"oneworld" award (132.4K/249.6K/318K/455K) Planning - The Definitive Thread

[squid01]

Only to the day/date from memory. Must be same route/flight.

The whole changes allowed after first flight is confusing me, and reading that section in the T&C’s I just get confused by the wording.

Looking to book soon and changes are an important factor as we will be away for 9 months and have some very fluid plans/dates.

I have attached the two parts of the terms and conditions I think are applicable for changes made after the first leg has been flown.

For 14.7.6, I get tripped up when they say ‘do not include a partner airline that requires a ticket to be reissued for the change.’
Does this mean you can only make changes to QF flights? Or does a ticket not have to be ‘reissued’ if you are only changing the date of travel (and not flight number)?

Then there is section 14.7.8. This states you can’t change anything except the date I believe?

Could someone please help me interpret the terms and conditions. I just want something written by Qantas to fall back on if I have any issues making a change to subsequent segments after I have flown the first segment. The rules around changes may also impact which flights I pick as I may want to pick the flights which tend to have more availability so I have more options if I need to change and I can only change flight number etc?

Thanks!

 

[nickfromeastryde]

Hi panel,
In your experience, does being able to see award flights on AA site mean that potentially I should be able to ring Qantas and get them booked. Said flights not showing up on QAN

 

[DC3]

Hi panel,
In your experience, does being able to see award flights on AA site mean that potentially I should be able to ring Qantas and get them booked. Said flights not showing up on QAN

Not necessarily. Airlines may not release award availability to all/any other airlines at times.

When checking on AA, you need milesaaver availability. Also, AS and WS flights are not eligible for booking as part of a oneworld award if that’s what you are after.

Are you looking at any particular route?

 

[pyffii]

Hi panel,
In your experience, does being able to see award flights on AA site mean that potentially I should be able to ring Qantas and get them booked. Said flights not showing up on QAN
[/QUOTE
AA is renowned to have phantom availability so the short answer is unfortunately no so no point ringing Qantas !!

 

[nickfromeastryde]

Thanks DC3, I did think same but can see plenty of availability on AA metal MIA-LAX-SYD in early January

Mrs Nick and I already have an award flight booked AKL-BOG-AKL coming home to Syd 29/12 but ideally would like to stay a week longer so toying around with turning into a Oneworld Award, potentially I could then sneak a couple more flights onto the ticket for later in 2020. The extra week being the main motivation

 

[nickfromeastryde]

Hi Pyffii,
I suspect you are right, there does seem to be a lot of options at a time when you wouldn't expect to see much

 

[DC3]

Thanks DC3, I did think same but can see plenty of availability on AA metal MIA-LAX-SYD in early January ...

No milesaaver availability showing on AA.com for LAX-SYD in early January, although there's plenty MIA-LAX from the second week.

 

[Kangol]

No milesaaver availability showing on AA.com for LAX-SYD in early January, although there's plenty MIA-LAX from the second week.

Generally you should search on the QFF site for availability.
On the odd occasion it may be possible to book an AAward that is not showing on the QFF site, that may or may not have milesAAver availability.
Never hurts to ring and ask.

 

[DC3]

Generally you should search on the QFF site for availability.
On the odd occasion it may be possible to book an AAward that is not showing on the QFF site, that may or may not have milesAAver availability.
Never hurts to ring and ask.

Yes, definitely something to be aware of. However, I like to know the answer before I phone QF to book (or check the QF site). I have been told by the QF Call Centre that there's no availability. However, after rewording and repeating the AA flight numbers and route and timings, over again, surprise, "Oh. Yes, there are seats" (no idea what they are looking at sometimes?).

So, now I always check on AA before phoning QF.

I am fortunate in not finding AA phantom award availability as yet, however I'm aware that it exits. I have experienced it the other way around, however. Available on the AA website and also BA, but not QF. All very frustrating of course.

Edit: We all have different ways of doing things. O/T, but The AA site is also good for getting an idea of upcoming award availability on particular AA routes

 

[vetrade]

AA might frequently show up availability on a particular route but often when you click through to see the details you find there are no seats on direct flights and the award seats actually involve a ridiculous connection e.g. if you want to go MIA - LAX the only availability offered may be MIA - ORD - LAX or some other inconvenient option. So before you ring up QF telling them you have seen availability on the AA website, make sure you check through the details, including the class of travel.

 

[adenda]

I hope this has worked out for you.

This happened to me yesterday as well, after I made a small change to my 280k itinerary which of course required the whole ticket to be reissued and threw the whole itinerary ‘on hold’.

Maybe my experience can be useful to others as a datapoint. Please skip if too long.

Despite basically begging in the call when I made the change, when I called back an hour later, and via text, they would not ticket it any faster than the standard 24 hours queue.

Later in the day my MEL-HKG-FRA flights dropped off, cancelled by Cathay Pacific after what would have been about eight hours of ‘on hold’ time.

