Understanding mileage chart

[ffhound]

Hi everyone and Merry Xmas

I was looking at the Asia Mile redemption chart and have been trying to understand how many miles you need for a return flight from Mel-AMS.

https://www.asiamiles.com/am/en/redeem/charts

The chart is not quite clear as to what the return redemption rate is.For example for a flight of less than 600 miles (Award S) it says economy is 10,000 miles and then there is underneath just 'economy' for 15,000 miles. Is this the return figure?

The distance from Mel to HKG is 4,603 miles and HKG to AMS is 5,759 miles. if I understand things correctly a return economy flight would be 45,000 + 60,000 miles = 105,000. or does one just take the total distance in which case it would be 110,000 miles? Similarly is Business 80,000 + 120,000 = 200,000 or is it 175,000 miles?

Also are you allowed a stopover or two in this chart?

I wish Cathay would make the chart a bit clearer.

Also re the one world chart at the bottom am I correct in my analysis that you can do Business class Mel-AMS for just 160,000 miles all up? If so, that is cheaper than Cathay's own chart?

Thanking you

Peter

 

[Fiches Mouser]

Hi everyone and Merry Xmas

I was looking at the Asia Mile redemption chart and have been trying to understand how many miles you need for a return flight from Mel-AMS.

https://www.asiamiles.com/am/en/redeem/charts

The chart is not quite clear as to what the return redemption rate is.For example for a flight of less than 600 miles (Award S) it says economy is 10,000 miles and then there is underneath just 'economy' for 15,000 miles. Is this the return figure?

The distance from Mel to HKG is 4,603 miles and HKG to AMS is 5,759 miles. if I understand things correctly a return economy flight would be 45,000 + 60,000 miles = 105,000. or does one just take the total distance in which case it would be 110,000 miles? Similarly is Business 80,000 + 120,000 = 200,000 or is it 175,000 miles?

Also are you allowed a stopover or two in this chart?

I wish Cathay would make the chart a bit clearer.

Also re the one world chart at the bottom am I correct in my analysis that you can do Business class Mel-AMS for just 160,000 miles all up? If so, that is cheaper than Cathay's own chart?

Thanking you

Peter

Hi Peter,

I agree – it's not the simplest and it's taken me a while to try and wrap my head around it.

First, this line on the award chart page is relevant, which by my reading is saying that it is the total milage (by adding each sector together) and then whichever zone that then falls into.

If connecting sectors are involved, the sector distances should be added together to determine the total one-way distance and the applicable award zone.

So for MEL-AMS, it'd be 4,603 + 5,759 = 10,362, which falls into Zone F, making it 110,000 (one way) or 175,000 (return) in J. I could be wrong though – that's just my reading of it.

Second, CX/AM essentially gives you a small discount for booking return (or marks up one-ways, depending on how you look at it) so the award chart assumes everything is return unless one way is specified:

Unless indicated otherwise, the awards in the table apply to round-trip flights.

I'm not sure about stopovers. I think I've done a free stopover in HKG in the past, but again, I could be wrong. I may have paid for it.

Finally, I always just do a dummy search if in doubt. You just need an Asia Miles account to do it: https://www.asiamiles.com/amwdsibered/jsp/redeem-flights/asia-miles-flight-award-redemption.jsp

 

[anat0l]

I'm surprised there isn't more information about how to redeem with Asia Miles online! Yes, there are some stand out resources, but even then I had to pick up quite a handful of quirks by myself. So here's my understanding from my trials... and this will be a long post... (Note: all of this was done without an Asia Miles account or logging in)

First, there are two charts on Asia Miles' site (skip the Priority Awards). The first chart (Asia Miles Award Chart or Standard Awards) is used for redemptions involving:

• Only one carrier (any partner)
• Two carriers, one of which must be CX or KA (but not allowed to combine CA, 9W or S7)

The second chart (oneworld Multi-Carrier Awards) is used for redemptions involving:

• Two oneworld carriers (does not include CX or KA)
• Three or more oneworld carriers, one of which must be CX or KA

The Standard Awards are the only way to make one-way redemptions. Note that if you select a one-way Standard Award, certain carriers cannot be included on the award:

• AY, IB, JL, LA, RJ, S7

The following carriers are Asia Miles partners allowed with Standard Awards, but not permitted on oneworld Multi-Carrier Awards (because, of course, they aren't part of the alliance):

• EI, CA, NZ (between AKL and HKG only), AS, PG, GF, 9W, BI

The cost of an Asia Miles Standard Award is based on the distance between origin and destination, not necessarily the total distance travelled altogether. This basically means that when you are costing up a return award, you need to look up the one-way (outbound or inbound) distance:

1. Note your origin and destination.
2. Calculate the routing distance (not the direct great circle) between the two (e.g. use Great Circle Mapper). For return bookings, in case your routings outbound and inbound are different lengths, select the routing which yields the larger distance.
3. Use this distance to establish which zone you are in the chart.

