourism, to vineyards and fancy restaurants, then it could become a viable route?

For a 200 seat plane? A few times a week? No. Australia’s rural and regional ports are not large enough to support high capacity jet services. That’s even ignoring airport infrastructure. The towns themselves just aren’t setup for it.

America has the benefit of absolutely loads of small sized cities of half a million people or so. Australia is different, half of us live in three major capitals.

The concept is great, but our population doesn’t support it.

 

[Chicken]

For a 200 seat plane? A few times a week? No. Australia’s rural and regional ports are not large enough to support high capacity jet services. That’s even ignoring airport infrastructure. The towns themselves just aren’t setup for it.

America has the benefit of absolutely loads of small sized cities of half a million people or so. Australia is different, half of us live in three major capitals.

The concept is great, but our population doesn’t support it.

Exactly, they need small planes; but they have already said that they won't be doing SYD MEL BNE cos there is no point, and they said they want to create a new pie, not trying to get a piece of the existing pie, so they may not be focusing on places like OOL