One world award flight Melb to London to New York, Melb Sept 2013 4 passengers

[Pierre10]

Hi All, I’m a newbie here, 1st post, so looking for some help!

I am wanting to take my wife and our 2 teenage kids on round the world trip this year in September using my points. We would fly Economy. I have approx 630,000 QFF. I am flexible on departure and arrival back home dates to an extent as you can see below.
I have seen through other posts and see that I will get best points value, doing a Zone 10 One World type award - 140,000 points PP? I am happy to use the following airlines, QF, CX, AA, or EK too thus giving me the minimum of at least 3 OW carriers.

Following is our itinerary showing the flexible arrival and departure dates from Melb.
Depart Melb either 13/9, 14/9, 15/9 or 16/9, London Stop 3 nights, then on to Paris Stop almost 3 weeks, London to Pariscan be via either air or Euro Star, then around 5/10, 6/10 depart Paris for JFK STOP 3 nights, Arrive back in Melb either 10/10, 11/10 or 12/10.

Note, I would have been happy to add a 1 night stopover in Hong Kong, but felt this would limit our flight options in terms of getting to London.

Also, as mentioned above, happy to get from London to Paris on the Euro star, as that will save me points, Obviously this train fair will cost, me, and I have to work out where I can obtain the cheapest fair for this.

Looking for help if this is doable given the timing of our trip, is this the most effective approach in terms points usage of getting to see London at the start, then Paris next, and New York at the end? We weren’t planning to go the other way around and do New York first, however that is not a problem if it makes it easier to secure the 4 seats. How many points will I lose doing this over the phone for the 4 of us, as I cannot see how I do this via the QFF site.

Thank you in advance. Any help and advice is much appreciated as I really would like to get the flight part of our family trip locked away.

Cheers,
Andre.

 

[ozbeachbabe]

There is a dedicated thread for planning these trips which can be found by clicking on the following link:

http://www.australianfrequentflyer....ogram/oneworld-award-140k-280k-420k-8228.html

 

[Pierre10]

Hi ozbeachbabe,
Thanks for your advice! , I see my post has been moved to the QFF section,
cheers.

 

[Grooba]

The initial search throws up tons of availability for 4 people in Y. However the site doesn't specify an actual RTW fare. MEL-LHR-CDG-JFK-LHR-MEL is available on exactly the dates you want for 560,000 points and a touch over $6,000 in fees/taxes/carrier charges.

 

[Grooba]

Hmm don't know how to make that pic seem bigger/clearer.

 

[Pierre10]

Thanks Vec, very much appreciated!

I saved it to my pictures but still couldn't read it. Surely the $6k wasn't over and above? I thought these charges would be in the hundreds not 1000's. Also after JFK, next destination is Melb(home).

Cheers,

 

[DAC1]

Thanks Vec, very much appreciated!

I saved it to my pictures but still couldn't read it. Surely the $6k wasn't over and above? I thought these charges would be in the hundreds not 1000's. Also after JFK, next destination is Melb(home).

Cheers,

You obviously arent accustomed to QF award booking charges. The main killer in your journey appears to be the LHR stop, very high taxes incurred out of the UK which QF pass on.

 

[Pierre10]

Thanks for your reply rabbits5,

Your'e right, only awards flghts we have taken have been family domestic Queensland etc. OK, am I right in assuming that the high taxes out of LHR are departure taxes?, not charges on arrival? because we are happy to go London to Paris by train not by air. That way no LHR departure taxes. How much would this save?

 

[DAC1]

Thanks for your reply rabbits5,

Your'e right, only awards flghts we have taken have been family domestic Queensland etc. OK, am I right in assuming that the high taxes out of LHR are departure taxes?, not charges on arrival? because we are happy to go London to Paris by train not by air. That way no LHR departure taxes. How much would this save?

Im going to play around with a few dummy bookings now but I think you might come into issues both ways, UK airports seem to have high taxes so I think it's both ways. Let me have a look, I've never directly booked a QF award to/from LHR, but I have worked it out on an AA award before and the taxes were extremely high.

 

[DAC1]

I'm going to struggle to help you further because I don't have 560,000 points in my account so it won't let me go as far as determining the fees, taxes and fuel fines. However your routing shouldn't be a problem. One observation though is when I took out that LHR-CDG flight, it went from 560000 to 632000. The routing MEL-LHR-CDG-JFK-xLHR-MEL is basically a OW 140k award so I'd recommend keeping that extra flight in there because it doesn't save you points by taking it out (taxes and charges though I'm not too sure).

PS. Above you said next stop after JFK was MEL, however the award routing takes you back through LHR.

 

[CaviAck]

Above you said next stop after JFK was MEL, however the award routing takes you back through LHR.

Might have to put in LAX as a stop then? That's still within the rules right?

 

[DAC1]

Might have to put in LAX as a stop then? That's still within the rules right?

That's correct, that is still within the rules and it would save on some of those LHR fuel fines. But theres no availability even for a week either side of the OP's dates, would have to wait until 2 weeks after (Australian school holiday period, wouldn't expect any availablity to the US late Sep/early Oct).

 

[Pierre10]

I'm going to struggle to help you further because I don't have 560,000 points in my account so it won't let me go as far as determining the fees, taxes and fuel fines. However your routing shouldn't be a problem. One observation though is when I took out that LHR-CDG flight, it went from 560000 to 632000. The routing MEL-LHR-CDG-JFK-xLHR-MEL is basically a OW 140k award so I'd recommend keeping that extra flight in there because it doesn't save you points by taking it out (taxes and charges though I'm not too sure).

PS. Above you said next stop after JFK was MEL, however the award routing takes you back through LHR.