After 90 minutes on the phone with the call centre (South Africa) they managed to ‘force book’ MEL-LHR on QF9 in a revenue fare bucket with a subsequent connection to Frankfurt on BA. Nothing like this was offered for the first 30 mins or so, with them basically telling me nothing could be done initially.

The itinerary changed again about 10 mins after I hung up, to QF9 on a date a week earlier than I had agreed, back in a U award fare bucket. I don’t really know why this happened.

Another long call ensued whereby a consultant (South Africa) ‘force booked’ availability on QF9 for the right day again as a business class award but insisted I would need to pay the much higher taxes/surcharges now that QF and BA segments were involved, and couldn’t budge on this point.

Luckily I’d researched a back up option for different dates and routings where CX flights were still available as awards, which I changed to instead during the call. I didn’t want to pay hundreds extra in fees for what I see as Qantas’ fault. I was also presented with the option of waiting three days from an answer from a ‘Oneworld desk’ as to whether they could reinstate my original flights but I wasn’t optimistic about follow through on this and so just switched to my alternative instead.

Surprisingly, the consultant still insisted that they couldn’t ticket the itinerary immediately!

I gave it an hour then called back, where finally the helpful consultant was willing to ticket it - it took them over 60 mins of dealing with me over the phone to get it all done still though. I got the strong impression from the number of steps the consultant did that the ticket was never going to issue if I had just left things be.

Even though I was considering adding some further flights and changes down the track, I will definitely not be tweaking this ticket again now and will just live with what I’ve got.

The biggest lessons I got are to do whatever you need to in order to get the itinerary ticketed ASAP, and that there is more that the operators can do to open up availability than they might reveal at first.. so keep pushing!

Didn't expect to be posting about my experience again - but I couldn't agree with you more!

Sorry for the length but the lessons are the same:

Had my business class OWA booked, ticketed, finalised a few months ago so was sitting back relaxing - comfortable in the knowledge that my (very) late night text messaging sessions with Qantas were finally over. How wrong I was!
Received a text message from Qantas a couple of weeks ago advising that one our flights had changed and I needed to contact them ASAP. So back on the phone - fortunately got a call back that didn't hang up on me - and got the relatively minor change sorted. Was told I'd receive an updated eticket email in a couple of hours. Naively I accepted this and went to bed. Next morning checked email - no updated eticket. Checked booking on QF website via Manage Your Booking - WTF! - one of our flights had disappeared from our itnerary.
As others have experienced, QF was too slow in ticketing the booking so the airline (MH) cancelled the booking. (Thankfully our 4 sectors with QR survived the ticketing delay.)
Onto the chat system (via phone app) and was told that only 1 seat available on our original flight despite BA, JAL and AA websites all showing 2 seats available. But I persisted - thanks to advice from this forum - and eventually they magically found the 2 seats that everyone else said was there. They admitted that slow ticketing was the cause of the problem - and I leveraged that to the max - so they may have managed to have another seat released but I'm suspicious because of previous experience that they can search for availability and then they can REALLY search for availability. No idea how it actually works but that's certainly what it seems like.

So lessons are:

1. ANY change to an itinerary will require re-ticketing of the entire itinerary
2. If left to itself QF re-ticketing may not happen for 24-48 hours
3. Some airlines (MH and I believe QR) will release booked seats if not ticketed within their own deadlines
4. So, INSIST on QF re-ticketing as soon as possible - quote my and other's prior experience with lost bookings if necessary. (QF call centre staff must be aware of this given how many seem to have experienced it)

Thankfully we can share and learn from these experiences via this forum - I certainly have!

 

[DC3]

.... Was told I'd receive an updated eticket email in a couple of hours. Naively I accepted this and went to bed ...

Good that it all worked out in the end, but very frustrating.

I think that the message for everyone is that complacency can lose seats, despite Call Centre assurances.

 

[adenda]

Good that it all worked out in the end, but very frustrating.

I think that the message for everyone is that complacency can lose seats, despite Call Centre assurances.

Yes - and the message for me in particular is that if one of your carriers decides to change something tardy re-ticketing can put your whole itinerary at risk!

What really frustrates me is that - like others - I have experienced call centre staff that have absolutely no idea (such as suggesting I sort out my lost MH sector by contacting MH!) to outright legends who grasp the situation, commit to resolving it and do so. Fortunately these people do exist!

 

[Oubline]

Yes - and the message for me in particular is that if one of your carriers decides to change something tardy re-ticketing can put your whole itinerary at risk!

What really frustrates me is that - like others - I have experienced call centre staff that have absolutely no idea (such as suggesting I sort out my lost MH sector by contacting MH!) to outright legends who grasp the situation, commit to resolving it and do so. Fortunately these people do exist!

Oh no! Now I can’t even relax based on not making any changes myself!

Better to know about this than not to though!

