Economy lie flat beds

[ffhound]

Hi everyone
I want to suggest a discussion about the idea of lie down beds in Economy.
Planes have been flying further and also becoming more fuel efficient. Some years ago. British Airways introduced us to lie flat seats for business class, now its common.

So it seems only a matter of time before somebody finds a way to make lie flat beds in economy economically viable. Personally I would love to see this so that the average flyer can enjoy a more comfortable flying experience.

The issue is though - how to do it? I wonder whether it might be possible to drop the floor down a foot or so then have seats alternately low then high then low etc which fold down to a bed that is either low or high. That way the high bed could protrude over the low bed.

Thoughts? In our lifetime?

 

[mannej]

Hasn’t NZ done this already with Skycouch?

 

[Forg]

CI had a similar product to Skycouch on their newly-outfitted aircraft (A350 & some B777) & pulled the product in the middle of the year. So it seems that, while willing to try, they couldn't get it to work for them.

Given that Skycouch takes the room of 3 seats yet you'd struggle to get 2 adults next to each other, I haven't seen it used in practice & can't see how it'd work comfortably with 2 people let alone 3. Not to mention all the feet that would have to hang off the end - economy seats being ~1.5' wide & the average western male's height being 4x that. It'd definitely be possible to carry the same number of passengers lying down as seated, but I can't see how it'd be possible to have anything that converts between one & the other with the same passenger-density.

 

[jb747]

How much extra are you prepared to pay?

 

[kelvedon]

It’s been tried before!

 

[JohnK]

Perhaps something similar to bunk beds.

For me all I'd need is a little extra room and I don't need a flat bed. I don't use the flat bed when flying business anyway.

 

[moa999]

Not going to happen...

You effectively pay for the floorspace you take up.. so 32" X 17" for most economy seats

And why airlines have pushed for narrower or reduced pitch seats or standing/ half-standing designs.

Only way to go flat and not use up more space is to stack, so you'd need bunks at least three high, and I don't see that ever working from a safety or weight perspective.

 

[Forg]

Alternative - hypersonic travel, and jam 'em in like sardines.
That's basically what they did with Concorde … wasn't it theoretically an all-F cabin, at least in terms of service? Except the seats had the width of Y and nearly as much legroom as W. Didn't matter because your 10hr flight was done in 5.
How much more fuel per passenger did Concorde use than a B789? ~10x? Stupid wind-resistance … bring on the outer-atmospheric turboramjets!

 

[trooper]

Only way it would be economical would be (at least?) triple bunks.....and they would have to BE bunks ALL the time....One at virtually floor level, one "XX" above and one "XX" above that? Can't stack seats!...
I imagine many folks wouldn't want to lie down ALL the time..(perhaps a partial bunk fit/partial seat fit cabin?)
Access is needed to each "stack" so keeping the pax capacity up to a high enough figure would be difficult, as you would need more aisles... If each (longitudinally placed) "WINDOW" triple bunk took the floor space of 3(?) normal seats with a normal aisle beside it, then two adjacent stacks, an aisle, two adjacent stacks, aisle etc I wonder how many rows could be fitted in? No overheads I'd imagine... Evacuation might be a problem... Interesting thought exercise anyway...

P.S. I suppose hammocks ala Royal Navy 1800's is out of the question? lol

 

[Forg]

Evacuation might be a problem...

Well actually … just think of it like a few hundred torpedos being fired, all at once …

 

[kelvedon]

High speed evacuation can be achieved by keeping the cabin pressure high and opening the doors !

 

[HockeyMonkey]

Perhaps in PE first?

 

[MEL_Traveller]

Perhaps in PE first?

I agree - I think it will come to PE first, perhaps with some sort of couchette arrangement.

The major issue with beds in economy will be one of safety... needing to have easy access to oxygen masks if required. This means all 'beds' would need to have direct line of sight to the overhead compartments, or the oxygen tubing would need to be routed via cabin fittings to be in reach of lower beds (or beds under others).

 

[HockeyMonkey]

This New Blended Cabin Could Introduce the World’s First Lay-Flat Premium Economy Seat

 

[HockeyMonkey]

This looks comfortable. Not surprised it wasn't implemented.

Lufthansa considering bunk-bed style sleeper seating in economy class | UPGRADE: TRAVEL BETTER

 

[trooper]

This looks comfortable. Not surprised it wasn't implemented.

Lufthansa considering bunk-bed style sleeper seating in economy class | UPGRADE: TRAVEL BETTER

Sure does. For lying down. How that would work on long flights is of course interesting....given people do get sick of that and want to sit for a while....Hard to see how triple bunks could also work as seats...

 

[MEL_Traveller]

Sure does. For lying down. How that would work on long flights is of course interesting....given people do get sick of that and want to sit for a while....Hard to see how triple bunks could also work as seats...

Same same as a train I guess? People have to work out, in shared cabins, when to sit and when to sleep. Alternatively you could sit up in bed (depending on the clearance) or have a small seating area somewhere else (or bar or something).

 

[trooper]

Except that I can't see any way to turn a triple bunk into 3 seats. Sitting up in bed is not all that comfortable is it? Not for long anyway...and I doubt there'd be the headroom....and an Economy Bar? I doubt it....I was thinking more of some sort of roster - bed - seat LOL... Half the cabin seats, the other half beds.

 

[Quickstatus]

Even so I predict the majority will pay the lowest fare and sit in a non reclining cramped seat.
Discretionary income will always be spent at the destination for the majority...

 

[Cossie]

Only way it would be economical would be (at least?) triple bunks.....and they would have to BE bunks ALL the time....One at virtually floor level, one "XX" above and one "XX" above that? Can't stack seats!...
I imagine many folks wouldn't want to lie down ALL the time..(perhaps a partial bunk fit/partial seat fit cabin?)
Access is needed to each "stack" so keeping the pax capacity up to a high enough figure would be difficult, as you would need more aisles... If each (longitudinally placed) "WINDOW" triple bunk took the floor space of 3(?) normal seats with a normal aisle beside it, then two adjacent stacks, an aisle, two adjacent stacks, aisle etc I wonder how many rows could be fitted in? No overheads I'd imagine... Evacuation might be a problem... Interesting thought exercise anyway...

P.S. I suppose hammocks ala Royal Navy 1800's is out of the question? lol

Quite a few buses in S.E. Asia are sleeper buses. Not my idea of comfortable travel, but I'm not in my twenties anymore!