"... we'll shortly announce a major investment to improve our Frequent Flyer program"

[drron]

There is already the ability to redeem points for hotel stays and tours.

Im not convinced that hotel programs offer better value than classic rewards.

Except I can't find any classic awards for us on the routes we fly. And I mean none for 2 people even on the day of release. Those that only need 1 award will probably still be able to get CRs.
Because of elite status I do much better through hotel programs. If I book through QF there are no elite benefits provided.
For example our go to hotel now is the IC Bangkok Sukhumvit. If I use IHG points I will get a high floor, sometimes a suite and always club lounge access.
To get an ordinary room it is less points with QF than IHG points. But if I want a high floor with breakfast the numbers are comparable. But QF doesn't allow me to book a room with club access.
In the long run we probably will end up using up the QFF points on hotels as I doubt we will ever get CRs for 2 people in J. Probably on road trips where chain hotels aren't common.

 

[Lynda2475]

Except I can't find any classic awards for us on the routes we fly. And I mean none for 2 people even on the day of release.

I do not believe there is any such thing as "the day of release" anymore.

Since covid the old release schedules haven't been adhered to, if playing the game one just has to keep checking periodically or jump when they do one of the mass release promos.

I couldn't maintain my IHG diamond, so I have burnt all my points on redemptions for later this year but they didn't go very far. I guess I do not care too much about club access, as the places I stay typically have plenty of reasonably priced restaurants, cafes or bars near by. Im not one for hanging out at the hotel too much. YMMV.

 

[CaptJCool]

People want a fair reward
Is 4% of spend a fair return ?

After all the slow way of points earn means a LOT of spending has ALREADY been done

Of course churning is faster and a bigger reward

 

[ChrisMars]

I didnt get the survey. I think most of us suffer from the lack of award. A simple way to fix that is to allow transfer to velocity. Even at 2:1. Anyone feels like dropping this suggestion on the survey?

 

[RooFlyer]

A simple way to fix that is to allow transfer to velocity. Even at 2:1. Anyone feels like dropping this suggestion on the survey?

Not me. I already earn quite enough VFF points, thanks.

I am fascinated by this seemingly tortuous evolution of QFF. I hope people haven't put all their FF points ( and hopes) into one basket.

 

[Mr H]

I didnt get the survey. I think most of us suffer from the lack of award. A simple way to fix that is to allow transfer to velocity. Even at 2:1. Anyone feels like dropping this suggestion on the survey?

A simpler way would be to allow partner airlines to be included in OWAs. Including coughstar.

 

[ozflier]

A simpler way would be to allow partner airlines to be included in OWAs. Including coughstar.

That would be an improvement.

 

[Lynda2475]

A simpler way would be to allow partner airlines to be included in OWAs. Including coughstar.

OWA is a product across all the OW airlines, they cant include non OW partners.

QF could offer a separate award type for more points that could include partners, but could not market it as OWA.

You'd think they include one world connect before non one world if they did anything similar.

Jetstar aside, QFs other main Non One World partner is EK and their taxes/carrier charges are very expensive would make it poor value.

 

[CaptJCool]

I’m pretty sure I did the same survey some weeks / months ago

I was pretty pointed in the feedback

It’s a FF program ffs. It’s in the title so get to work on providing far more reward redemption opportunities.

 

[Mattg]

I wonder how many people have selected “strongly agree” to “I expect to be able to redeem my points on any flight I want”.

This is unrealistic, and not something I would agree with, but I suspect most people will when it's worded that way. Which QF will take away to say “our customers want classic+ rewards”.

 

[Lynda2475]

I was very clear in my feedback on the survey that I have zero interest in redeeming points for anything except classic awards. I commented that points plus pay is unattractive as is redeeming for wine or at Qantas mall.

 

[jase05]

A simple way to fix that is to allow transfer to velocity. Even at 2:1.

Stay away you heathens

 

[encryptededdy]

My take is that over the next 5-10 years, we'll slowly see true "reward" flights disappear. There's already so many airline programs around using dynamic pricing such that the only way to get good value for your points is to book partner flights (I'm thinking Aeroplan, Airpoints, Delta to name a few).

Good premium award flight availability can only exist when only a small proportion of customers are "clued in" to redeeming their points for high-value premium class awards and/or there is a relatively limited supply of points. It's nice to say that you want every business seat to be available at the rewards rate, but I'm sure everyone knows that this isn't financially viable for any airline unless the supply of points is sufficiently constrained.

Subjectively I feel like the proliferation of "point hacking" is spreading faster and faster on social media etc., and with more and more people every year wanting a business class flight for just a $200 annual fee CC sign-up bonus, there's no way this can last and stay profitable for airlines at current pricing (in terms of award flight points cost and also cost of points sold to banks). I'm sure the reduction in business travel and increase in premium leisure travel isn't helping, since it's the leisure travellers trying to redeem points.