Thanks rabbits5, I really appreciate what you have been able to uncover! Thank you again.

Wow, that's bizzare, less miles but the points required go up! In terms of the routing, going back the long way ie via LHR again after being in NY seems crazy when they know I want to get to Melb! Is this just their programming that spits this stuff out. If I was speaking with someone there over the phone, would they make the comment "that can't be right" and be able to put a sensible alteration in, or do they not have the ability/authority to make common sense alterations to something their computer programming has recommended?

I'm thinking that as the whole LHR thing is causing so many problems at the start and also it would seem at the end of our trip, that we get rid of it all together, and we fly direct to Paris from Melb, and then hop on a return train journey to London and get that part of our trip out of the way. It's not something I really wanted to do, losing an extra day in travel to do that as well as doing this straight after a flight from Melb in the back of the plane! I would not be Mr Popularity in my family that is for sure.
The return journy for 4 from Paris to London by train sounds like it could be expensive also.

 

[Pierre10]

Thanks CaviAck, I have no probs putting LAX in as a stop or SFO too for that matter, if this removes the second LHR.

 

[Pierre10]

so raBBITS5 are you saying we cannot even get into the US ie Paris - JFK on the date range I provied in my OP, or does the school holiday thing refer to the LAX component only. If the latter only, would the situation be different if I did SFO instead? I can well understand the LAX bit & school holidays probably due to the Disneyland factor?

 

[Pierre10]

I'm going to struggle to help you further because I don't have 560,000 points in my account so it won't let me go as far as determining the fees, taxes and fuel fines. However your routing shouldn't be a problem. One observation though is when I took out that LHR-CDG flight, it went from 560000 to 632000. The routing MEL-LHR-CDG-JFK-xLHR-MEL is basically a OW 140k award so I'd recommend keeping that extra flight in there because it doesn't save you points by taking it out (taxes and charges though I'm not too sure).

PS. Above you said next stop after JFK was MEL, however the award routing takes you back through LHR.

Thanks rabbits5, I really appreciate what you have been able to uncover! Thank you again.

Wow, that's bizzare, less miles but the points required go up! In terms of the routing, going back the long way ie via LHR again after being in NY seems crazy when they know I want to get to Melb! Is this just their programming that spits this stuff out. If I was speaking with someone there over the phone, would they make the comment "that can't be right" and be able to put a sensible alteration in, or do they not have the ability/authority to make common sense alterations to something their computer programming has recommended?

I'm thinking that as the whole LHR thing is causing so many problems at the start and also it would seem at the end of our trip, that we get rid of it all together, and we fly direct to Paris from Melb, and then hop on a return train journey to London and get that part of our trip out of the way. It's not something I really wanted to do, losing an extra day in travel to do that as well as doing this straight after a flight from Melb in the back of the plane! I would not be Mr Popularity in my family that is for sure.
The return journy for 4 from Paris to London by train sounds like it could be expensive also.

 

[aikman]

LHR is not your issue here. The majority of the taxes is made up of fuel surcharges. There’s no way around it really for long haul QF awards. It’s just the way it is. You are only paying £13 for the UK APD tax on the LHR-CDG flight (Air Passenger Duty - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia). The UK APD is not applicable to transits or arrivals.

If you want to go from JFK to MEL on your dates in mid October, seats are only available the long way around via LHR. Alternatively, if you are willing to reverse your route, this will reduce the need to backtrack. There are plenty of seats available from MEL to JFK in mid September and then to LHR and CDG.

Assuming you reverse your route, I checked and there’s also availability from LHR/CDG to HKG then to MEL in early/mid October. You might as well stop in HKG if you're thinking about it.

 

[moa999]

I would also suggest calling the Qantas desk as not all oneworld airlines are available online (think only QF, AA, BA and sometimes CX).
Some of the operators are very good at helping you.

 

[Pierre10]

LHR is not your issue here. The majority of the taxes is made up of fuel surcharges. There’s no way around it really for long haul QF awards. It’s just the way it is. You are only paying £13 for the UK APD tax on the LHR-CDG flight The UK APD is not applicable to transits or arrivals.

If you want to go from JFK to MEL on your dates in mid October, seats are only available the long way around via LHR. Alternatively, if you are willing to reverse your route, this will reduce the need to backtrack. There are plenty of seats available from MEL to JFK in mid September and then to LHR and CDG.

Assuming you reverse your route, I checked and there’s also availability from LHR/CDG to HKG then to MEL in early/mid October. You might as well stop in HKG if you're thinking about it.

aikman, thanks for clarifying the LHR situation. So the hefty fuel surcharges, is it fair to say that Qantas Fuel surcharges are higher, than say AA or CX, BA? If this comes under a OW Zone 10 award, I would presume there is the probabilty to be flying with most or all of the above airlines including Qantas or does it not matter what metal i'm in, Qantas will just bill me all their charges as i'm doing this through them?

I am a little confused here on this. On this reverse trip which i'm definitely open to I image it would be QF to LAX, AA across the country to JFK, AA or BA to LHR, BA to CDG, and probably CX out of Paris back to Melb if we stop in at HKG. Am I correct in this assumption?

 

[Pierre10]

thanks moa999, Yes, I can see with this that in the end I will call qantas as this award maybe not so straight forward to do online. How many points will I lose doing this for the four of us via phone with qantas. And also do you think I would get to choose who I flew with on particular legs if it was going to save me in fuel surcharges if there was a noticable difference between the airlines, given this seems to be the major component of the oncosts?
Also, can the taxes and fuel charges be offset using points?

Everyone has been so helpful in getting me to this point. When I do speak with qantas, at least I will do so with a some degree of knowledge.