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VA have a problem. Could this partly solve it ?

ozfflyer

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Dec 22, 2018
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load factors on VA flights to HKG are apparently awful, even thought trying to give away some seats.

(CX seems to be in similar boat)

VA is trying to coordinate flights into HKG with VS flights to UK.

Regardless, 1/2 empty A330s can not continue forever.

VA has a problem in that it doesn't have daily flight BNE/LAX & MEL/LAX only SYD/LAX (the the daily codeshares with DL)

Look at QF BNE/LAX going from 10/week to daily. Unfortunately, VA haven't got a smaller aircraft that could do BNE/LAX nonstop, BUT they do have A330s that do currently do HKG & perhaps frequency here needs to be reduced.

Maybe VA could go ex BNE & MEL via somewhere with an A330 a few times a week ?

If VA can't do daily BNE & MEL/LAX nonstops, next best thing would be a quick stop somewhere with an A330.

NAN would be obvious choice, but Fijians might give them a hard time re NAN/LAX, but they do have flights SYD/NAN & MEL/NAN that could connect with a VA A330 NAN/LAX.

Fijians probably wouldn't let them pick up any pax in NAN, but surely Fijians would allow pax ex OZ or USA a stopover in NAN ?

VA would need to tweak some 737 timings NAN/BNE & NAN/MEL, although perhaps the A330s could do LAX/BNE & LAX/MEL on days no nonstop flights ?
 

yohy?!

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China slowdown is hitting hard on hkg traffic

VA has had this problem for ages, they are better off retreating the 330s back to domestic or trans Tasman duty, perhaps Bali even

330s can’t do US routes I’m pretty sure so no help there
 

Franky

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China slowdown is hitting hard on hkg traffic

VA has had this problem for ages, they are better off retreating the 330s back to domestic or trans Tasman duty, perhaps Bali even

330s can’t do US routes I’m pretty sure so no help there
Wish the slowdown would have the same effect on the PER-HKG routes, it's like pulling teeth getting award seats on the route.
 

ozfflyer

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China slowdown is hitting hard on hkg traffic

VA has had this problem for ages, they are better off retreating the 330s back to domestic or trans Tasman duty, perhaps Bali even

330s can’t do US routes I’m pretty sure so no help there
FJ do daily SYD/LAX direct via NAN. Hell I can remember 767s doing NAN/LAX & RAR/LAX
 

Himeno

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China slowdown is hitting hard on hkg traffic

VA has had this problem for ages, they are better off retreating the 330s back to domestic or trans Tasman duty, perhaps Bali even

330s can’t do US routes I’m pretty sure so no help there
QF used to use A330-200s on AKL-LAX.
VA's A330s are the longer range -200 model. They can get to the mainland US, with a stop in AKL, NAN, PPT, HNL etc.
 

ozfflyer

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ah forget about AKL. An A330 could fly BNE/AKL/LAX/AKL/MEL with minimal time at AKL, which is probably 90 mins so would service multiple markets. Makes sense. All QF BNE/LAX flights used to be direct via AKL.
 

Himeno

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All QF BNE/LAX flights used to be direct via AKL.
QF used to have 5 flights to LAX (at least after I started paying attention). 2 non stop from SYD, 1 from BNE, and 2 from MEL with 1 via AKL.
 

dajop

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Not looking at this in an unbiased way , but I have wondered if VA might be better off working with SQ to plug a schedule gap on MEL-SIN route, with a 6am departure from MEL and 2pm ish departure from SIN. Depending on timing this could feed same day services to LHR and FRA, and also connect to most of SE Asia plus ICN, HND, KIX, PVG and HKG. Vice versa destinations not as numerous but certainly could allow a sale day connection from PVG, HKG and a number of destinations of SE Asia.
 

mjt57

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Would any of this that you guys are discussing be related to VA7 from BNE being cancelled on Tuesday? It’s now leaving at 1800, I think it is, and it’s arrival into LAX will be 5 hrs after our connecting flight to JFK departs. We made the mistake of booking it with Webjet so we cannot deal directly with the airline itself.

Waiting to see if we can be reorganised onto a flight that’s leaving LAX later.
 

jakeseven7

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Not looking at this in an unbiased way , but I have wondered if VA might be better off working with SQ to plug a schedule gap on MEL-SIN route, with a 6am departure from MEL and 2pm ish departure from SIN. Depending on timing this could feed same day services to LHR and FRA, and also connect to most of SE Asia plus ICN, HND, KIX, PVG and HKG. Vice versa destinations not as numerous but certainly could allow a sale day connection from PVG, HKG and a number of destinations of SE Asia.
A lot of people were surprised when Hong Kong launched over Singapore. But there were rumours at the time that SQ smacked that down very very firmly when it was considered.
 

dajop

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just got this … re HKG CX yields not good