As far as I can see, there's no guidance given as to what gets called the "destination"; I'm basically assuming it's the farthest point in your itinerary before turning around, or you get the idea. Not that I think that changing the definition of a destination can be necessarily gamed, but just saying.

Stopovers, Open Jaws and Transits

I got these pointers from Points Hacks, but they are buried in the Asia Miles T&Cs as well. As usual, a stopover means more than 24 hours between previous arrival and next departure; a transit is the same except within 24 hours; an open jaw means departing and arrival cities are different (en route), or the cities at the origin or destination ends are different.

• Asia Miles Standard Awards
  • 2 en route stopovers are allowed per return itinerary. One stopover is allowed for a one-way itinerary.
  • Only 2 transits are allowed per journey of an itinerary (return itineraries comprise of two journeys - outbound and inbound). Transits must use the next available flight within 24 hours, otherwise it will be counted as a stopover.
  • One open jaw is allowed per return itinerary.
  • No stopovers or open jaws are allowed with CA or IB.
• oneworld Multi-Carrier Awards
  • 5 stopovers are allowed per itinerary.
  • 2 transits are allowed per itinerary.
  • 2 open jaws are allowed per itinerary.

Examples from my searching

In each case, the destination is underlined. I used the Asia Miles calculator to get these results.

1. BNE [QF] HKG [CX] SIN [QF] BNE, Business Class

Calculator gives cost 120,000 Asia Miles.

Rationale:

• Between BNE-HKG and HKG-SIN-BNE, the inbound will be the larger routing.
• HKG-SIN-BNE: GCM distance is 5893 mi
• This falls in zone D

2. BNE [QF] HKG [MH] KUL [MH] SIN [QF] BNE, Business Class

Calculator gives cost 95,000 Asia Miles.

Rationale:

• This itinerary uses two carriers, neither of which is CX or KA. So need to use the oneworld Multi-Carrier chart.
• Total GCM distance is 9881 mi.
• This falls in zone 07

This is weird - as you can see, the only difference compared to case 1 is that CX or KA is not part of the award. In fact, you could include CX or KA and still price it the same as case 2, but then you need to make sure there are two other carriers.

3. BNE [CX] HKG [CX] TPE [CX] HKG [CX] BNE, Business Class

Calculator gives cost 80,000 Asia Miles.

Rationale:

• Routing is same outbound and inbound.
• BNE-HKG-TPE: GCM distance is 4807 mi
• This falls in zone C

4. SYD [CX] HKG [CX] HND [QF] SYD, Business Class

Calculator gives cost 120,000 Asia Miles.

Rationale:

• Routing is longer on outbound.
• SYD-HKG-HND: GCM distance is 6386 mi
• This falls in zone D

5. BNE [CX] HKG [AY] HEL [AY] HKG [CX] BNE, Business Class

Calculator gives cost 145,000 Asia Miles.

Rationale:

• Routing is same both ways.
• BNE-HKG-HEL: GCM distance is 9165 mi
• This falls in zone E

Note that just by changing the carrier on one or both of the BNE/HKG sectors to QF, the award type changes from a Standard Award to a oneworld Multi-Carrier Award. The resulting costing will be 5000 Asia Miles less.

6. BNE [CX] HKG [AY] HEL, one-way Business Class

Not permitted, AY cannot be included on a one-way Standard Award.

7. BNE [QF] SIN [MH] KUL, one-way Business Class

Not permitted, on a one-way Standard Award, where there are two carriers, one of them must be CX or KA.

8. SYD [QF] BNE [CX] HKG [JL] KIX, one-way Business Class

Not permitted, JL can't be included on a one-way Standard Award, plus Standard Awards can't have more than two carriers on them, even if one of them is CX or KA. Note that for the purposes of counting carriers, CX and KA count as separate carriers.

9. ADL [QF] PER [MH] KUL [CX] HKG, one-way Business Class

Not permitted, (one-way) Standard Awards can't have more than two carriers on them, even if one of them is CX or KA. (An award with three or more carriers on them where one of them is CX or KA, representing a return itinerary, would be a oneworld Multi-Carrier Award).

10. SYD [BA] SIN [MH] KUL [MH] MEL [QF] SYD, Business Class

Calculator gives cost 85,000 Asia Miles.

Rationale:

• Three carriers, so use oneworld Multi-Carrier Award
• Total GCM distance is 8449 mi
• This falls in zone 06

...but this one is odd, because it breaks the rule that when three or more carriers are part of a oneworld Multi-Carrier Award, one of them must be CX or KA. Not sure if its a case of a bug in the calculator but this won't ticket if you try it out on the real deal engine (or calling the call centre).