Advice needed: award flight cancellation and knock on issues.

[Daver6]

Hi all,

Would like input/advice/my rights on the following scenario.

Last week I booked a One World Award for 2 pax in J with the following:

PER - SYD QF SYD- DOH - HEL QR HEL - BGO AY 12 nights. 11 on the cruise and one in Bergen.
BGO - HEL - LHR AY Managed to score a throne seat on the A330 from HEL to LHR. 7 nights in London
LHR - DOH - MLE QR Scored the Q-suites to DOH.
MLE - CMB UL in Y (90 minutes) then CMB - HKG - PER CX.

Taxes were paid for with my Amex Platinum Charge card (so that's my insurance).

The first sector had us arriving in Bergen on 30th Oct in the late afternoon to board our cruise ship that departs later that evening. The only OW flights into Bergen is the once daily AY flight, hence going via HEL.

Today I received a very unhelpful email from QF telling me to call them due to a flight change. It appears the AY flight from HEL to BGO has been cancelled on that day and they have put me on the flight the following day. Obviously with a cruise to catch, this isn't an option.

I informed the QF agent that arriving 24 hours later isn't an option. After being put on hold for about 10 minutes she said she will contact AY, but I can't see much good coming from that given there is only one flight a day. Her attitude wasn't overly sympathetic and said I could get a points and tax refund for that sector and make my own way there. Given its a 280k J OWA, I presume there will be no points refund (although I could try suggest they refund the number of points based on that sector alone in J).

Our flight from SYD into DOH arrives on the 29th at 11:30pm.

There are flights on SAS from HEL to BGO that would work out. Potentially could (checked award availability and seems ok) take the QR flight from DOH to ARN and then one stop SAS to BGO (which is cheaper than the flight from HEL to BGO).

What are my rights here? I've paid QF to get me to a destination on a date. My dealing is with QF not AY, yet from the one conversation I've had they're pushing the problem to AY.

Is it reasonable/unreasonable to expect QF to sort out flights on SAS to get me to my destination on the agreed date? Or is this something for my travel insurance? If I'm out of luck and my problem, I'd much rather land up in ARN than HEL (only going to HEL for the connecting flight) as its cheaper to pay SAS to get me to BGO. At the very least I'd think I could expect that change without any fees.

I should add, the deposit for the cruise has been paid. Changing dates would also throw other accommodation later in the trip out of whack that has been pre-paid (namely Conrad Maldives on points).

So advice on my rights and what is reasonable would be greatly appreciated here.

Thanks in advance.

Edit: What would be super annoying is if I land up making changes/having to pay for the SAS flight and then the AY flight is re-instated!

 

[JohnM]

What a PITA!

I can't specifically help with any of the details.

Is it possible you could move everything in the early phase 24h back? Talking nicely (aka begging) to QR may be required and reverting to ADL or PER-DOH?

Alternatively, given you're on the Hurtigruten which stops at numerous places along the Norwegian coast, could you join the ship late at the next port beyond Bergen?

No help, but I guess a lesson is to allow a day or so in the embarking port before a cruise when booking flights?

 

[odysseus]

I believe the responsibility lies with the carrier for this sector (being AY), whereas QF are the ticketing agent in the case of this flight from HEL-BGO. The response you've gotten makes sense in that QF aren't responsible for that flight - they're just who you paid. From their perspective, her response that you could get a sector refund is correct, but not where you should be pushing.

As such, I'd expect that AY reticket you on an alternative, which would be more typical of a full service carrier, and being on a oneworld ticket.

Wait for their response - hopefully, they'll rebook you on the SAS option as an example. It's only if AY aren't able to resolve it for you that you'd need to rejig sectors, but then you'd be looking for goodwill from them in that it's not their or QR's issue about the AY cancellation, so will then need to renegotiate change fees and so on. Best avoided. To keep it simple, focus on the HEL-BGO connection. Any of the other options through DOH/ARN mean re-ticketing and working with other carriers, which goes back to QF instead of sitting with AY.

If AY initially decline and suggest refund, try to work positively with QF to try again with AY as that is the best way forward. However, I'd expect AY to come up with a suitable substitute as the first response.

 

[justinbrett]

I believe the responsibility lies with the carrier for this sector (being AY), whereas QF are the ticketing agent in the case of this flight from HEL-BGO. The response you've gotten makes sense in that QF aren't responsible for that flight - they're just who you paid. From their perspective, her response that you could get a sector refund is correct, but not where you should be pushing.

As such, I'd expect that AY reticket you on an alternative, which would be more typical of a full service carrier, and being on a oneworld ticket.

Wait for their response - hopefully, they'll rebook you on the SAS option as an example. It's only if AY aren't able to resolve it for you that you'd need to rejig sectors, but then you'd be looking for goodwill from them in that it's not their or QR's issue about the AY cancellation, so will then need to renegotiate change fees and so on. Best avoided. To keep it simple, focus on the HEL-BGO connection. Any of the other options through DOH/ARN mean re-ticketing and working with other carriers, which goes back to QF instead of sitting with AY.

If AY initially decline and suggest refund, try to work positively with QF to try again with AY as that is the best way forward. However, I'd expect AY to come up with a suitable substitute as the first response.

