Census 2016 - Travel Overseas and avoid?

[moa999]

Census 2016

Woops.
Just did the census tonight -- day early...
Went through fine (and completed in about 4min)

Much easier when you are living by yourself, haven't moved in 5yrs and haven't been employed in the last week..

 

[TheRealTMA]

Woops.
Just did the census tonight -- day early...
Went through fine (and completed in about 4min)

Much easier when you are living by yourself, haven't moved in 5yrs and haven't been employed in the last week..

Thinking of using the Nick Xenophlon argument and not including names... Census 2016: Nick Xenophon to withhold name over privacy concerns - ABC News (Australian Broadcasting Corporation)

 

[Pushka]

The totally off-topic thread

Why the census asks for our small pty ltd business name baffles me. They didnt get it. It has no relevance whatsoever for their stated purpose.

 

[anat0l]

Re: The totally off-topic thread

Why the census asks for our small pty ltd business name baffles me. They didnt get it. It has no relevance whatsoever for their stated purpose.

It probably has a purpose, depending on how that data is used (or sold off). Any data people can get might be of use somewhere. Connecting it to names just makes it a lot easier to cross-profile.

 

[medhead]

Re: The totally off-topic thread

Why the census asks for our small pty ltd business name baffles me. They didnt get it. It has no relevance whatsoever for their stated purpose.

I guess they want stats on the number of business owners, and ask for the name to check you're not making cough up. But this, along with the name thing feels a hell of a lot like big brother. No surprise this is coming from the metatdata mob. Should've just done the Australia card and got it over with.

 

[Pushka]

The totally off-topic thread

It probably has a purpose, depending on how that data is used (or sold off). Any data people can get might be of use somewhere. Connecting it to names just makes it a lot easier to cross-profile.

Well, as a family company the ABS doesn't need to know. The ATO and ASIC have all the required statutory info for regulatory purposes. And thats the end of it. Its purpose is for estimating future demographic needs for the country and it doesn't need to know names.

 

[kpc]

Re: The totally off-topic thread

I did the census tonight...took about 5 minutes....full of typos etc but who cares I refused to disclose my total income!

 

[Hvr]

Re: The totally off-topic thread

I did the census tonight...took about 5 minutes....full of typos etc but who cares I refused to disclose my total income!

That doesn't surprise me, I've heard that people in your line of work didn't even tell the ATO their true income. And the writing skills confirm the stereotype.

 

[cove]

Re: The totally off-topic thread

I was surprised with the census being so general. I couldn't see the problem others had with putting names on the document. It took about 10 minutes and no issues.
The Marriott Marquis in New York has really good high speed internet.
Tonight we have tickets to Hamilton and the pricing has dropped from $2,000 a ticket a month ago.
We need to see Adele back in Los Angeles as she is at Staples Center.

 

[RooFlyer]

Re: The totally off-topic thread

Census day - as a family historian, I say hooray!

One of the most ludicrous things is the spectacle of those saying that they won't write their names and addresses in for 'privacy' reasons. I'm guessing most of those also do facebook and use Google . Senator Xenophon Greens Senator Ludlum and step forward. Why am I not surprised? Edit: I see Senator Hanson Young is another one. What more do you need to know about this group of twits?

Names and addresses have always been collected in the census - since the 1840s in Tasmania, similar in other colonies. The census forms have been digitally key-punched for decades; digitised name data has been separately retained for 18 months previously, I think 3 years this time. So, honestly, what's the big deal this time? Do people really think the gov'mint is out to get them?

Those who are worried about 'what the government is going to do with my information - or the system might be hacked' must find it really hard to function in today's society. The census, with all its data protections, should be the least of their worries.

Not only am I not concerned about anything the census asks, like ~60% of the population, I will be marking the box asking that my form be retained for 100 years, and then be available publically.

 

[Pushka]

The totally off-topic thread

I was surprised with the census being so general. I couldn't see the problem others had with putting names on the document. It took about 10 minutes and no issues.
The Marriott Marquis in New York has really good high speed internet.
Tonight we have tickets to Hamilton and the pricing has dropped from $2,000 a ticket a month ago.
We need to see Adele back in Los Angeles as she is at Staples Center.

Cove - aren't you overseas? Did you say you were? If you did then you dont get all the questions. But if you said you were home and aren't, well, another story. Did you put the name of your company for instance?

Privacy is interesting. The ABC is a data collection agency. It doesn't need names to do that. As an historian I can see why people might be interested in 'individualising' the data. As an individual I dont.

 

[RooFlyer]

Re: The totally off-topic thread

Senator Lambie is another 'no name' . Again, who wants to be in the same group as her?

Interestingly, anti government, anti big brother Liberal Democrat Senator Leyonhjelm IS supporting the census.