 

[Kangol]

To fulfill OWA conditions, we need a third airline, so we chose JL (CX was our only other potential choice as we're usjng QF/AA already)

Did you get an email yesterday from QF about your first flight LAX-NRT changing to LAX-HND? This is assuming the system can see you are booked LAX-SYD and are moving you to accommodate for the impending HND-SYD change.

I did for a JL flight to the US, which is in line with the "Reservation acceptance date" / "Sales start date" (about 15 mins off):

JAL Group - PRESS RELEASES - Japan Airlines Announces Major International Network Expansion Plan at Tokyo`s Metropolitan Airports in 2020

This is JAL's (Japan Airlines) Press Release information Website. you can view corporate information, safety/flight Information, and CSR Information,etc.

press.jal.co.jp

I would proactively call QF to check about the first LAX-HND leg and hope they can hold a seat for you. Your saving grace is that the LAX-HND is a new flight that's only been available for a day (although it doesn't help that bloggers are advertising this now - but this sort of thing is not new anyway), the existing LAX-NRT has the same flight number and at approximately the same time so general demand for the HND flight might be limited right now.

Worse comes to worse, QF are responsible for ensuring you get to your destination because they are the ticketing carrier. They could either "force" JL to put you on both legs via HND, or if you have no other changes to make (and you don't mind going nonstop LAX-SYD), push them for that. I doubt it would get to that though.

Keep us posted.

 

[exceladdict]

Update on the cancellations. One of the cancelled itineraries has had points credited but no refund to card (yet) - 12 days from request to cancel.

 

[flychrisfly]

The whole changes allowed after first flight is confusing me, and reading that section in the T&C’s I just get confused by the wording.

Looking to book soon and changes are an important factor as we will be away for 9 months and have some very fluid plans/dates.

I have attached the two parts of the terms and conditions I think are applicable for changes made after the first leg has been flown.

For 14.7.6, I get tripped up when they say ‘do not include a partner airline that requires a ticket to be reissued for the change.’
Does this mean you can only make changes to QF flights? Or does a ticket not have to be ‘reissued’ if you are only changing the date of travel (and not flight number)?

Then there is section 14.7.8. This states you can’t change anything except the date I believe?

Could someone please help me interpret the terms and conditions. I just want something written by Qantas to fall back on if I have any issues making a change to subsequent segments after I have flown the first segment. The rules around changes may also impact which flights I pick as I may want to pick the flights which tend to have more availability so I have more options if I need to change and I can only change flight number etc?

Thanks!


View attachment 197768View attachment 197769

My interpretation is that 14.7.8 says you can change anything up to 24 hours before your first flight. 14.7.6 says: before an individual flight you can change only the date or flight number (and nothing else) if the airline allows it, that is, does not require a ticket reissue. Qantas is unlikely to know all the conditions of all their partners for when they will/will not require a reissue.

Even taking into account the above restrictions, changes are only possible if there is still award inventory available on that route/class/airline/date. Travelling on a Oneworld Award ticket with any expectation of flexibility is asking to be disappointed.

 

[flychrisfly]

My interpretation is that 14.7.8 says you can change anything up to 24 hours before your first flight. 14.7.6 says: before an individual flight you can change only the date or flight number (and nothing else) if the airline allows it, that is, does not require a ticket reissue. Qantas is unlikely to know all the conditions of all their partners for when they will/will not require a reissue.

Even taking into account the above restrictions, changes are only possible if there is still award inventory available on that route/class/airline/date. Travelling on a Oneworld Award ticket with any expectation of flexibility is asking to be disappointed.

BTW, I've had ticket reissues when BA changed nothing except the arrive time of a flight by 10 minutes, so...

 

[jeza]

BTW, I've had ticket reissues when BA changed nothing except the arrive time of a flight by 10 minutes, so...

There were quite a few minor timing changes to mine made in Dec 18 & Jan of this year. Each one resulted in a new 081 number.

 

[squid01]

My interpretation is that 14.7.8 says you can change anything up to 24 hours before your first flight. 14.7.6 says: before an individual flight you can change only the date or flight number (and nothing else) if the airline allows it, that is, does not require a ticket reissue. Qantas is unlikely to know all the conditions of all their partners for when they will/will not require a reissue.

Even taking into account the above restrictions, changes are only possible if there is still award inventory available on that route/class/airline/date. Travelling on a Oneworld Award ticket with any expectation of flexibility is asking to be disappointed.

Thanks for the insight.

Just confused as dotted through this thread people mention being able to change after the first leg has been flown. But when I drilled into the T&C's it confused me. The ticket reissuing thing is what has me stumped. I don't really know what would warrant a ticket to be 're-issued'. Surely changing dates etc would cause that? (I am new to this so not sure).
Your story on the BA change worries me, but maybe if it were a date change on exact same flight number and time then maybe a reissue wouldnt be required?

I understand about not expecting the availability to be there if we do want to change, but the option if its there would be nice. We will be away for around 9 months and our plans are very fluid.

Anyone else have any anecdotal evidence on making changes after the first leg has been flown?

Thanks