Some newbie upgrade questions...

[adelaidefc]

Hi guys,

Lurked on this forum for quite some time, but it's the first occasion I haven't easily been able to find answers to the questions I'm after.

Around April next year I'm looking at taking my mum to Europe given that's she's originally from Italy, but illness and lack of funds has meant she hasn't been able to go back there.

I'm lucky enough to have flown J on Qantas through work and would love for mum to have the same experience, even if it's only on the way over. Our absolute max budget for return flights is probably around $4-4.5k each.

Unfortunately I lose my SG status in October this year, so will almost certainly drop back to PS, making an upgrade to J even less likely (as per a very helpful post the forum won't yet let me link to )

Given the long odds, my idea was to buy full Y tickets on a flight with as few WP upgraders as possible, then requesting a J upgrade with the Y+ fall back option.

So I have a few questions:
- Firstly a simple one, can I use my own points to upgrade my mother if the booking is shared, or do I have to first transfer the points to her account?

- Secondly, I know I'd have the best chance if I booked a full Y fare, but can't seem to find them on the Qantas website. The only fare is Flexi-saver, which as far as I can tell is still classed as discount economy - and therefore also costing 96k points for a J upgrade as opposed to 60k for full Y. Is that correct, and how do I get Y?
- If I could get a full Y fare, how likely would it be that I could miss out totally on any upgrade, even to Y+? So then...
- Would I be better off just ponying up for the cheapest Y+ on the way over, and having a random crack at J from there? I could then pick up a S fare or equiv and come in around max budget.

- And finally, our schedule is fairly flexible, so is there any way at all this far out to tell what flights in early April are least likely to be busy or have upgradeable seats? I've seen someone mention checking out award availability for the time is a good bet but there are already no J or Y+ award seats for the days we were thinking (particularly the week of 4-11 April).

Apologies for so many questions, but this will be a huge investment for us so I'm looking into every possible option for the best trip. For me, the trip is just as fun as the destination and I figure I may as well use my points to give mum a once in a lifetime flight if I can.

Massively appreciative on any help you can give. Cheers

 

[cove]

How many points do you have?
You can use them on upgrades or obtain a complete flight for your mother in the class you are after depending on the points you have.

 

[adelaidefc]

How many points do you have?
You can use them on upgrades or obtain a complete flight for your mother in the class you are after depending on the points you have.

Only about 140k at the moment unfortunately. That could be a reasonable way to do it but there don't seem to be any J award flights any time in April at all (737k points required for AnySeat rewards :shock.

 

[cove]

I looked in April for SIN-FRA return in April and you could have one go out PE and back in J for 147,000 points or 126,000 in PE both ways.
Getting to Singapore is about 5 hours so you could pay for an economy cheapie then head off to Frankfurt in PE after deciding whether you stop in Singapore for a travel break.
Forget Any Seat when the points look like a telephone number!
Frankfurt would be a reasonable place to start a European holiday trip.

 

[docjames]

I wonder with a budget of $4-4.5k you might be better going for Y+ (on sale) ad then try and upgrade from there as the fallback is Y+.


Buying a full Y fare is far from certain to get an upgrade. Finding a longhaul flight to the EU without a heap of pax with higher status (CL/WP/SG will all be ahead of you) is unlikely.


Also, dont discount flying another carrier if you get more "bang for your buck" seat/class wise. Thai and MH often have good sale fares that can be attractive. Also the Middle East carriers can be an economic option, plus the advantage that you may be able to one-stop (DXB or AUH) rather than multi (SIN-FRA- or SIN-LHR-) which will be attractive if your mum is likely to struggle with the long haul. Also consider whether you take your budget and put your mum in J, you in Y (eg. there were MH J class sale fares @ $6k return so add a $2k Y fare = $8k :shock:


Note also that the VA/AUH tie-up starts soon so sale fares may be a possibility for launch so keep your eyes open for those too given the time of travel you are proposing.

 

[NM]

If it was me, I would be purchasing a discounted Premium Economy fare (T or R class) and waitlisting for an upgrade to J. At least Y+ is comfortable and you are assured of at least that level of comfort/service.