 

[medhead]

Re: The totally off-topic thread

I was surprised with the census being so general. I couldn't see the problem others had with putting names on the document. It took about 10 minutes and no issues.
The Marriott Marquis in New York has really good high speed internet.
Tonight we have tickets to Hamilton and the pricing has dropped from $2,000 a ticket a month ago.
We need to see Adele back in Los Angeles as she is at Staples Center.

What data? Like your income? name of your business. etc.

Census day - as a family historian, I say hooray!

One of the most ludicrous things is the spectacle of those saying that they won't write their names and addresses in for 'privacy' reasons. I'm guessing most of those also do facebook and use Google . Senator Xenophon Greens Senator Ludlum and step forward. Why am I not surprised? Edit: I see Senator Hanson Young is another one. What more do you need to know about this group of twits?

Names and addresses have always been collected in the census - since the 1840s in Tasmania, similar in other colonies. The census forms have been digitally key-punched for decades; digitised name data has been separately retained for 18 months previously, I think 3 years this time. So, honestly, what's the big deal this time? Do people really think the gov'mint is out to get them?

Those who are worried about 'what the government is going to do with my information - or the system might be hacked' must find it really hard to function in today's society. The census, with all its data protections, should be the least of their worries.

Not only am I not concerned about anything the census asks, like ~60% of the population, I will be marking the box asking that my form be retained for 100 years, and then be available publically.

Actually the connection to the name is going to be held for 4 years for the first time. Last time it was 18 months, and before that not held for long at all. We are being asked to enter the information electronically for the first time, providing the direct digital link.

To suggest this is anything like facebook is disingenuous at best. I sure as hell don't open my facebook to the world. I even lock down certain posts to select groups. I don't put up my income, the names and ages of my children, the streets they cross to get to school, the name of my business, the name of my employer, my full educational history, property ownership details, house address. Basically a whole heap of information that can be used to steal my identity in a hackable, open to the internet electronic system. Data that is also not required for demographic or statistical purposes.

Then there are the datamatching law enforcement possibilities, again NOT statistical purposes. But those law enforcement Act will certainly trump the ABS Act.

Seeing as this is not a problem, why don't you start by telling us your name, income, address, employer, DoB, mothers maiden name, first car you owned, first school you attended. I promise to destroy the information in 4 years.

 

[RooFlyer]

Re: The totally off-topic thread

<snip>
Actually the connection to the name is going to be held for 4 years for the first time. Last time it was 18 months, and before that not held for long at all. We are being asked to enter the information electronically for the first time, providing the direct digital link.

To suggest this is anything like facebook is disingenuous at best. I sure as hell don't open my facebook to the world. I even lock down certain posts to select groups. I don't put up my income, the names and ages of my children, the streets they cross to get to school, the name of my business, the name of my employer, my full educational history, property ownership details, house address. Basically a whole heap of information that can be used to steal my identity in a hackable, open to the internet electronic system. Data that is also not required for demographic or statistical purposes.

Then there are the datamatching law enforcement possibilities, again NOT statistical purposes. But those law enforcement Act will certainly trump the ABS Act.

Seeing as this is not a problem, why don't you start by telling us your name, income, address, employer, DoB, mothers maiden name, first car you owned, first school you attended. I promise to destroy the information in 4 years.

I don't want the information destroyed! Like I said, ALL my data will be kept, and be publically available in 100 years!! Hang around, and all will be revealed.

(By the way, your name is noted when you vote too. Do you have a problem with that? Do you refuse to vote for that reason? The name crossing-off is not used in the voting process, but for law enforcement too).

If anyone does do facebook or uses Google but don't want to do the name thing in the census, apparently they believe an American corporation dedicated to (and whose profits rely on) sharing information and details as widely as possible, will keep their 'locked down' info private, uncollected, un-aggregated etc, as opposed to an organisation like the ABS. Good luck with that! A strange view of the real world.

And what's the actual difference between keeping the names, separately from the data, encrypted, for 4 years vs 18 months? I know government works slowly, but when they are out to get you, I assure you they can get you in 18 months quite easily.

In the meantime, here's something to wear tonight.

 

[Pushka]

The totally off-topic thread

When I vote my name is crossed off a list and that's it. With the census, they have my name, address, business name, income, parentage, number of children I have had - there is no comparison with voting. It isn't a tin hat paranoia, there simply is no justifiable reason to have all this information linked in order to serve the ABS charter.

The ATO and ASIC has all the regulatory data they need for our business. The ABS has moved out if its reason for being.

 

[Cruiser Elite]

Re: The totally off-topic thread

I filled in every question completely and accurately - I have nothing to hide - hopefully this information can be collated and used to benefit all of my fellow Australians.