For now, I'm glad we have two programs in Australia with a somewhat OK supply of award flights at relatively low rates. I just can't imagine this will continue on forever.

Looking on American forums where people often have access to lots of transferrable currencies (that transfer at very good rates, unlike most cards in Australia), you can find that people are getting the best value by transferring to foreign programs. I don't think it's a coincidence that these are programs in countries where it's relatively hard to get large sign-up bonuses (beyond ~30k points).

As an anecdote, I feel like the amount of colleagues at work asking me for advice re. taking out QF/VA credit cards and how to redeem for reward seats has increased significantly since Covid.

 

[cambriamarsh]

Never said they weren't international members but they are NOT a significant percentage; and not QFF's core demographic.

If based outside Australia (more than just temporarily) you would be better served by making another program your main one, so that you can earn points by ore than just flying.

Unfortunately the alternative in NZ is even worse, effectively point plus pay on everything

 

[levelnine]

My take is that over the next 5-10 years, we'll slowly see true "reward" flights disappear.

Excellent observations. Agree with all of this. As an aside, I've also been surprised by the number of people I've found helping get into churning since COVID-19.

To add to your observations about dynamic pricing, home market dominance is a crucial reason why Air New Zealand, Air Canada and the big three US carriers have all gone down the dynamic pricing route. It's also why Qantas will invariably follow, probably sooner rather than later.

Market dominance reduces the need to offer competitive award pricing on your most in-demand redemptions, namely flights within/to/from your home country. Market dominance is what allows you to sell unlimited miles to partners — there's such voracious demand because you have such a large base of customers trying to get a 'deal'. The only outlet for all those miles is dynamic pricing.

It's why Australia to Europe costs 80K Delta miles in J on partners such as Vietnam Airlines while Australia to the US costs 500K+ Delta miles. Similar with AA: 80K Australia to Europe on partners such as Qatar but a baseline of 450K AA miles between Australia and the US (though AA does discount the Transpac route down to ~100K more frequently than Delta).

 

[Flyfrequently]

Looking at Qantas Hotels just now.
Random check of dates May and June for Melbourne hotels show rates as non refundable and free cancellation "secure with 20% deposit".
Fairer and simpler?

 

[Lynda2475]

Looking at Qantas Hotels just now.
Random check of dates May and June for Melbourne hotels show rates as non refundable and free cancellation "secure with 20% deposit".
Fairer and simpler?

What is wrong with having a choice between booking non-refundable for the lowest price, or a slightly higher rate with free cancellation? Choosing between a deposit or full payment? Allows the consumer to make a choice and is normal for any hotel booking platform.

I often will book a room via QF hotels with free cancellation at the time I buy an airfare, to have a decent room locked in. But then I also monitor hotel sites and other offers from QF hotels; and if something better pops up closer in, book the alternative and cancel the QF one. IME the $ for any deposit or full payment are returned to credit card within 24 hours provided you cancel within the stated window.

 

[Flyfrequently]

What is wrong with having a choice between booking non-refundable for the lowest price, or a slightly higher rate with free cancellation? Choosing between a deposit or full payment? Allows the consumer to make a choice and is normal for any hotel booking platform.

I often will book a room via QF hotels with free cancellation at the time I buy an airfare, to have a decent room locked in. But then I also monitor hotel sites and other offers from QF hotels; and if something better pops up closer in, book the alternative and cancel the QF one. IME the $ for any deposit or full payment are returned to credit card within 24 hours provided you cancel within the stated window.

I use QH often, my point in this instance @Lynda2475 was I had not encountered "secure with a deposit" before in the booking process.
I always book fully refundable unless staying that or the next night, and like your good self, alter my plans according to cost and other factors.

 

[Seat0B]

I use QH often, my point in this instance @Lynda2475 was I had not encountered "secure with a deposit" before in the booking process.
I always book fully refundable unless staying that or the next night, and like your good self, alter my plans according to cost and other factors.

Is the deposit also refundable if you cancel?

 

[elanshin]

Never said they weren't international members but they are NOT a significant percentage; and not QFF's core demographic.

If based outside Australia (more than just temporarily) you would be better served by making another program your main one, so that you can earn points by ore than just flying.

As others have said the points earnt by actually flying are typically far outweighed by other earning methods for most.

Personally I will continue to only redeem points on classic rewards, like others if these disappear entirely then I will switch my points earning activities.

If other people want to use points + pay and receive poor value they can.

I know some people overseas use QFF for Emirates. Getting Skyward points is extremely hard compared to getting QFF points.