 

[cove]

Thinking NM style gets you the discounted Y+ and so you are ahead of all Y passengers for a points upgrade.Now that can work out pretty well
The other way is to buy one Y+ in discount class and use points for the other ticket (mum).That way you earn the status credits and points and stay inside your budget.

 

[NM]

Thinking NM style gets you the discounted Y+ and so you are ahead of all Y passengers for a points upgrade.

Are you certain that Y+ passengers get the first bite of the upgrade cherry? I am not suggesting this is incorrect, just that I have not seen any evidence to support the position. I accept that it makes sense in that it may ten free up Y+ seats for Y passengers to upgrade into. But its also possible that upgrades to J are all lumped into the same bucket and prioritised as a single group. Again, I make it clear that I have no inside knowledge of the specifics or the logic applied so do not know if it works they way you suggest or not.

My policy when it comes to purchasing tickets and upgrades (when using Qantas FF program) is to be satisfied with the cabin for which you have purchased the fare and if the upgrade comes through then its a bonus. If you want to sit in a particular cabin, then purchase a ticket for that cabin.

 

[cove]

Not being a person working in Qf yield management means I cannot be certain about the real method used.
I have had success with my last 4 shots by upgrading one class rather than two namely y+ to j and J to F.
In each case the cabin ended up full so I have assumed the procedure to be highest class gets upgraded first.In each case the family member had no special status and that is all I know. Now that could just be dumb luck.
I have not been able to get Y+ to First for a family member even when there was a seat going begging.
I totally agree NM that you book the minimum that you are ok with then try for the upgrade on points.

 

[adelaidefc]

Guys thanks so much for the options, it's brilliant. I've pretty much spent the whole day browsing and running through the permutations.

The advice not be completely limited to QF is a good one. I definitely had the blinders on. For example I can go Bangkok->Mainland europe (even with an open jaw flight) on Qatar airlines business class for about $3.5k. The same from SIN is about $4k. Then I can book a couple of award Y+ to get to SIN or BKK, then a cheap flight home Asia->Aus and I'm under budget with all but one leg in at least Y+, most in J.

Or if I want to stick with Oneworld and earn some points...
A Qantas/Finnair mixed class: Economy to Asia (that I could try to upgrade to Y+), then Business on Finnair to anywhere Europe via Helsinki for around $4900 with BestFlights.
Or I could sort out my own trip, with the Asia->Europe leg in Finnair J about $3.5k same as Qatar airlines.

Royal Jordanian is just over $3k for J class BKK to Rome. So there's plenty of options.
Has anyone had any experience with Finnair/Royal Jordanian or Qatar? I know Qatar gets brilliant reviews, so may well be worth forgoing the extra FF points & status points.

 

[serfty]

Are you certain that Y+ passengers get the first bite of the upgrade cherry? I am not suggesting this is incorrect, just that I have not seen any evidence to support the position. ...

Since the actual methodology employed by Qantas is CIC other than "by Status" there is no published evidence.

Anecdotal evidence does indicate that Fare class is used as a tie-breaker.

If this is the case, then between WP's, those booked on L class tickets would be upgraded to business class before those on V class; also, those booked in W class would get the nod before those on B or H class.

 

[taswegian77]

I have not been able to get Y+ to First for a family member even when there was a seat going begging.

Is there such an u[grade from Y+ to F. I thought all F upgrades come from J only???

 

[serfty]

Is there such an u[grade from Y+ to F. I thought all F upgrades come from J only???

That is correct. I think it's a mistype by cove, or perhaps they are hoping.

QFF Point upgrades are only available for:

• Y->W
• Y->J
• W->J
• J->F

 

[cove]

Yes it is J to F only even when there are empty seats in F.
You cannot go Y+ to F ever it seems.

 

[adelaidefc]

Got another quick question...

I went into Qantas travel to ask a few questions, and apparently it's impossible even for them to book mixed class return trips? i.e. SYD-LHR in Y+, LHR-SYD in economy

Is this really the case? The person at the travel centre didn't seem particularly cluey, so I'm not 100% sure.

 

[NM]

Yes it is J to F only even when there are empty seats in F.
You cannot go Y+ to F ever it seems.

If it was a 4-class aircraft operating a J, Y+, Y sale, its possible for a Y or Y+ to F seat upgrade, but J service of course.