 

[RooFlyer]

Re: The totally off-topic thread

When I vote my name is crossed off a list and that's it. With the census, they have my name, address, business name, income, parentage, number of children I have had - there is no comparison with voting. It isn't a tin hat paranoia, there simply is no justifiable reason to have all this information linked in order to serve the ABS charter.

The ATO and ASIC has all the regulatory data they need for our business. The ABS has moved out if its reason for being.

One of the reasons for having names is so they can cross reference with death records. Important in determining life span - think of indigenous disadvantage for instance. Many other reasons. its NOT just for law enforcement, as wrongly claimed here.

And in response to public demand, I hereby publish my own family's census form:



So, as you can see, names have been included for a while

And, shock, horror! religion and whether free or not ...

 

[Quickstatus]

Re: The totally off-topic thread

When I vote my name is crossed off a list and that's it. With the census, they have my name, address, business name, income, parentage, number of children I have had - there is no comparison with voting. It isn't a tin hat paranoia, there simply is no justifiable reason to have all this information linked in order to serve the ABS charter.

The ATO and ASIC has all the regulatory data they need for our business. The ABS has moved out if its reason for being.

Yes,

I can see no reason for including identifying data in a census. I have attached the reasons the ABS has given for the collection and extended retention of such data.
Point 3 under names: combining it with other national datasets is probably closer to the truth. Which datasets are they referring to?
As soon as the ABS used "richer" and "more valuable" as compelling reasons I had an immediate flashback to Qantas' use of "enhanced".

ABS assertion that their data has never been hacked as a reason to trust them is highly naive. Do they really think that the data is immune?.

 

[medhead]

Re: The totally off-topic thread

I don't want the information destroyed! Like I said, ALL my data will be kept, and be publically available in 100 years!! Hang around, and all will be revealed.

(By the way, your name is noted when you vote too. Do you have a problem with that? Do you refuse to vote for that reason? The name crossing-off is not used in the voting process, but for law enforcement too).

If anyone does do facebook or uses Google but don't want to do the name thing in the census, apparently they believe an American corporation dedicated to (and whose profits rely on) sharing information and details as widely as possible, will keep their 'locked down' info private, uncollected, un-aggregated etc, as opposed to an organisation like the ABS. Good luck with that! A strange view of the real world.

And what's the actual difference between keeping the names, separately from the data, encrypted, for 4 years vs 18 months? I know government works slowly, but when they are out to get you, I assure you they can get you in 18 months quite easily.

Last I checked your name crossed off the roll isn't linked to your vote. what an completely irrelevant proposition to make.

Facebook doesn't force me to answer questions, and I'm not forced to answer facebook honestly either.

Last time, I filled in a paper form. This time it is electronic. 4 years is an extremely long time for law enforcement. There is clearly no statistical reason for this 4 years nonsense, but there are a large number of law enforcement reasons. Clearly there is an ulterior motive.

As for your clear insult, I'm capable of thinking for myself and making my own decisions. It's not up to you to lecture me on my opinion. Still the fact that you can only resort to tin foil insults serves to highlight the weakness of your attack.

I see you haven't provided your personal information here. Pot kettle black.

One of the reasons for having names is so they can cross reference with death records. Important in determining life span - think of indigenous disadvantage for instance. Many other reasons. its NOT just for law enforcement, as wrongly claimed here.

And in response to public demand, I hereby publish my own family's census form:

So, as you can see, names have been included for a while

And, shock, horror! religion and whether free or not ...

I see the government apologists are out in force. They have these things called birth and death registers that are used to determine life expectancy. Please spare us the regurgitation of propaganda.

The only group that this helps with life expectancy are the original asutralians. They only have a problem with life expectancy for those people because they classified them as fauna until the 1960s. Since you're a big believer in everything they did in the past, would you support reversion to that idiotic way of thinking?

 

[medhead]

Re: The totally off-topic thread

Yes,

I can see no reason for including identifying data in a census. I have attached the reasons the ABS has given for the collection and extended retention of such data.
Point 3 under names: combining it with other national datasets is probably closer to the truth. Which datasets are they referring to?
As soon as the ABS used "richer" and "more valuable" as compelling reasons I had an immediate flashback to Qantas' use of "enhanced".

ABS assertion that their data has never been hacked as a reason to trust them is highly naive. Do they really think that the data is immune?.


View attachment 76516

Indeed, I'm sure china has about 1 million people they can spare to put onto the hacking task. Especially with the way they are firing up about some stupid swimming comment.

As for the reasons given:

• I actually have no problems separating my family members in the abstract context.
• The census covers the entire population by being related to people staying in dwellings on a particular night regardless of names. That's all the stuff in the second set of dotpoints.
• Is this so they know how many personalised coffee cups they need to provide? All of those things depend on demographics, not the number of smiths living in a suburb. Or are they suggesting that they provide different services based on your name? Only John Smith can use this road. now what about the unnamed "other national datasets" that don't provide a service?