Are you sure? I think that would be the case if travel had commenced, but if this is all one one qantas ticket (081), it is Qantas’ responsibility to rebook travel. That’s why it’s QF making the calls, not AY.

I think they can offer you a new flight (which they have done) or the option for a complete refund. I don’t think they’re obliged to rebook on another carrier. That could happen if travel had already commenced, but that’s not what’s going on here.

 

[offshore171]

Always a huge risk flying in somewhere to meet a cruise on the same day. One misconnect, mechanical or WX delay and you’re cactus.

I’d try to get that flight into Bergen a day earlier.

 

[Daver6]

I've had a quick look this morning. If QF release a couple of J seats on QF9, I could get to LHR very early on the Tues morning getting me to HEL in time to make the flight to BGO the day before.

So if this is QF's issue to deal with then I would hope they would release those J seats. If this is an AY problem then I'd hope they'd pay for the SAS J seats.

I'm sure each will handball to the other though. I'll be nice to QF and see what can be done.

Any thoughts on whether travel insurance might stump up here for the paid SAS flights from HEL?

 

[opusman]

Any thoughts on whether travel insurance might stump up here for the paid SAS flights from HEL?

Probably not. This would come under "travel inconvenience cover" which will reimburse you for hotels, meals and essential items due to flight delay or cancellation. It won't reimburse you for rebooking expenses unfortunately.

 

[There'sOnlyOneJimmy]

Any thoughts on whether travel insurance might stump up here for the paid SAS flights from HEL?

It’ll depend on the policy wording of course, but this extract from my current CBA Credit Card free cover seems to suggest that it *might* respond to your circumstances:

 

[opusman]

Hmm, the Amex policy does have a "Special Event" clause too (and in fact will pay $5k for alternative travel arrangements). Question is, does a cruise qualify?

Special Event means a wedding, funeral, pre-paid conference, pre-paid sporting event or pre-paid concert or other event which does not ordinarily occur on a regular basis.

Guess it wouldn't hurt to try!

 

[There'sOnlyOneJimmy]

As always, it depends on the wording...
In the CBA policy I quoted, it specifically includes “prepaid travel/tour arrangements”.
Unfortunately it looks like your Amex policy does not (sad face), unless you can successfully argue that a cruise comes under the definition of “pre-paid ... other event”.

 

[sudoer]

@Daver6 How frequently does this specific cruise itinerary run?

I think you have a strong argument that it is an event which does not ordinarily occur on a regular basis.

 

[JohnM]

My understanding is that @Daver6 is going on the Hurtigruten round-trip voyage. It operates regularly at high frequency up and down the Norwegian coast - more like a ferry than a one-off cruise.

 

[Daver6]

Could argue that I select this specific ship (which to some extent I did). So the next time this ship runs is something like 12 days later.

I've not had a chance to follow this up with Qantas yet. I should have a chance tomorrow though.

Thanks to all with the suggestions. Truly appreciate this community.

Edit: More to the point, non-refundable deposit has already been paid for this date.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

I think if the flight is cancelled there's not a lot QF can do. They can't reaccommodate you on their own metal. This situation wouldn't be covered by EU261 (all you'd be entitled to this far out is a refund), so by extrapolation I'm not sure if there is any obligation to get you to your final destination. They can certainly help you to find alternative award seating, but that might be about it.

 

[Cafe Specific]

QF are probably pushing it to AY trying to see if they can come up with an alternative routing, but we all know there isn't one and it isn't AY's problem- they'll only get paid when their coupon is uplifted. You can take a QR flight from DOH to OSL/CPH/ARN and then buy a separate SAS ticket to BGO- check which flights give you time to meet the ship. QF have their own constraints- they can only rebook you within oneworld availability parameters.

 

[Daver6]

I spoke to QF on Tuesday morning. They hadn't heard back from AY yet (they emailed on Sunday). I was told they should hear back that evening. Due to life/work getting in the way I didn't get a chance to call back until this morning. Still no response from AY. Was told responses are usually within 48 hours, but to call back again on Tuesday.

Waiting game continues...

 

[Daver6]

Doing a little research, if I can get onto QF9 I then see the following availability



30 minutes in ARN seems rather tight, even though BA and AY flights are both from terminal 2. Is this even possible?

If I missed the connection there is another AY flight after (no award J availability) that gets into HEL at 3pm giving a more comfortable 50 minute connection time. I'd imagine if the I did miss the 11:15am flight they'd accommodate us on the following (hopefully still in J). Thoughts?

 

[MEL_Traveller]

If you could route via London there is the option of a paid fare to get to BGO - AUD170. Would only take 4 hours rather than the 8+ hours of trying to do it on an award.

Have you looked at other availablility from DOH? To CPH, OSL etc etc. From there you could take a paid option to BGO, again in the $160 range.

 

[Daver6]

If you could route via London there is the option of a paid fare to get to BGO - AUD170. Would only take 4 hours rather than the 8+ hours of trying to do it on an award.

Have you looked at other availablility from DOH? To CPH, OSL etc etc. From there you could take a paid option to BGO, again in the $160 range.

I've considered it that's always the very last fall back position should everything else collapse in a heap. The extra travel times doesn't bother me. I'm either going to be sitting on a plan or sitting around somewhere waiting for either a flight or a cruise.

 

[justinbrett]

It is a legal connection. So the carrier would be responsible.