Not surprised. CX is heavily invested in US traffic (up to 15 flights a day), and a combination of improvements on Chinese carriers with more direct flights, China/US tensions reducing demand, and the concerns around Hong Kong's future under increasingly active Beijing, the outlook would have to be challenging for CX, irrespective of what happens on their 10 flights a day to/from Australia.
 

ozfflyer

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Dec 22, 2018
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last week CX had fare BNE/HKG/LAX/HKG/BNE for just over $1k/adult all up & less for kids departing early Jan, with or without stops in HKG. Couldn't do it without stopping in HKG for at least a few nights.
 

ozfflyer

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If CX is under pressure it surely can't be on HKG-MEL service which seems to be constantly full!
aircraft can be full & still lose money. It's all about yield.

for instance, a new airline starts flying A to B. Airline fills first few flights, many totally free (in exchange for good reviews) & media says they must be doing or will do well, as they know nothing about yields, which airline is unlikely to devulge to anyone.

They won't say if it's losing money as then some people might hold off booking or book some other airline. They don't want to say making big profit on a route, as other airlines might then look at that route.
 

Must...Fly!

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The problem is they have no idea what they want to do with the A330s. HKG is clearly not a winner with end-to-end traffic,, though they are trying to make it work tying up with VS - this is surely the last hurrah.

They won't come back to transcon in big numbers either because they want the higher yield a B738 gives them. It's been a huge change in the past 12 months in particular. They've removed PER-MEL Monday night red-eye for example, not even interested in running a 738 on that. Protecting what they can.

Meanwhile, they run what seems to be a largely unsustainable operation between AU & NZ, fighting a battle they almost certainly can not win (or break even...). Sadly VA have problems that go beyond HKG.
 

ozfflyer

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The problem is they have no idea what they want to do with the A330s. HKG is clearly not a winner with end-to-end traffic,, though they are trying to make it work tying up with VS - this is surely the last hurrah.

They won't come back to transcon in big numbers either because they want the higher yield a B738 gives them. It's been a huge change in the past 12 months in particular. They've removed PER-MEL Monday night red-eye for example, not even interested in running a 738 on that. Protecting what they can.

Meanwhile, they run what seems to be a largely unsustainable operation between AU & NZ, fighting a battle they almost certainly can not win (or break even...). Sadly VA have problems that go beyond HKG.
have heard a few business types who fly to USA every month or 2 for work & don't pay personally say they fly QF only because QF fly daily (actually 10/week at present, back to daily from Apr when 3 switch to BNE/SFO) while VA the only other nonstop option is 6 days a week, but 1 of those days, is VA9 BNE/LAX on Sundays at 2215/1720 & no flight Mon. Guess getting to LAX at 1720 Sun means you can be fresh for business Mon am. Similarly on return VA6 midday Sat & no flight Fri.

If VA had a flight ex BNE daily departing at similar times even if an A330 via AKL once or twice a week & same coming home, then they might get some more of that high yielding business type traffic from QF. VA is often cheaper than QF & many corporates are tightening their spending on bus travel. VA could offer quadruple ff pts if you flew on the A330 via AKL to LAX, which might appeal to the points junkies. It might take 3-4 hours flying via AKL, but they could also fill aircraft with BNE/AKL only & AKL/LAX only pax.
 
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Must...Fly!

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They're struggling with the 777s, why throw the A330s in to yet another fight they can not win, and starting at a handicap with a non-direct service?

For VA the aircraft is neither here nor there. They sit on the tarmac for days at a time sometimes, because they don't want to run them at a lower yield/load factor. And that's been true for years and years, I remember working at Perth airport 6 years ago and watching them sit dormant for 36+ hours on a weekend wondering how they were ever going to make money leasing them, as great as they are.

I really don't like being negative, but just saying this has been an ongoing issue for years, and there have been few reasons over the years to think this would change.
 
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have heard a few business types who fly to USA every month or 2 for work & don't pay personally say they fly QF only because QF fly daily (actually 10/week at present, back to daily from Apr when 3 switch to BNE/SFO) while VA the only other nonstop option is 6 days a week, but 1 of those days, is VA9 BNE/LAX on Sundays at 2215/1720 & no flight Mon. Guess getting to LAX at 1720 Sun means you can be fresh for business Mon am. Similarly on return VA6 midday Sat & no flight Fri.
The BNE schedule really doesn't work for a full Monday to Friday week on the US east coast. Your choice is to arrive on Saturday or 9 am Monday, and then you must hang around until Sunday to leave. On QF I could leave BNE on Sunday and arrive back Monday week but on VA I have to leave BNE on Saturday and I don't get back til Tuesday week. It's not ideal for me so I can't imagine that important people would tolerate it either.
 

N860CR

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Nov 30, 2004
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They’d be better off just admitting that the “business airline” for long haul isn’t working. This was all to do with the former CEO wanting to look like a “real” airline and fly to “real” places like HKG.

They’d be better off deploying the airbus on Bali or Phuket and doing bogan shuttles. It’s not glamorous, but there’s probably more money to be made.
 

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